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If this whole impeachment inquiry works it will set the precedent that no president will ever be able to investigate any person of the other party because it will be said they are just trying to attack a political opponent. All the witnesses admit the Biden situation deserves an investigation but because Trump is a republican he isn't allowed to pursue that investigation if u listen to the democrats. Now if Trump had actually told the Ukrainians that they had to do this in order to get aid I could agree with this inquiry but even the Ukrainians have said they weren't pressured in to anything and no one at all can show when and where Trump actually made a quid pro quo but instead have used their presumptions to establish that Trump had a quid pro quo in mind and the truth is, even if he had that idea in mind, it isn't a crime until he actually gives the demand to the Ukrainians. Sondland is the only one to actually speak with Trump about it and he said Trump didn't want a quid pro quo but at the same time Sondland presumed Trump wanted a quid pro quo so it must be a quid pro quo to democrats.

This has nothing to do with liking or hating Trump, it is just the basic fact of the case. I know many might not like the facts but that's what is needed to get an impeachment. The fact that many lefties just say I'm a Trump lover and get all emotional about this is mind boggling. Honest actors looking at the facts without a bias can see what I'm saying. The fact that I'm attacked personally instead of my argument being proven wrong shoes just how weak of a case the democrats have. Impeachment doesn't happen just because orange man bad and some people assume things that never happened. If the democrats really wanted to impeach the emoluments clause would have been used years ago. Just goes to show this is all just theater where the democrats know Trump won't be removed and their donors wants will continue while they get to campaign on how tough they are and how they tried to impeach but the mean repubs in the Senate let him off.

Meanwhile, nothing that the people actually need fixed is getting done or even discussed because of the faux impeachment garbage. The democrats have their own Benghazi now and it has exposed just how much the left and right have the same kind of tribal supporters that only see us Vs them and the "them" are held to standards that the "us" are allowed to disregard at every turn. This impeachment itself proves it because Biden did the very thing Trump is accused of and both sides can only see the crime when looking at the "them" case. When looking at their own it somehow becomes a totally different thing even tho both are alleged to withhold aid until demands were met.

jorj 8 Dec 4

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People seem to attach a person's seeking of the truth or evidence to supporting a party or side. If you support the truth that might benefit one side, the other side says you're supporting that side instead of the truth. It's ridiculous. They also interpret things in a way that supports their own bias and then claim that it's the truth.

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It is my understanding that any president can legally investigate a political opponent provided he/she doesn't abuse their office by using the powers of their office for any investigation for personal political gain. They must investigate as any private citizen would. They absolutely must not ask any foreign government to get involved in the investigation of get involved our democratic processes!

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Read the Mueler report. obstruction of justice. unfit for office.

Leetx Level 7 Dec 4, 2019
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Trump specifically threatened to (and did) withhold money earmarked by Congress unless the Ukraine announced an investigation into his political rival. Your premise that it would “set the precedent that no president will ever be able to investigate any person if the other party” is false, as it omits the quid pro quo.

Bobbyzen Level 8 Dec 4, 2019

@jorj So you read the transcript of the July 25th phone call and you do not believe Trump 1) Reminds Zelenskyy that the U.S. "does a lot for the Ukraine"; 2) Reiterates our "generosity" and lays the groundwork for a quid pro quo: "the United States has been very ·very good to Ukraine. I wouldn't say that it's reciprocal necessarily". Then 3) directly asks Zelenskyy "I would like you to do us a favor though...". Then rambles about Mueller and that leads to "The other thing,There's a lot of. talk about Biden's son,. that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you ·can look into it ... It sounds horrible to me." I've pulled quotes from the transcript of the call, but you can read it all in the attached pdf: [whitehouse.gov]

And of course, the Trump administration actually DID withhold money after the call, money earmarked by congress to help the Ukraine deter Russia's years-long effort to take over its resources. And then not coincidentally, released the money after Trump received news of the whistleblower. [theguardian.com]

I'm not sure what else you're looking for. You want words from Trump that say "Investigate Biden or I'll withhold funds"? Even he isn't that stupid.

@jorj Don’t forget, The House is working without the executive branch’s cooperation: Witnesses involved in this affair, who could provide more evidence, are ignoring House subpoenas.

“Beyond a reasonable doubt” is for the Senate to decide in its impeachment proceedings. Not in the House hearings or filings. The case is clear to me based on the phone call transcript. Republicans argue otherwise. The Senate likely will exonerate along Party lines, and future presidents will be more emboldened to act outside of Congressional oversight, in their own (or in their corporate donors&rsquo😉 bests interests.

@jorj all good points.

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