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Wasn't sure where to post this, so I figured I would post it here. This is a quote that's opened my eyes to a lot.

"People Live their Lives bound by what they accept as correct and true. That is how they define "Reality" . But what does it mean to be "correct" or "true"? They are merely vague concepts... Their "Reality" may all be a mirage. Can we consider them to be simply living in their own world, shaped by their beliefs?" Itachi from Naruto

By LadyStardust96
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13 comments
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Sweet quote. I've watched Naruto a few times, but couldn't get into it. Last Airbender was badass, imo.

ElementX74 Level 4 Oct 21, 2017
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When does he say this again?

Sarcasm Level 6 Oct 14, 2017
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we live based upon the event that have happened in our past, which mould our future actions.
True or Correct have nothing to do with it.

DanielEarley Level 1 Oct 12, 2017
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Itachi answered his own question with: "Everyone lives within their own subjective imagination." . . .I'm so thankful I've got an 18-year old son.

SonnyMlaPH Level 7 Oct 12, 2017
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LOL how funny! And I pretty much agree with his answer
LadyStardust96: it was my 18-year old son who gave the answer
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I think we all live in our own worlds shaped by what we believe.

SamL Level 6 Oct 12, 2017
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I also think there's a bit of a feedback loop: Beliefs congeal based on formative experience. They affect our perceptions of the world; however, once in a while, information gets in that nudges our beliefs in a new direction, or even shatters them. this, in turn alters our perception, and so on...
I agree with you and SveedishChef
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That's exactly what the christians are doing living in a mirage. When a older Christain tells me about slowing down to enjoy life they are always annoyed when I reply: Yes we definitely need to enjoy life because when we die it's over.

Harleyman Level 5 Oct 12, 2017
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Ya I think what I do with my life has drastically changed since leaving Christianity. I always thought there was an after life so it wasn't a big deal. But now since I don't think there is one (at least as far as what we will ever know) I value life a lot more and aim to live better because of it.
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I like this Quote. Honestly don't remember this from Naruto, but thats not saying much. thanks for posting this.

richdust Level 3 Oct 12, 2017
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I have long lived by the idea that what I believe is true is only true until it is challenged by a new idea as I gather new information. Upon getting new information that makes me rethink my previous beliefs means that I must re-evaluate based on this new information. If I find the new information credible, then I MUST give up the old (no longer true) belief and embrace the new one. This is how I learn and grow. If the new information doesn't stand up to my current belief (after doing research and evaluation), then I cast it aside, hold onto my current belief and keep going forward until the next challenge.

I have been told that this is just being wishy washy. I disagree. To me, this is how I learn and grow. I evaluate as I get new information and determine whether to accept it as my new norm or not. I have also been told that such people can sound quite ignorant when talking of their current belief when others have already embraced the new information. That's fine. They just heard it before I did. If they feel I am wrong in my evaluation and current belief, I want to hear their explanation, their proof so I can use that information to re-evaluate. I don't see that as stupid. I see that as rational, critical thinking and I relish and embrace it. I am always looking to learn and that didn't stop when I finished college. I read a lot of non-fiction for that very reason.

KLMFTFW Level 5 Oct 12, 2017
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I call that wisdom.
Well thought out response, KLM; what I'd have said if I could have articulated it as nicely as you did.
Thank you both. I do try and I suspect I a quite a bit older than you are so I have had a longer time to learn.
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Although it often takes a decade or two or three for all the relevant primary sources to emerge, historians end up with the closest thing to a "God's eye" view of human interactions. By this I mean that after a period of time has elapsed, the various and sundry human perspectives on an event or development can be cross-checked against one another and against measurable data. When this is done professionally under the watchful eye of peer review as a corrective, historians begin to approach the "truth" asymptotically (= continually closer but never fully reaching it) and usually eventually come to a consensus on most (not all) salient points, some of which were once controversial but are no longer in dispute.

My point here is that any individual person's Reality might be a mirage insofar as it is sharply divorced from a future (as yet unreached) reality consensus, but reality unquestionably exists and can be approximated, albeit well after the fact, through historical inquiry into and comparison of all relevant primary sources from all sides.

vertrauen Level 5 Oct 11, 2017
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I really enjoyed your response although I might have to read it over once or twice to fully understand (we are getting into philosophy stuff so it gets a bit more complicated)
Kinda difficult for me to merge mirage with reality. I take your point to mean that it sure is real when it has already happened, and I agree with that.

I also believe that what is happening now is reality.

The future is still an illusion until you get there and find out, so, it's after the fact. Just like saying that if future plans miscarry they'll be just an illusion, just a mirage.
Clarification: "a future (as yet unreached) reality consensus" - the word "future" was intended to describe "consensus," not "reality." In other words, "a future (as yet unreached) consensus about the current reality" - which is to say, the Reality of a given person *now* may be a mirage insofar as it turns out to be sharply divorced from what historians later determine was the *actual* reality at the time (via professional consensus). Perhaps this sounds roundabout - since it is often possible to demonstrate that a given person is divorced from reality at the *time.* However, given the current political climate in the US of "alternative facts" and "science denial," it is much harder now for the *current* population to dispel each other's mirages. I was responding to what sounded like "reality relativism" in Itachi's quotation, I.e., "everyone has their own reality," and I was stating in response that *eventually* we will have a pretty good idea what objective reality *was*, even if we can't currently agree what it now *is.*
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I think it’s imperative that humans deploy the scientific method in their thinking so that they’re not bound to what they accept as true.
The scientific method is self correcting should new evidence present itself.
How humble and awesome is that?

AMGT Level 5 Oct 11, 2017
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Agreed
In order to validate perceived reality, evidence is everything for determining the tentative truth.
"There will be poor always, pathetically struggling . . . " from a song written by Tim Rice.
Indeed, Sonny. Jesus in the rock opera "Jesus Christ Superstar."
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I've never heard of Itachi but I like the quote, and I see how it could have influenced you. It's something that I need to think about because it leaves reality and truth to be personal and subjective, as it moves you to question the clarity of what you think you know. The reality you accept, I agree it can and often is a personal construct but truth as being that same thing takes faith if you are saying, the truth is in the mind of the beholder. At least I think it does.

paul1967 Level 7 Oct 11, 2017
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Very true. When I first head it I interpreted as more of we all have our own realities and who's to say who's is right. But since I've taken Ethics and Philosophy it's changed since that theory doesn't really work. I can't think of the theory on the top of my head that it resembles though.
When I find myself struggling with a subject, I'll set it aside, saying I don't know, and I'll leave it that way until I gain more insight and I feel like tackling it again. Most of the subjects I feel most confident of were approached this way. People think I'm giving up, but I never give up. Not knowing isn't the same as giving up.
I agree that truth is in the mind of the beholder.

And this, to me, is also true and as real as it can get:

"We share the same biology regardless of ideology." - Gordon Matthew Thomas Sumner
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I guess being correct and true is a matter of one's moral beliefs and where they get them from.
For instance, a Christian believes they get their morals from god (or the Bible) objectively and that their god cannot be wrong.
On the other hand, there are those that don't believe that, but that we as societies have decided what works best for us and make laws and rules that we can abide by.

As far as reality, we can only live in the reality that we can observe and interact with, we have no choice until other realities are presented to us or we can somehow temporarily alter it.

Paul628 Level 5 Oct 11, 2017
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Yep funny how those realities change drastically over time too
. . . and that's the reality of it all, plain and simple and in real layman's language. Thank you.
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