A sound and well reasoned response, in my opinion. I consider that education should be entirely factual; religious belief is a personal choice and has no place in the classroom, except perhaps for its historical perspective. Additionally, I believe that all charities and churches should be taxed on income/donations not directly used for charitable distribution; what they spend on themselves- taxable.

I agree!

That's why a baker went to court for the right to discriminate!

The only time different beliefs remain at peace is when something else is happening that makes those people forget their faiths.

Sporting events are about SPORT, not about faith.

Elections are about POLITICS, not about faith.

But the moment faith becomes 'the issue' that changes.

@Matias Look at the reformation period in Europe. I lived in Heidelberg Germany, 15 years. In 1690's the French Catholics (led by a German) laid siege to the city and flattened it including the house I lived. I have a degree in European History (in reality religious history). There was never peace between different religions. They always broke into warfare. Read some books about Galleys and the wars they fought in! Read about taking enemy soldiers (from another religion), flaying the skin off of them and stuffing them into canons and firing the bodies to the opposing troops as a warning!!! This is what religion can and has done.

And yet one of the fundamental concepts of religion is that it is 'faith equates to virtue' - and a direct corrolary of this is that LACK of (the correct) faith equates to lack of virtue.

One of the principle foundations of religion is 'they' (those who do not believe) are inferior to us (who do).

Admittedly there are OTHER sources of division among people - race, culture, social status, and so on - but religion is most certainly such a divisive ellement.

Then you have the secondary concept of 'religious morallity' where those of faith judge and condemn others for not meeting the moral standards dictated by their own faith - christians encamping themselves outside abortion clinics, for example, to intimidate those who use them. Or declaring homosexuals unacceptable because of the words in their holy book.

Again, not all people who judge and condemn are religious, but you cannot claim there is no religious judgement or bigotry/persecution.

Where there is religion there is a source of division, a source (and justification) of judgement. One of the cornerstones of religion is 'we' (the believers) are moral and virtuous while 'they' (those who don't believe) are not - that 'we' have the divine right to judge 'them' and dictate how they should live their lives.

Religion does, I fear, encourage and justify bigottry, intollerance and judgementalism in society - divisive characteristics that cause harm to society and result in aggression and violence.

So don't try and tell me that the different faiths in the Roman empire lived in peace. They didn't. There was religion-induced aggression, intollerance and violence in ancient Rome, just as there has been in every other society where different religions saw each other as 'those who don't worship the true and proper god'.

Religion doesn't have to mean large scale war to be divisive - though religion has certainly caused that during history - a thousand lesser conflicts is still a lack of peace between faiths.

I couldn't have said it better

One of the extremist religionist beliefs is that they have the truth and they must determine what others believe. We may not change this but we must maintain our rights to believe what we will and must be prepared to fight to do so.

@JackPedigo

I'll fight for the right to not have a religion/belief system forced on me but I will not force mine on anyone.

@LeighShelton

Thank you, kind sir.

@Betty its true so thank you x

And what if their belief includes pushing their dogma on others? What if their belief includes discrimination toward others as gays, transgenders, atheists, minority groups and generally people who don't think as they? What if their belief is about arming as many people as possible? In this country and even in Canada one has the right to believe what one wants but one does not have the right to push their beliefs on others. It's not about us telling others what to do but standing up to those who try to bully others. I don't think Canada understands what is going on here between tRump and the Christian right (wrong). We are in serious danger of losing our religious freedoms.

@JackPedigo

In my opinion, religion and politics are about power and control that serves greed. To stand up and fight against oppression is a worthy endeavor and we should demand of our politicians that they listen. The problem as I see it is, if we can't give the politicians something they want to replace their alliance with religion then we have a losing battle.

@Betty So the solution is to give up! The politicians need us as much as we need them. Policies have been changed with push back from the voters. In the end it is about access to resources. The supply is limited but the demand keeps on climbing. The religionists and other groups want to gain as much of these resources as they can. They are willing to fight, torture and kill for what they want. There has been more than ample proof throughout all of history. tRump is already giving you guys more and more a reason to fight the oppressors (US government backed up by the right (wrong) wing religionists).

@JackPedigo

Policies will not change until people get involved. An individual can make demands but will not be heard. There are fractures in society, too many special interest groups with no unity among them. With so many agendas and power plays just getting organized would be a monumental task.

I mostly agree but with some caveats. Often people escape religion with the help from others. I left but remained opened to some of it's ideas. my late partner, a lifelong atheist from Iran opened my eyes (and I did hers in regards to being a vegetarian).

Yes, there are special interest groups the the focus word is "special". Some groups especially the environmental and, yes even the secular ones I see as "general" interest. They apply to all which includes non-humans. It is these groups that need to be identified and supported.

@JackPedigo

I agree with what you say. The people who escape religion are ready to escape and help then is appreciated and needed. It is not possible to convince someone to listen when they do not want to hear.

Special interest groups should be pooling their resources to focus their message. With so many special interest groups shouting for attention, it is too easy for politicians to pick and choose who they would like to affiliate themselves with. The groups could share their resources and with a more cohesive message that would force politicians to pay attention and provide reasonable solutions instead of using a particular group to further their own agenda.

Eg. Equal rights; Black Lives Matter; Pay equity for women; Me Too; Gun Control; Mental Health; Planned Parenthood; and LBGTQ. They all overlap and could work together as one large special interest group and be more effective and a benefit to the general public.

@Betty Yes, I understand. However, I maintain some groups as the Nature Conservancy, Family Planning groups or any organization whose end goal is protecting and preserving the life support system under which all life exists is not a special interest group but a general interest group. Why are all groups lumped under the heading "special" interest?

@JackPedigo

They lobby the government for funding for specific needs of their group. Too many small groups that make it easier for government to dismiss them. It should be one big group for the preservation of life that address all the issues. The government would find it very difficult to ignore.

@Betty I partly agree. Strength can be found in like-minded groups joining forces. Some like FFRF and the Humanists are together on some issue but they have different missions and so are separate. Kind of like General Motors and the military.

You live in a fairly tolerant country. Here, the fanatic religionists are slowly taking over. This is not Europe.

YES! Whenever you have the fundies coming out from under their bibbles to wage war against non-believers, you have potential for another one of their ''holy wars.'' (This gains heavenly brownie points for them....and kills millions of innocent non-believers.) I sincerely believe it's what's behind their efforts to kick up dust in the middle=east.

@LucyLoohoo I heard a report that many Christian churches have taken up donations to help Jews resettle in Israel. This is to foment a war with the native Palestinians to fulfill prophesy to bring on the end times!!!

@JackPedigo And, I believe that, Jack! All this terrorism from fundamental Muslims merely adds fuel to those fires...possibly deliberately, since Muslims, too, are very familiar with religious wars. Die in that battle and you have the EXPRESS BUS to paradise. (Not to mention the virgins.)

Wow, powerful post, thanks so much. Grateful for people like you and your former partner.

@LucyLoohoo I made a posting some time ago that showed the waiting virgins were armed Catholic nuns.

I so agree. I'm hoping the revolution in neuroscience and evolutionary psychology will trickle down to many So far this does seem to be happening, albeit slowly.

Thanks for agreeing with me....@IrishGypsy

I think we are entitled to our own beliefs. What is urgently needed are the platform where people can express them.

Unfortunately, we have been forced to become a movement. A movement of self-preservation.