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Could it be that humanity is missing its sense of community; from being around campfires and at churches? and this could be what is preventing people feeling connection and meaning; not the fact that they are no longer identifying as religious?
Should we be creating groups to pay for large communal spaces for interactions, if it’s not on the government agenda. The potential for greater personal development/ learning and better mental health is pretty obvious.

girlwithsmiles 8 Dec 7
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6

Communal meetings are a very important part of the human experience, being social animals. There are still very much alive in our modern day.

Agnostic.com is one such community. Being American or any other nationality is another form. Social media and/or the Internet can be viewed as
the new campfire, where people come to share similar beliefs.

However social media and our current political climate has showed us that with the benefits of community also comes the downside of excessive tribalism. In which a person with different opinions must be criticized, silenced and dangerous.

If we need any kind of training these days, it would be how to get along with others with different beliefs. I don't know how it would be solved globally or nationally, but perhaps everyone reading this post can strive to be more lenient towards others with different beliefs if they don't do this already.

Yes! Beautifully stated.

5

Don’t look to the government for this community building, I would even argue, they like the division. Plus, the people who call themselves elites have no time for the common man! When great numbers of people join in a common cause, a solution needs to be brought forth...it is my experience that very little of this is taking place now! You either ‘do it my way, or you can go somewhere else!’ That is what I hear!

4

I personally believe people seek out churches as places to find community/like-minded individuals; but more for the community aspect than anything else.
We aren't as good at forming communities as we were in the past and in some ways the Internet has fed this isolation. I will say the Internet was helpful to me in the years following my husband's death (2008) as I was able to connect with other widows/widowers who had similar experiences. I also was able to find men to date since at the time I was working in an elementary school and this is not conducive to finding anyone to go out with (the only men there are married/gay/or single for a reason).
I agree we do need to find other ways to connect and support each other that are not based upon an organized belief system. We attempt to do this online but in the real world it's a bit more difficult.

4

I get all the "community" I need right here.

Me too. I don’t use Facebook or twitter so Agnostics is my community!

4

Humanity is missing it's sense of humanity. Meaning, it's connection to our species as a whole across the world. But yes, I think you're on to something on the provincial scale as well.

Thank you.

3

I have written on this site many times on this site that the only real attraction, or positive attribute of religion is that they provide a sense of community and belonging.

Humans are "herd animals" that evolved with the strategy of gathering in groups for safety. Our animal instincts still draws us into groups and we feel safest when we belong and have a sense of community.

How strange, just came from a day out in the city and found numbers overwhelming. My office of about 60 people is probably my perfect herd size 🙂 (sorry for repeating what you’ve already said, this was a response to the science and religion melding mentioned in another post.)

3

There are two ways of looking at this. Community very often leads to tribalism. Tribalism is why countries in the Middle East and much of Africa will never have peace. It is evident even in more advanced societies in the form of religious sects, gangs and political groups. Do we really need more? After reading a book on the Dust Bowl, this community sense can certainly be useful to those who fit into those communities, but is generally harsh to those who stray outside the acceptable guidelines. This is one of the reasons Atheist are generally not tribal oriented. We tend to be independently thinking cusses! 😁

Ah, that would explain a lot. I still miss chatting, but am very independent, I bet a lot of us are.

@girlwithsmiles on here I think that could be a safe bet. I know I, and I’m sure many others don’t feel any real need to “belong” while still enjoying being able to express ourselves in an open forum, without fear of repercussions.

3

Yes , a part of religion is community gatherings , social events , and charities , that made you feel good for participating in . But these can be replaced , without it being religious . As for , " large spaces ," think of sports stadiums / arenas , fairs , festivals . For nerds/geeks , etc. there are a variety of D & D types of groups playing . It's more a matter of deciding what you are interested in doing , and connect with others who share the same interests . I've learned that once you are participating with a group you truly enjoy , you often find connections to other things you will also enjoy . For instance , after my divorce , a new boyfriend introduced me to SciFiFantasy Conventions . At one , a panel was on ballroom dancing , which I enjoyed . The couple heading the panel , had built a home that included a ballroom and they invited us to join them twice a month . While there I learned about the SCA . I also discovered Didico (sp) , which was fun and much closer to home . WIth the SCA background , I discovered I thoroughly enjoy cosplay , and began making connections online , to the Renn Fest and the people who frequent it and other fairs and events . Now my computer , presents me with a listing of local events that , based on the interests I input , are things I'm likely to be interested in attending .

3

After my divorce I could not find anybody in my area of North Carolina who was not eaten up with religion! Moved back to Florida and found a great group of diverse individuals who didn't need religion. I live with my ninety-five year old mother who curls up in a fetal position when a nursing home is mentioned and I will try to keep her out of one. I understand that some people need people around them. For me I'll go bird watching to get outside.

BillF Level 7 Dec 7, 2019
3

Campfires and churches? How very Norman Rockwell a view.

People change communities due to socio-economic pressures that also decrease our connections to each other. We're conditioned to "get ours" and "work hard and sacrifice now so you don't have to work hard later" with the goalposts of what "later" means conveniently shifted down the road so it never comes. We're bombarded with "You need this" and "this, right here, that'll make you happy" bullshit marketing crap designed to get you further into debit on the treadmill of capitalism.

Campfires and churches. We have massive stadiums to gather in, auditoriums, meeting halls, convention centers, bookstores, cafes, restaurants, bars, book clubs, sex clubs, coffee shops, malls, concerts, museums, parks, blahblahblah.

People don't have a sense of community because no ones figured out how to make a profit off of it yet.

1of5 Level 8 Dec 7, 2019

Yes...it looks about like that to me, too!

Will have to look up Rockwell, yes, I rejected the conditioning, hence being the, ‘black sheep of the family’.
It’s not really about profit, more about prevention. Mental health costs a bomb to the government alone.
Plus I’m convinced that it the different people in a community got together and found out more about their situations, a synergy to problem solve would occur. Just call it faith 😂

2

I heard in a sermon a really depressing statistic about young people. It drastically stated that such a huge percentage felt no sense of purpose in life. If I remember correctly study was done in Europe where one would think the overall sense of purpose would be relatively high because in general there is a basic standardd - no war, not mass poverty, etc. I do believe sense of community needs to be greatly improved in modern society. I think the entire segment of atheist/agnostic/humanist that does not attend any form of church does miss out the benefit of all that come from that. The problem with that could be though dealing with people who are all over the board and not having enough in common. It could be highly beneficial for the young, so for that reason I would definitely think it would be a good idea. The entire idea could revolve around purpose. Helping out in the community. Older kids helping the young. Service projects to help the less fortunate in other areas. Fun stuff too. All the kids volunteering to do nice things, needed work for elderly. Basically a lot of stuff you see out there but pulled together around the belief system of A or A or H.

It could also serve as a place of counsel for young. They could bring concerns and hopefully receive support from other members. Being AAH can be difficult, I would think young people would need support. I think a lot of the crime in society would be eliminated if more people had a stronger sense of community that could be imparted by something like this. Just like churches I am sure at some point it would be self-supporting, wealthy even. Maybe there is something out there similar already and I am unaware?

Edit: I guess there is UUA, which also accepts agnostic and atheist. Still I don't see a strong enough presence, but I am not familiar with it either. I think a lot more could be done if this Is a true representation of what is going on in the minds of young people.

2

I've taken training to be a circle keeper, to design and implement community-building discussions. One thing that has been pointed out is that every civilization until very recently had some form of circle discussions, often late in the evening around a campfire, and this used to be essential to discussing the events of the day, to address problems and conflicts, to tell stories (history and fantasy alike). We've lost this aspect in modern and so-called advanced society, where we have so much yet feel so disconnected from one another. Even fairly recently, before air conditioning, neighbors would congregate in the evenings outdoors to enjoy the cooler outside air and would experience a bit of what people used to in camp circles; air conditioning encouraged people to shut themselves indoors and focus on private activities. Family time used to be important, but families don't typically have that dedicated evening meal anymore, to routinely sit around the table and discuss the day, rather opting to sit in front of the television or where everyone does their own thing. I do think people crave the sense of connection that we aren't getting day to day, and this does keep a lot of people tethered to religion because it offers what we can't find elsewhere. I have a friend who doesn't buy into the dogma of his Catholic upbringing, but he practices devoutly and is rearing his children in the faith because he sees utility in it. I've seen on this site where a lot of non-believers have joined a Unitarian church for the sense of community. It would be great if we could find that sense of connection within our communities more directly, though it's no longer as simple as stepping outside our homes and joining our neighbors around the dancing flames.

I'm also reminded of this…

There’s nothing like sitting around a camp fire chatting with friendly people, I miss having a back yard for that 🙂

2

There are a plethora of interest and hobby groups that provide social community without any need of god. Many of them..such as my choir, are cross- community, cross-age, cross-gender and cross-religion (or none in my case), although we do rehearse in a church hall because it’s central for everyone to access. Churches do rent out to secular organisations, during the week the church halls are sometimes lying empty and they need the extra money that hiring out brings them. There is no need to go creating specific non-religious groups because they already exist...just go join one!

Being British or any other European country, what you say is true. But religion in the US is a different animal in most of our communities, especially the smaller ones. In large cities finding secular or at least more diverse groups is generally easier than in smaller, tight knit communities. As Freedompath said in an earlier post about joining a garden club and feeling awkward as a non believer extends to much of the social groups in our county, be it hiking clubs or motorcycle organizations. Europeans have evolved to a great degree past that.

@Barnie2years That is just so sad for me to hear. Is it better in big cities?

@Marionville to a degree, in that there are more possibilities and more diversity. But then you run into the issue of finding the ones that fit your needs. I imagine with the Internet that has become much easier than it was before.

In my village I’d have to create one and honestly cannot be bothered putting all the effort in and paying hall fees on top of a full time job. If a free place was available I’d happily volunteer to run some sessions.

2

Technology is having a powerfully negative effect on us--especially young people. I've been teaching teens for the better part of two decades, and it is getting worse. I don't wholly agree with everything he says, but most of it is mostly true...and that's scary...

Could do without the dramatic music! 🙄 Generational angst is nothing new. Had we had the glut of audio/visual information going on 24/7 that exists today I can’t imagine what my parents generation would have been saying about us, the Boomers! And I’m sure their parents, my grandparents, never thought their kids would be able to handle adulthood. And yet, here we are, the world still spins, people are born and people die. Some societies advance and some decline. And the previous generation continues to dissect the next.

This is oh so true, and will be very painful for some to admit that they are addicted to their tech gadgets.

@Barnie2years This is partly true, but when you and I were kids, we didn't have pocket tvs (with access to millions of hours of HD video) and a means to write notes to ANY of our friends instantaneously with instantaneous responses (positive, negative, or indifferent). Schools across the nation (as well as my school) are struggling to get kids to put away their phones. Ten or twenty years ago, we could take them away without much trouble. Now PARENTS want students to have the phones, and taking them away is untenable (at a certain point, you are keeping track of too many, phones get broken or stolen, the school is therefore "responsible", and parents are angry because they spent so much money on the phones and--again--they WANT the kids to have the phones).

And it isn't just anecdotal evidence that these devices are having a profoundly negative effect on this generation. Since the introduction of the iphone, test scores have stagnated or dropped, depression and anxiety have increased, among many other negative factors.

If you kick a kid out of class for using their phone, they get detention. They don't go to detention. So they get Saturday school. They don't go to Saturday school. You call the parents. They parents do nothing, or what they do has no effect. (Previously after all of this, they would give students "in school suspension"...and pull them out of class, where they were supposed to do homework but rarely did. So the lack of learning from phone use turns into lack of learning by not being in class.)

And it's not just teens, although it is rewiring their brains much more easily. ADULTS can't put their phones down either. Broadway is now requiring people to hand over their phones before a show because they just...can't...help themselves. They spend hundreds of dollars to...ignore the show, annoy the people sitting next to them, and text on their phone. It is an addiction very similar to compulsive gambling, and the tech companies use all the same techniques to get people hooked--they have been training us for years with "likes", "subscribes", messages, even the little "ding" when you get a message on this very website. (Personal disclosure: I bought a track phone in 2014 for emergencies, and I still have it. I've only texted twice in my entire life. But I do spend entirely too much time on the internet when not out living my life. I actually closed the tab for this website for more than a month just to get away for a while. And I have no social media--no facebook, no twitter, no myspace, lol.)

PS: The dramatic music was stupid, but most of what he says is true.

Broadway cell phone story:
[nbcnews.com]

2

Social media is the new community meeting place. Churches are slowly going the way of the dinosaurs.

2

No. There are plenty of groups that have nothing to do with religi9n that can draw people together. If one needs another, how about a community group? I mean, do we want to sit around and talk about how there are no gods? I don't.

g

I rarely speak on what I believe unless we are in a religious discussion! However, I recently joined a garden club and I see some red flags...things that I see comes from the very religious and they are not in harmony with ‘freedom to be!’ So stay tuned! Being ‘judgemental’ about my fellowman literally makes me physically ill!

@Freedompath Education is the key folks want to gather for comfort until we achieve that, fine, but to propose it in what sure sounded like an institutional way? Sounds like a recipe for starting a new church.

g

2

To me, it seems that theaters, stadiums or even shopping malls exist as places for people to interact free from religious doctrines. I think it’s the scale of it all that prevents the feeling of community from forming for many people.

You seem to believe that a "feeling of community" is necessarily a good thing. As a high-functioning Asperger's Syndrome person, I can assure you than many times it is not. "Group Think" has its own problems. Ask yourself, who makes the decisions during riots? Also, this: [google.com]

@dahermit
I think smaller groups (5-15 people perhaps?)
Create a greater sense of community and belonging.
The original post seemed to be of the opinion that a feeling of community was a beneficial thing.
I can’t presume to know how a person with Asperger’s reacts to smaller groups - as an introvert, I feel far more comfortable at a barbecue, with a few friends, than a Nuremberg rally.

2

"The potential for greater personal development/ learning and better mental health is pretty obvious." Sort of like a Nazi rally in the thirties or a KKK meeting? Lots of potential for negative things when goups of people gather and interact emotionally.

My dad’s advice was not to join organizations since people will do things far worse as a group than they would as a individual. He left Germany in 1939.

2

That is a very astute observation and a good plan! I am not surprised that there is no real push for it. Just think of the American Icon, the lone cowboy on a horse. We have a long way to go to move away from that. And we need to tell more stories, without reservations or fear of ridicule.

1

Perhaps people should get off their Smart phones/Internet etc, get out and meet people, I know the happiest I feel is when I talk to people in shops/chemists etc, cyberspace is no replacement for real interaction!

PatP Level 3 Dec 16, 2019
1

The combination of the social electronic social media, propagandistic false news outlets like Fox and Sinclair, and proselytizing special interest groups are tearing our society apart into self-serving and self reinforcing echo chambers. No longer are local communities groups of people working and living together to make the local community a good place in which to live. This really began in the late 1950s, but has been greatly accelerated since the advent of Fox News, the growth of well-financed special interest groups, and the advent of the internet and its social media. It has also been greatly aided by aggressive right wing Republican politicians like Gingrich, Armee, Deley and their current ilk like Gaetz and Jordan.

The question is how can we stop this destructive trend?

Any potential answers?

@Bushshaker unfortunately I don’t think that alone will help. But if it works for some... it’s all to the good.

1

Something I created years ago springs to mind, I drew/ wrote it after a dream, it reads,
As the mists of time opened and I walked in,
The smells were all around me and the babbling din
Of a million voices whispering,
‘Come in, come in, come in’
The unison and differences somehow seemed the same thing
...and I was accepted.

1

I've long felt that churches could be useful as community centers and homeless shelters. The sense of community and belonging that churches often provide is great as long as they could do this without all the magical, superstitious thinking. Get rid of the religious shit and churches could be put to good use.

1

Other
I am Other
It does not disturb me
It does not blow angry winds across my heart
It simply is
So if I tell Another
Behold . . . I am Other
They deny, they resist
They protest, crying
Never let it be so!
None is Other, all belong
Somewhere
How do I then reply?
Should I attempt explanation?
Should I trust their reason?
To mine own self be true?
I did not choose to be Other
Nor would I put it away
And become . . .Another
Another, who re-invents war
Drone swarms rain fire
Another, who poisons for profit
Complex chemical catastrophe
Another, who twists life
Bio-genetic spider sheep
Another, who falsely promises
War over by Christmas
Another, who bleeds misplaced faith
Body count hits record high
My similarities lie cased in flesh
My language, you speak
My knowledge, you know
My lessons, you teach
Wherefore springs your surprise?
I am Other
Are you Another?
D.N.B.----2001

You’re all individuals:

lols 😆
1

[psychologenie.com]

Having sat in on many teacher's meetings with the administrators, this is what usually happens.

Shades of Twelve Angry Men! And why I do my best to avoid groups. I have a bad habit of trying to prove my point when I feel the consensus is off. 😁

@Barnie2years Consider that few groups are made up of equal peers...most have a "boss" in the group. Therefore, the members must do a "dance" of not pissing the boss off - but still seeming to reach a consensus, of which the boss will approve for obvious reasons. A lot can be learned about human group interactions from watching a troop of monkeys or baboons...they are not a band of equals and it is obvious that the biggest monkey is calling the shots.

Maybe with sheeple 😉 what’s the use of forming a group with yes men in a work environment? You’re never going to have any innovation.
I think this would come about with old school management techniques; like in your first meeting fire or humiliate someone to show them who’s boss.
Make sure you don’t tell people what you do, thus making yourself indispensable.
Modern management style is a bit different I hope, they look for people that add to the discussion more.
So what I’m getting from your comment is something about respect,
respect for self: your own opinion and ability to add to the party
Respect for power: to be shown at all cost, even at detriment to the overall goal
And respect for overall projects: which wanes under interpersonal relationships as people think they’re more important a than the task at hand.
I’m a big fan of allowing introverts a chance to speak their mind too: being able to put something on an agenda by contacting the secretary directly for formal meetings or having an anonymous questionnaire or comments box for feedback.
I think that study has more to do with the boss type, hopefully people are learning that’s a very poor environment for useful dialogue and growth.

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