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I recently met with an old friend of the last 59 years. He is a s Southern Baptist "true believer." It was probably our last time together. I am 85 and he 87. We both agreed that we each, in our ow way, as tried to be a good man He implored me to reconsider my non-belief,

The only thing that has has kept him from being a fantastic human being is his evangelical Christianity.

wordywalt 9 May 15
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16 comments

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1

I can relate. Best friends sometime remain such when people are able (and determined) to look beyond religious and political persuasions. In our immoderate age, however, this practice would seem to be less frequent.

Sometimes the best thing that we unbelievers can do is remain friends with those who wish we would reconsider our non-belief, if for no other reason than to serve as an example that it doesn't take belief in a deity to be a decent and ethical person... or a friend.

6

There are christians who are good. Christians who are just, fair, caring and compassionate.

They're not good BECAUSE they are christian. They're good IN SPITE OF BEING christian.

That's why they don't wander around the place killing anyone they see working on the sabbath as the bible tells them to.

Some of the nicest people I have lived around were/are Mormons. Bat shit crazy cult that...but still friends.

3

I have had friends who were Christians. I got tired of their attributing every good thing that happened to their god, while not holding the same entity responsible for the bad. That is why I distanced myself from them.

5

One problem with evangelical Christianity is that it pushes its god as the reason you are a good person. No god, no good person. You just cannot be a good person without god. Unfortunately I see a great many people today wanting to claim they are a good person. Why do we have to do this? Maybe people feel guilty because they did it without god. IDK. All of us have different reasoning and do not know each other. This means we are good people to some and not to everyone. Some know your truth. Others would rather believe a lie about you. I don't care what they believe. I am not worried about being a good person.

You're right. "Good" is subjective, and I don't even want everyone to subjectively believe I'm good. There are people I so vehemently despise that them thinking I was good would only serve to let me know I haven't sufficiently exacted revenge.

6

An eternity of forced singing praises to a deity that forced my existence is the best they have and it sounds horrifying.

5

I have a friend who is a pastor but never ever does he try to either coerce or convince me to become a Christian, never.

I also have a friend who is a Christian pastor, though a very reasonable one! We respect each other and actually agree on more than we would ever disagree on.

Funny thing, that. It turns out, seminary-educated clergy surveyed prove, on average, to be considerably less dogmatic and fundamentalist in their espoused beliefs than do their own parishioners/congregants. I suspect it is because they are educated about some of the inconsistencies and factual misses in scripture, so they have learned to check cognitive dissonance, and one way is to wax more metaphorical about the Bible, and less "Thumper."
This definitely does NOT apply to those evangelical preachers who "felt the calling" but are largely self-"instructed."

3

It is the evangelizing that prevents me from having religious friends of that ilk. Believe anything you desire especially everything on the internet as President You-Know-Who did. The Constitution might consider my freedom FROM religion. In the Pledge, on our currency, inside of our government with their "prayer breakfasts". Give me a break from religion & I will give you a break from fasting.

9

I have a friend and former colleague who is an evangelical Christian. We were both science teachers when he revealed to me that he did not believe Darwin's theory of evolution was A) a valid explanation of the origin of species, B) supported by a vast and growing mass of evidence, and C) almost universally accepted by scientists the world over. He admitted that his religious belief was guiding his thinking on this matter of science. I told him he had better take another look at it, and that until he did he would be doing his students a disservice. We did not communicate much or at all for some time after that (we taught in different schools, so this was natural). When we finally did meet up again (for a long hike in the back country) he told me that his thinking on Darwin had shifted 180 degrees. I was very gratified to know that I had had a role in making a better teacher and very proud of my friend for showing mental flexibility and the ability to grow.

5

I experience this everytime I get together with my sister, a die hard baptist. I usually challenge her the same way, because she has never met the challenge; "If the evidence for the existence of your god is so compelling, then please unite all religions under one church and get back to me. It should be easy because all those religious people 'Want to believe' as much as your do. I'll wait!" .... I have to re-issue the same challenge time after time, because she never delivers .... Imagine that!!

3

We'll all miss you here when you're gone, Walt. Your old buddy? Not so much.

3

I think Fox is amping up its psy-ops and the Trumpers are literally going crazy now. They have completely lost it in the last two weeks.

14

My best friend and I went to catholic school together, grades 7-12. We went to mass, went to confession, all that stuff. We went two different ways as we matured - I became a fully fledged atheist and he became a Jesuit(!). We stayed best friends - he was the best man at my wedding years ago (he was nowhere to be found for my divorce, LOL), And just 2 weeks ago at my request he conducted a wonderful and moving graveside service when we buried my dad's ashes. We would never try to proselytize each other, that has kept that friendship strong. You can be religious and not be a prick.

zeuser Level 9 May 15, 2022
11

I have several friends in Texas that are “true believers”. I love them dearly, and we have always agreed to not talk politics or religion. They do try to sneak in an “I’ll pray for you” sometimes, but the running joke between us is that my response is always, “and I’ll think for you”!! 😉

7

I lost a friendship of 45 years due to my unwillingness to embrace the Mango Mussolini. It truly is a loss. My condolences.

MizJ Level 8 May 15, 2022

That happened to me too. My best friend from high school became a Faux News true believer after she sustained a head imjury. I tried to tolerate the hero worship as long as I could, and tried to ask her not to talk politics, but she had lost her inhibitions. I miss her, but it's for the best. I'm sorry about your friend.

@Organist1 Sadly I think it has happened to many of us. We (in the US) are suffering from so much loss lately. COVID, political polarization, loss of rights.

Psssh. I cut out all but 3 members of my entire family. Losing a Trumper ain't no loss...

@ChestRockfield I disagree, opinions can change. I have put the friendship on hold.

6

It's kinda sad. It's a long time to be invested in a friendship to have it end this way. It's a shame that you both can't agree to keep religion out of your relationship. Good long term friends are a rarity.

Betty Level 8 May 15, 2022
10

I can relate. I have a close friend whom I've been friends with for over 32 years. Over the years we've become more dissimilar. He's always been a Christian but he's grown more conservative over the years and he has become more anti-science and pro-bible nonsense. Our political views are generally at odds as well. He's a good guy but I know that if he were someone I met today it would be very unlikely that we'd become friends.

Almost exactly my situation!

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