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I was thinking about how I had tried to explain Marx's Theory of Surplus Value to someone once when it occurred to me - the starting point of Marx and communism in general is the absolute opposite of market theory. Market theory starts with price, i.e. what a capitalist can change for something. Marxist theory, as outlined in Capital, starts with the idea of value, or what you should pay for something. Communism (Marxist version, theoretical, not any totalitarian realization) starts by asking what the consumer should pay and goes from there (Capital). Capitalism starts by asking how much a producer can charge.
Anyway, just an observation.

towkneed 7 June 23
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Before anyone starts thinking about Marxism and Communism in theory and practice, a person needs to read Milovan jilas's THE NEW CLASS. Djilas was a leading communist in Yugoslavia and served as the vice president under Tito. But he grew to see that Communism in theory had fatal errors which would inevitably keep it from achieving its purported ends in practice. Instead, it would inevitably result in the creation of a new class of dictatorial ideological elites which would never voluntarily relinquish control.
The book is the best analysis of Communism ever written. For writing the book, the Yugoslav communist ideological elite sentence Djilas to 20 years in prison.

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The trouble with these purist theories occurs when the human factor is added. We can't let the ideologies have a go but instead also add central banks and their policies/ agendas, protectionism, tariffs, subsidies, sanctions etc. A lot of external factors make it hard to set ideological values for goods and services.

puff Level 8 June 24, 2022
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It would be ideal if things cost what was reasonably affordable rather than the most the market could be expected to bring. It could be done if the will was there. I think people are more important than money and I think it's unconscionable that there are about 800 billionaires and more than 20 million millionaires in a country where people are dying from poverty.

Why do you think Americans are so opposed to Communism?

I think Americans are opposed for the same reasons I am, that individual ingenuity or "get up and go" is not rewarded, defaulting for the common good.
That is pure communism but the surviving communist countries do allow private enterprise and home ownership, the ability to improve your circumstance on your own merits, which is really more capitalist socialist.
Undemocratic centralist control does not appeal either.
It is sad that since my childhood the middle class had also been shredded here with a few filthy rich and lots more poorer in Australia now as well.

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