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I spent almost a year in the pre civil rights South. It was October, 1962 to August 1963. Jim Crow was very much alive and thriving. It was a deeply racist society and racial segregation was the law of the land.

As a very young man from Minnesota I had no experience or knowledge of the social norms I was to encounter. This ignorance very nearly got me in trouble at times. My experiences were mostly in Tennessee, Mississippi, and Georgia. I was witness to some truly appalling behavior which I will not describe here because it is not the point of this post.

A recent road trip to Florida took me through much of the same areas. Things have progressed enormously since those early days. I must commend those people for emerging from the dark ages.

As I traveled I started taking notice of the surprising number of Southern Baptist Churches I passed by. They were everywhere, sometimes two or more at a single crossroad. They were more common than taverns in Wisconsin, and that’s really saying something!

Then I thought back and realized that the same was true in those earlier days. Days when the evil of Jim Crow infested the heart of so many of those people. Days when the lynching of black men for trivial offences were not investigated much less prosecuted.

Then I wondered. Is there a connection between the traditional teachings of The Southern Baptist Church and the racial hatred that blemished the Deep South for so many generations. Is it simply a geographical coincidence or is it something deeper and darker. I wonder.

dumasarok 7 Nov 2
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18 comments

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0

I’m an NC native; I recall the busing riots when the schools were integrated. I was 11; 1961. People-White people-were frothing at the mouth.
Fast forward to 2019:
I have a niece, 27 years old, only child and her maternal grandmother ‘s only grandchild. Recently, she became engaged to a wonderful young black man, whom she met in DC, where they both live/work. The grandmother has DISINHERITED her only grandchild and forbids the young man’s name in her presence.
Sad? Very. Surprised? Not really. We still have so far to go.

2

I think the reason racism still exist is deeper than that. As you mentioned you were alive in the Jim Crow era, but so are many other people who may not have shared your progressive view then and now. In other words, people that was at the time against desegregation is still alive. Some of these same people may have implicitly or explicitly pass on some of their bigoted beliefs to their kids. Therefore, we are still dealing with the left over residue of that time.

Jim Crow was outlawed, but other than public opinion and recently firings, there is no actual repercussion for being racist. Public outrage also led to covert racism, which in some ways is a more insidious form of racism, because it allows Plausible deniability. This stops us from really confronting race head on, as some think we have progressed completely pass it.

African Americans were severely impacted from American History. From 1776 to 1969, we were not able to benefit completely from the American system. That translates into roughly a 200 year head start. Also realize this is the first time I mentioned slavery, which cannot be forgotten.

On paper(in law), which can be different from how it is expressed in the real world, African Americans have only enjoyed 50 years on equal rights. With the aforementioned, 200 year head start, It is unfair to expect us to be on equal footing after only 50 years. However, a racist might say we gave them the freedom they wanted and they did nothing with it. This is of course nonsense, but because we are still trying to play catch up, he might see justification for his belief.

A popular response is that was so long ago, you need to get over it. However, this is not that simple because the same way the bigoted Jim Crow era adult passed on their belief on their kid, so did our parents and grandparents pass on some of their trauma to us. It is hard to get over trauma, when we still observe that trauma in explicit and implicit ways.

In conclusion, as atheist and agnostics, we understand how difficult it is to change your mind about something you were indoctrinated with, even on a individual basis. Imagine trying to change a whole population collectively. 50 years is not enough, that is less than 2 generations.

I hear you. I know folks who are so deeply racist, that they don’t even recognize how racist they are.

1

I grew up in small town Louisiana in the 60's in a southern baptist family of racists. They didn't teach or preach racism in church that I recall, but I never paid very much attention. After reading this post I stopped to think about a possible connection. I thought about my friends who had a different religious affiliation and I think you might be on to something. If you were to visit my hometown you would think you've gone back 50 years in time. Leaving there in 1980 was the best move I've ever made.

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Of course religion was used as a tool in the South to justify an economic lifestyle that was built on the oppression of other human beings. This attitude s reflected today in white supremacy & their use of the cross as a symbol.

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What really stands out is that the Churches are all brick structures with beautiful manicured lawns and ample parking with Bldg. attachments. Then you drive down the road and the houses are in various forms of disarray an broken down cars and barns. I lived in Nu Orlins for a spell and it is the same thing but the
churches are not as modern, but the bigotry and racism is more carefully segregated.

0

This is a question that could be asked about many other issues/religions. I personally think it goes both ways. People rally around churches to claim God's sanction for their beliefs. Then the belief becomes stronger and more widespread because of the church teaching it. It's a downward cycle.

I would say at it's most basic level, racism came from the entitlement Southern land owners felt toward the free labor they got from slavery. The development of religious beliefs around that is totally normal. If God says it's okay then you can go ahead and work countless people to death so you can live a life of luxury.

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That's an excellent question. I spent the first 52 years of my life in Mississippi and I don't have to answer. It is something that always confused me. How good God-fearing people could be so extraordinarily hateful and treat other people as worthless beings. It is better but still bad in my opinion.

pmzm Level 4 Nov 3, 2019
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When I was 10 years old I took a bus trip down south. At a rest stop I got off the bus to get a drink of water. There was a line at the water fountain ...then I saw another fountain without a line off to the side of the building...I was thirsty so I drank from this fountain.....some old witch of a white woman yelled at me for drinking at the colored's water fountain. This was in 1962.

2

I have posted this before on another thread, but this is about SB who I talk about so here goes again;
I grew up in part of Kentucky that had a catholic population intermixed with mostly SBs. I was about 9 or ten and my next door neighbor was the same age. His father was a preacher. One day we got talking about religion. With no sense of "maybe this is wrong" he proceeded to tell me that, as a catholic, I was going to hell for severl reasons, one of which was the acceptance into our church of black folks (who where catholic). He proceed to explain that black folks carried the curse of Ham, the son of Noah. Spanish, Italians and Greeks or any other 'white' person was only slightly tainted. How could I tell, I asked him. Skin color. The blacker the skin, the deeper the curse of Ham."
His father had preached that very sermon the week before. That was why there had to be seperate schools (my mother taught at a Rosenwald elementary school that barely had chalk and chalkboards), movie theaters, drinking fountains, etc.. The SB's felt this prevented them from getting the taint on them. I later ran into a methodist from eastern kentucky who told me the same thing almost word for word. This belief system has not melted away. The SB and others, feel it is God's commandment that they discriminate. I heard the same thing, just toned down because Jews were mentioned, last year on a small West Virginia radio station religious hour as well.

0

Is the pope from argentina?

1

I lived in Charleston SC in 1999 for 6 months.
It was so racist I had to leave, I felt gross inside being there.
It may have improved, but it’s still wretched with racism, hate, and ignorance.

Charleston. Where they made a tourist attraction out of the old slave market, and enshrined the ‘war of nawthin aggression’ relics. Ugh.

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Naomi Klein puts in succinctly in a recent book about the current political situation . US capitalism was built on the theft of two things.land from the indigenous people and people from the continent of Africa. Both fully supported and encouraged by the Christian church

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Have you seen the film "The green book". It is set mostly in the southern states in 1962. Highly recommended.

Yes indeed. That's an excellent movie.

I have not seen it. I will do so.

3

They used the bible to advocate slavery, torture, racism, hatred, segregation and all else ugly on mankind and they got away with it and probably still do.
I know this for a fact having being raised in a so-called "christian country" called South Africa. I personally suffered the brunt of it and many other millions.

0

Very probably

2

Causation or correlation? I'm not qualified to answer. I have to rely on that old saying that there's no smoke without fire.

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Good question. The Southern Baptist Convention was formed in the 1940s as a breakaway sect specifically to support slavery. It also openly supported the Confederacy, and the Jim Crow south. Much of its membership today is still highly ethnocentric and outright racist. And, still today, the Southern Baptist Convention allows its churches to choose their own pastor with no input from the Convention. That means that where there are still racist congregations, they choose racist pastors.

2

I think many people attend church to make themselves feel they are better and special. I also think that need is the root cause of racism.

...when someone voluntarily tell me they are xtian, when there's no real need to, I become very suspicious of those individuals ...because they hide all their uglies behind that confession. I don't go around saying I'm Atheist. ...unless if I'm asked about which religion I follow or something like that.

@TimeOutForMe sorta like when somebody says "i'm honest" or "you can trust me"

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