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I'm hoping that people here are more open minded than self described atheists.
after lurking & occasionally posting at an atheist site for a few months i found that most of them were engaging in group-think on almost every subject that came up. they didn't want any dissenters on any subject they all agreed on.
i don't believe in a personal god or an after life. the only thing i'm certain of is that nothing is certain.

callmedubious 8 Oct 10
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34 comments

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What Stephanie99 said.

1

Maybe they aren't involved in group think. Maybe they're just right, and you're just wrong, and you don't like that.

0

To say "I don't believe in a personal god or an after life. the only thing i'm certain of is that nothing is certain" is not a particularly controversial position.at least not on this site.

1

The only topics on which I have observed groupthink are the same ones that every other segment of society is guilty of practicing as well; mainly PC topics where any form of disagreement with mainstream view, even the semblance of disagreement, is met with open hostility and hatred. Other than that, I do not see what you're complaining about, unless you are referring to the fact that the overwhelming majority of members/commenters are skeptics, atheists, or agnostics; then, what would you expect from us on topics of religion, superstition, and the paranormal or supernatural? We are, by definition, a group of nonbelievers.

4

Evidence based thinking is pretty much the opposite of group thinking, that is, unless you have a group of evidence based thinkers together.

When looking at science, what the bulk of the research supports, and the scientific consensus of most experts, is more meaningful that a study of a lone person, especially if that person is not an expert int he field. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

0

I've suggested before that some of these atheist are just as fervent in their beliefs as the most pious folk are. Almost like their own religion. Ironic to me.

I think you're creating equivalence over the wrong aspect. A strong belief based on evidence is not comparable to a strong belief based on wishful thinking. If I passionately believe the sun will rise tomorrow, it's not ironic that I think another is foolish because they also passionately believe it won't.

@Gareth
If wishful thinking were all I might agree with you. It seems that those atheists I refer to feel as if there is no explanation for something then it just doesn't matter. There is so much we still don't understand and cannot explain. Much we likely never will. For instance, to suggest death in this lifetime is the end just because they don't believe in something else doesn't make them right about it. But they sure act as if they are right about it, just as the most pious religious folk do.

2

I am quite open-minded. I believe that sometimes 1+1=4. Hey, my opinion on this matter is just as valid as any other opinions. After all, algebra is just a theory. How do you KNOW FOR SURE that you are right?

BTW, I welcome any contrary opinions on this. I hate to be engaged in "group-think."

That kind of openmindedness Goes too far for me. Perhaps read the works of Bertrand Russel?

@Denker
I think what I was making a clumsy attempt at is called "sarcasm." 🙂

I really don't think 1+1=2 is open to opinions, nor do I believe "algebra (in this case arithmetic really) is just a theory."

@Wellspring

I agree. It was a bad joke. 🙂 Not scientifically or epistemologically accurate at all.

0

Great insightful answers to this post!

5

Group think. Sounds like someone is a little insecure. If you go into a group that shares a life defining belief rest assured they, as a "group", will hold similar views on many subjects. Tell us your views and defend them or quit sniveling.

0

Isn't christianity and all other organized religions using "group think" when it comes to their dogma or rules for their particular brand of bullshit?

it's all lies, BS & drivel b/c that's all that human beans are capable of.

@callmedubious Also they are capable of inventing devices linked to a world wide Web allowing you to voice that opinion. A bit of advance in medicine/vaccination prolonged your life past the expected 40-45 years of our ancestors on the African plains; time which I hope will be used to further your intellect.

0

I think, to answer the original post...many people will prefer to denigrate those we disagree with, and ostrisize them, rather than accept that there may be merit in an idea that we disagree with. When we have the choice to surround ourselves with the comfortable, we do, and we avoid that which makes us uncomfortable. It isn't so much group think, as it is an unwillingness to see that there may be merit in something we disagree with.

5

Of course you're welcome to share any opinions you have but if the entire group thinks your opinions lack merit, the most logical explanation is that it's because they do. (When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras.) Blaming group-think for everyone disagreeing with you seems like a dip into grandiose/paranoid/narcissistic territory. I'm not saying that's what you are but that's how that statement is reading to me. It's fine to disagree with everyone but I wouldn't discount all their opinions as "group-think".

on this 'atheists' forum i'm referring to these people are all convinced that every report on global warming is 100% true & any reports that raise even the slightest amount of doubt are from what they consider 'trolls'. i pointed out several times that global warming has become an industry that many 'scientist' have built lucrative careers on. they depend on money for 'research' from govts which look at global warming as a tax grab.
many of the global warming predictions have turned out to be ridiculous e.g a UN scientist predicted in 1989 that if drastic steps weren't taken to reduce CO2 emissions immediately then coastal cities around the world would be flooded by 2020. how's that 1 working out?
i don't doubt that many of you here are a bunch of brainwashed individuals who also find your way into the comfortable cocoon of group-think.

@callmedubious Ok, so what is your claim here? That one scientist royally messed up? Or that climate change isn't real? Or something else entirely?

@callmedubious I'm sure everyone in your last group pointed out to you that despite all the money, influence and power that scientists have, the other side comprises of most manufacturing businesses and the oil companies so that argument isn't super compelling.

@callmedubious Climate change is real, ok? Perhaps some of the most drastic predictions haven’t come true, but we are still looking at substantial sea level rises down the line. It’s hard to quantify, but from what I hear 3 degrees C is where we are heading.

@Denker there is a report from a scientist in australia who did the computer modelling that was used for temp predictions. he later discovered an error that changes the predictions down considerably.
i used to post reports like these but will no longer do it.
if anyone has only looked at all the pro global warming reports without looking at reports from scientists who disagree with the alarmists, some of them Nobel Laureates, them they are just brainwashed & not capable of free thinking, imo.

@Denker thinking it is true doesn't make it true.

@callmedubious I look at both kinds of reports, but since 95% of scientists say global warming is a real thing, and a lot of the countering opinions seem to be paid for by big oil and other industry lobbying groups, I choose to side with those who acknowledge the problem.

@Denker There's the correct answer. Climate change is occuring as a vast number of scientists agree. The actual question you might ask yourself is whether it's caused by human activities, fossil fuels, etc. Personally I think it is, we're poisoning the planet in our on filth.

@callmedubious You won't find ANYBODY who believes" every report on global warming is 100% true". Straw man. You give no sources, so your claims are meritless until then. Flooded coastal cities? Have you heard of New Orleans? If you think climate change is big business, I suggest you compare it to oil, gas, coal and everything that uses those things just to get a sense of perspective. See potholer's response to Steven Crowder on YouTube then come back to us.

1

"they didn't want any dissenters on any subject they all agreed on."
I guess it depends on what you were dissenting on. was it fact based (science related )?

@callmedubious I'm reading the comments.. I guess I got me answer.. never mind.

1

Well it is possible for individuals to think alike and remain an individual. Not only possible but something people have always done as they try to "fit in".
Group think is getting a "bad" name but the reality is because we use to to refer to negative types of thinking...and in the some cases not thinking at all but following to feel included.

1

You will be welcome here so long as you do not try to force your ideas on others, or atrtack or insult others.

1

The only way to escape group-think is to avoid groups. I'm happy with this site at current but it will grow and change and in time I'll probably feel differently.

the atheists forum has stopped accepting new commenters since last june. so there are now around a dozen or so who post regularly & always completely agree with each other & even congratulate each other for refusing to even consider any dissenting views.
IOW, they are like a bunch of inbred backwoods idiots. or,if you prefer, the british aristocracy

@callmedubious you are inclined to a fair amount of raving and ranting, friend, and crossed the line into Problem Child territory, as far as I'm concerned. Call that atheist group think if you like, but once a poster becomes that here I tend to inform them of my view and walk away. So advised, and I'm walking.

@David1955

2

Not understanding what the options are to being a “self-described” atheist (yes, the compound modifier takes a hyphen ...). Other people telling you what you believe? Staying “in the closet?” I’m an atheist because no one making claims that gods exist has been able to offer an ounce of evidence, and it’s not something I observe in the world around me. That’s it: to me the idea is just unconvincing. Also, you might be thinking of some anti-theists, who believe that religious ideas actually cause harm to individuals and society and so actively oppose religious thinking.

and why would i worry about a fucking hyphen?
there could be a superior intelligence somewhere in this or a parallel universe.
i don't believe in a personal god. maybe POE was right: 'is all we see or seem but a dream within a dream?'

0

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0

Welcome! Hope you like it here. Most of the time it's not too dogmatic, but there are moments. And it's still better than many other forums!

thanks

1

"Lurking" on a site sounds dubious. Lots of things are certain. Death is certain. Taxes should be certain but unfortunately the very wealthy avoid them...like that repugnant man in charge.
I am not sure what is wrong with saying I am an atheist.

i never said anything is wrong being an atheist.
i seem to be eliciting replies from some unimaginative people.

1

Reminds me of: "All I know is that I know nothing." --Socrates

probably what i paraphrased.

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well, i agree with everything you said at the end. i can't agree or disagree with your experiences, described in the middle, because they are your experiences; they certainly aren't mine. and i most certainly disagree with your assessment of self-described atheists. first of all, am i supposed to wait for someone else to describe me? second of all, i am (self-described again lol) quite open-minded (but you know, there IS that description of the person who is so open-minded that thoughts go in and come out without stopping anywhere in between). maybe you need to be more open-minded about atheists.

g

0

Um.. Hi welcome!

MsAl Level 8 Oct 11, 2018

thanks

4

Death? Taxes? The dog will throw up on the bed right after you put on clean sheets? Drink a lot of beer, get fat? WTH are you babbling about, "nothing is certain"?

@irascible Thank you! I try!

i drink a considerable amount of IPA craft beer & am male 5ft 9in, 150 lbs.

@callmedubious Well, good for you...too much alcohol does indeed make you skinny...Hank Williams Sr, anyone?

@AnneWimsey you'll never see a skinny beer drinker.
when i was in my late 20s i drank a lot of beer. i noticed i was 30lbs overweight & changed to rye & water, also cut back on starches. lost 30 lbs in 1 yr.
i now drink a fair amount of craft beer but also golf 4 or 5 times/wk & don't have a big appetite.

4

There's a whiff of persecution complex in this thread. Unfounded assumptions, eg group-think and the rest. I'd expect a bit of rough and tumble with any group of free thinkers. You know the old saying about heat and kitchens and staying out of them. Well, this kitchen is warmly comfortable in my view. Anyway, my focus is as it has always been: on religion and fighting it.

i fight BS/lies in all forms/shapes, not just religion.

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