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I don't confuse book learning with intelligence, they go well together, are not mutually exclusive by any means but nor are they interdependent. I have to say I love the quality of the discussions on here, a mixture of well thought out comments along with some funny cheeky ones. I won't agree with every post I read, but they all add to my overall perspective, I don't discount views I don't agree with. Also I don't expect people to agree with my thoughts either, and don't take any offense whatsoever. I like to be challenged. I don't believe in I.Q. tests due to the various inherent biases in them, I have met many people I consider quite intelligent who do poorly in these tests. I wish we could develop a test that measured a persons depth of reason.

Rugglesby 8 Jan 31
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18 comments

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1

My mother was book smart, skipped about three grades grades before she went to college. One day i asked her why she was so smart, she said because i read so much. As i got older i would tell her about articles or seminars I've read or saw. Before I could even finish she would tell me you believe everything you read. I could not ever have a discussion with her about anything.

Sounds like my mother, we had that discussion yesterday. Sadly in my case my mother is not that smart, but believes she is.

2

I've managed to get a job in an academic institution where I work along colleagues who nearly all have doctorates, yet I didn't even go to university 🙂

2

I know something about some things.... I'm still learning in here though... don't rate me yet.

3

@Rugglesby how did you fare on Professor Cippolla's laws of Human Stupidity?

[qz.com]

Thanking you, I am putting that on FB.

@Rugglesby Ah but you are not sharing which quadrants you classify with? 😀

@FrayedBear Probably 25% to the right of centre and 80% up from the base line. I have always said stupid people are far more dangerous than bad people.

That was great!. Thanks.

@silverotter11 thanks for the feedback.

3

Shallow water rarely understands that still water runs deep.

3

This is in response to the original post and the comments.
Be very careful. All of us are 'stupid' in various aspects of our lives. There are many different kinds of intelligence and one of the first to thoroughly explore this was Howard Gardner in his book (yeah I know more 'book learning' ) 'Frames of Mind: The Theory of Multiple Intelligences' . I know we elevate one kind of intelligence in our culture (think 'Jeopardy! ' ) but just because someone doesn't have very well-developed emotional intelligence means that they're stupid/incompetent in other aspects of their lives. Just like @Rudy1962 I had a change of vocation late in life. I participated in a bus mechanic apprentice program at my company when I was 49 and finished when 51. I discovered how my new job wasn't just different but required a different way of thinking or, if you prefer, developing a different kind of intelligence. I'm used to being one of, if not THE, smartest guys in the room and it was, and still is, a very humbling experience even though I have improved. There is a VERY strong strain of anti-intellectualism in this thread just as there is in this country and remember how much Dawkins and Hitchens are intellectual 'book learners'. How's about we all make a deal and don't denigrate anyone else just because some of us don't measure up in some aspects of our lives.

I recall reading a long time ago that the man rated as having the highest intelligence in the U.K. in the annual MENSA UK test was a London double deck bus driver.
For those interested in MENSA: www.mensa.org

@FrayedBear Maybe because he liked it

@btroje Exactly. In his day the driver was in a cab separate from the passengers. Fares were collected by a conductor inside the bus. The driver was presumably avoiding all those stupid people.

2

A person is born -or not- intelligent. Book learning is acquired.....but intelligence is necessary to acquire knowledge.
Get a person with an IQ of 40 and he / she won't to be able to understand a grammar school book.
No, intelligence and book-learning are not the same and those who negate this truth need a shrink.

5

My friend is an aerospace engineer with a mind boggling IQ, but has married twice on first dates

Very interesting, indeed.

@ScienceBiker "can't boil an egg if you put the water in the pan on a lit stove for him" type?

3

I don't fully disagree with IQ tests. We can think of many reasons they could be biased, but on the note, there have been IQ tests made and distribute which have tried to accommodate for these in many respects. I myself have never taken an IQ test, and I might never. I have no idea how I would do, but I will say I know plenty of people who say they score high (even Mensa levels) but I highly question their ability to reason about many topics.

I think you could easily make the reason test, and I'm sure people have tried. It could be as easy as assessing various arguments made by politicians and philosophical thinkers. For instance, "It's freezing and snowing in New York -- we need global warming,"- by Donald Trump. People should be able to identify the conclusion, the argument, and the relationship between the two. If they could, I doubt this guy would be president.

@ScienceBiker I have 4 IQ tests sitting on my book shelf that I bought 3 years ago. A friend and I bought them, but we never bothered to take them.

138 is pretty smart. It's 38 points above the average of people who bother to take IQ tests.

I have a best friend that I always get into arguments about on who is smarter. His argument is he is smart because he makes a good amount of money, is locally well-known as a tattoo artist and can intuit certain, even philosophical, things. I say I'm smart because I've studied science and epistemology, have read books by great thinkers, and trust academic experts as a group. I think we're both smart in that we recognize that smart is in many ways a natural demonstration of what you spend most of your time doing.

3

Or a test for common sense. I've known many people who scored well on iq tests but didn't know enough to come out of the rain. An all inclusive test would be nice to show where you draw your intelligence from, and questions on street smarts thrown in also!

You mean like this guy?!!!!!!!

1

I am glad you said that about books because at the moment I do not read any books because it might disturb the flow of my hopefully original thoughts. Like why you say about people too. I think your post should be in lights at the top of this site or used some way in its advertising.Thanks.

1

I have never thought that I am smarter than anyone else. I just think differently. In fact I am sometimes, with good reason thought of as an idiot by people who don't know me.For example:
I will be thinking about the actual ingredients of just what may be in the meat of hamburger and soda, what chemicals are actually in them? How do those chemicals react with us biologically?What is their actual nutritional value? Could we more cheaply and efficiently make better ingredients and if so how would that affect the world population and economy? Meanwhile, the poor girl at the McDonalds cash register is stuck looking at the idiot with the deer in the headlights look!

I was forced to go to some conference once, was very boring, and all through the main lecture, all I could think about was what he shape of the main speakers brain would be, she had a very long pointed head.

1

I most respect life-learners, they just get better with time... The relevance of a degree fades, and they can be so specific. I’m pleased not to find the overly academic flaunting their familiarity with authors I’ll never read around here… Used to attend Atheist meetings where we’d sit though some hardly comprehensible painfully academic lecture that made you regret showing up.. Love that ‘firebrand Atheism,’ though! 😉 It’s a great mix here, and folks have been very (very) tolerant ..of my reckless habit of calling it as I see it..

Varn Level 8 Jan 31, 2018
5

I also love the quality of discussion here, and the wisdom in this post. I have a Master's Degree and had been in my line of work for many years, when I was put in a position where I had to work in a factory. At the job we had to tear down the machinery and put it back together when we cleaned "the line". I have never been mechanical and felt like the stupidest person in the place, and the only one with a degree. I had a friend in college who probably would have scored in the "MENSA range" on an IQ test. However, he was the most miserable son of a bitch I knew, and his social skills were next to none. My children outsmart me everyday. There are many types of intelligence.

5

Intelligence and higher education (fancy book learnin' to Trump supporters) are certainly not the same thing, but I'm sure there's a strong correlation between them. Ultimately, an argument must stand or fall on its merits and not who is putting it forward and what their educational background may be, but you can generally count on a much better position being espoused by someone with expertise.

Yuppers. That there fancy book learnin ain't gonna make Merica great again.

7

I'm dyslexic and hated school but I consider myself inteligent

ditto

your right @VictoriaNotes and the teachers concentrate on the top students and just put up with the rest.

yes clever on paper but really dumb

1

Majoring in philosophy or ethics tends to get people no where, but I’m thinking about taking some classes for my self interest. People forget that learning is not something you do strictly for work, everyone seems to want just the paper.

Since Formal Logic is a branch of Philosophy which I think should be mandatory in High School (they used to teach it in Italy) I'd have to disagree . But learning for the sake of learning I'm all for.

Learning for the sake of learning and lifelong learning are both 2 of the best activities anyone can do whether in a class or on your own. Studying logic, ethics and critical thinking and then applying those lessons to our lives would make our world a much better place. It might've prevented the orange-hued shitstorm we are currently weathering. @Kimba

@Kimba at least here in the US, most everyone is focused on specializing and making money.

3

My mum says her most intelligent son is the one without a degree. Me

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