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Advice request: Today I Received "More than a Carpenter" byJosh Mcdowell through the post. I did not request this book (I fear my family want me saved). So far I'm only up to chapter 6. This book should be titled "proving the bible using the bible because the bible says prove the bible using the bible, bible, bible I was hurt but Jesus loves me". The letter that came with this book claims my father's in hell for not "coming to Jesus". I feel sorry for the author of this letter if this Is a genuine concern. For the first time in a long time, I'm baffled as to what my response should be. Any hints or tips? Anybody been there done it, Bought the t-shirt, washed the t-shirt, worn the t-shirt lost the t-shirt, found it again and lived happily ever after with the t-shirt?

Dav87 6 Jan 25
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15 comments

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1

I politely decline all religious books, and if I were to receive one in the mail I'd simply toss in in the trash.
Even before I'd left the church, whenever someone tried to get me to read a religious book or watch a religious movie, I'd actually tell them that Christian books are mostly religious propaganda, and almost always poorly written.
Ditto for the Christian movies.
The exception might be C.S. Lewis' Narnia series, but they can be enjoyed without the religious angle. Besides, C.S. Lewis' secular book..Till We Have Faces, is non-religious, and considered his best work. It's a GREAT read, by the way-a retelling of the Pyche and Cupid story, from the perspective of the ugly older sister.

1

I would read it if you feel inclined, just to see the drivel that passes for apologetics. But don't do a whole refutation with research and hyperlinks, with the intent of sending it back. Whoever sent that to you will not read any refutation or book that you send them, most likely they haven't even read the book they sent you. Been to that rodeo several times. I no longer accept homework assignments from well meaning people, because 9 out of 10 times they are not sincere about a exchange of ideas and search for truth, and I already know their bible and their apologetics better than they do.

I'll be totally honest, I doubt they've read the book they've sent me. I'd like to think they were intelligent enough to see the gaping holes in this book.

1

Find out who sent it just so you can tell them you asked Jesus and he said it was okay to be an atheist

1

You have one life....do not waste precious hours on drivel......

1

I'm not so nice when it comes to people wanting to force me to change or do something on such a personal level. If someone talked about one of my parents or family like that I would see red. Someone suggested a big red F on the paper. I would put a big red FUCK OFF!!! on the paper lol

2

I think your explanation of the title was excellent. Being that you do not know who sent it, it is not necessary to have a response. Personally, I love to critique authors. That is why I loved your explanation of the title.

1

Ahhh can't say I have, you should read it with a red pen and point out all the typos, inconsistent sentences, poor grammar, poorly crafted reasoning.
Then return to sender with a big fat F circled in red on the letter..

Did I have you as a teacher? Definitely had someone with that attitude and technique! I'll be honest, I've been going through it with a highlighter and making notes.

@Dav87 happy I could help..and no I wasn't..lol

1

It's curious that this person wasn't brave enough to own up to sending the book. How will they ever get bonus points from Jesus when they save your heathen soul?
If the book is from Amazon, perhaps you can return it and get something you could actually use.

dkp93 Level 8 Jan 25, 2018

Its clear who it is from, I'm not one to start listing names online on a public forum on a small planet. I would love to swap this book for a copy of anything by Jim al-khalili. Sadly that's not an option!

@Dav87 Ah, apologies. I was under the impression it was an anonymous gift.

1

I believe you should Stop Reading it Immediately! You don't need to read words about some "god" who damns people to Constant pain and anguish Just Because They Refused to Believe in Him. Bullshit. What sort of arrogant ass god is this anyway?? You refuse to believe me, therefore, No dice, you get hell? That, again, is bullshit. I would simply stick that peice of trash into the can it belongs in. Its so tacky that you shouldn't even pass it on to a friend. And what sort of religious bully friends and family are those, who take it upon themselves to guilt you? Sure, they say it under the guise of saving your soul, but what if you do not feel your soul requires any saving? What makes their rights to pick on you better than your rights to be left alone? Its a selfish side to take on the part of the "Book Senders" because they Always take the liberty Themselves to try to Fix you. Well fuck that, You are NOT BROKEN, my friend. You are a wonderful human being. You deserve to be Respected the way you are and what is being done to you is not only unfair, but unreasonable too boot. You have a right to be irritated and to be put off by all of this. I say purge yourself of that dogma, and do it fast. Don't read it. Unless you are looking for moot point Ammo because gods children hear Nothing other than their own heads rattling. You cannot find a lesson to share when those are the types above you, doing this To You. Rather than play along, I'd dump it and next time any dumb ass sends you yet another book, dump that fucker too. As a matter of fact, just send me a list of address of the ones you suspect and I WILL SEND THEM some Books from the United States and I will even make the packages appear quite appealing so they WANT to open it. Then, boom, agnostic and atheist books! WOO HOO!

You see, two assholes can play at this game, friend. 😉

Sadoi Level 7 Jan 25, 2018

Oh no, I feel honour bound to read it. I have to be able to stand criticism and have my beliefs and knowledge tested, plus like you say, what better ammunition should I require it. If this is the best these guys have to offer they're not going to be converting me any time soon. It would be odd not to respond to this I'm just unsure of what line to take. I could easily be angry but I'm just not, I care deeply for my family and part of me wants to free him of his belief that my father's in hell (probably visiting you). Ha ha, I may send you some adresses, I'd love to see the look on his face. One of my first thoughts was to post my god delusion and god is not great to him but I want to keep them! I like those books!

@Dav87 ah-ha. i see. would this be a family member you've already made mention to me? I think he would merely destroy the books i sent. haha!! I'd still do it none-the-less, to make a point. 😉

However you wish to do it dave, i support whatever plan of attack you so choose. If you need to chat it out in the future or in private, im around. 😉 More like, let me know when you have free time, then i can wrangle some time up and we can chat. You have become a good friend to me around here and for good friends, I Make the time. I understand how it would bother you. I get it.

If you need some help brainstorming, im your gal friday! 😉 Nothing like two brains storming the gates at once, Dread Pirate Roberts! hahaha! I got you on this one.

Even if im busy, I can find some time for a friend.

@Dav87 I Say... we send them a copy of THIS:

@Dav87 aaand we follow it up with this, for closure:

2

Burn that baby!! I never advocate burning books but this is one instance where it is required. Your father isn't in hell because he's dead, and we're in hell here on earth because of stuff like that. The dead are blissfully unaware, you've had someone tap dancing on your emotions. So burn that book and roast a hot dog in the flames, and wash it down with a couple of beers. Remember the good times with your dad and sweep the ashes into the dust bin.

Oh this book couldn't convince the pope to be Catholic, but I will be making sure it never does any harm.

2

Josh McDowell? THE Josh McDowell? Wow, I'm impressed.

The very best thing you can do is take that book and toss it in the nearest trash container. The book contains nothing worth reading, and I'm surprised you've managed to get that far in it. McDowell is far from being a compelling author. The author of the letter, whomever it was, has reached the cutoff point. Then get back to your life.

Have you read it? I cannot believe it has sold as many copies, unless they've all been posted to heathens.

@Dav87 -- I gave it a try, but I have a low tolerance for circular logic and an even lower tolerance for bullshit. One of my great weakness, I guess. But I was already forewarned because I was familiar with McDowell's particular form of apologetics and later with his dipshit son. To give you a little perspective, I would rather listen to Kent Hovind than deal with Josh and/or Sean McDowell.

2

Life's too short. Put the book down and go do something more productive 🙂

2

Sounds like your first donation for the next giving season is in hand, eh?

My condolences on your dad. I am sure he is missed.

I wouldn't give this book away, not to anybody. And trust me it's not for sentimental reasons.

2

I'v heard of it. I think I may have received one once. If I did I saw that it was propaganda and got rid of it. I would throw it away the same as all the other unwanted religious solicitation I get such as the brochures people would leave me as a waitress or that show up on my doorknob occasionally.

MsAl Level 8 Jan 25, 2018
3

I've never heard of the book.

You haven't missed anything, so don't worry about it.

I wouldn't waste your time unless you were set a challenge like I have been. As @evidentialist has already said, you really won't miss out!

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