They have been in the Echo Chamber since Fox News was launched

The right wing created something that is not real (voter fraud)and now they want to investigation - or audit election results - something they created that they know is not real.
It creates chaos and every politician knows how to use a good crisis via distraction.

Let's see your evidence of "the fraud of the presidential election".

Where is your evidence of any fraud. Do you believe tRump won?

@xenoview Kind of hard to have legal voters when you don’t even show a valid ID. And the democrats strongly object to showing id’s when voting. Why? Because they want to steal the election. They could care less whether a vote is valid or not as long as they win.

@Trajan61
tRump/russia thing ring a bell? What evidence do you have for any voter fraud?

It's amazing that all of those Republican, to include tRump, appointed judges disagree with you. It is also amazing that Republican Secretaries of State, who supported tRump, also disagree.

There was no fraud--only a sad, pathetic, little LOSER tRump and his minions who believe the lies he spews; and all he cares about is his own well being and keeping his criminal ass out of jail after he leaves office. Oh, and grifting as much money from people as he possibly can under the pretense that he is fighting fraud. He is padding his bank account as he needs the money to pay off all the loans he owes.

Trajan. you are back with your moronic opinions. What is it called when you see things that aren't there and you don't see things that are there. You are mentally ill. Go sell crazy somewhere else. After Trump, we are all stocked up here for centuries!!

@xenoview Well if you rig it just right the evidence gets harder to come by or more likely to have discounted when found. And for example, such as skirting votet ID laws in WI with using indefinately confined status and deciding though there ARE rules set up regarding it's use the rules don't really have to be followed. So what was the point of the ORIGINAL RULES? It's put those voters in a position too. I know I heard mention of possible charges of voter fraud. This is a problem. I think charging with fraud goes too far, but I don't know if the ballots should be counted, I think not. Rules are rules.

@xenoview Russia was a hoax and a witch hunt by the democrats. No evidence was ever found that they influenced the 2016 election.

@xenoview, @Healthydoc70 Why is it that it’s the democrats who oppose showing ID’s to vote?? Doesn’t that show intention to commit fraud?

@Trajan61
Why do you lie about russia? The house of reps have evidence, the senate didn't use it and set tRump free.

They are dressing as other groups...

I hope so. The National Guard will be on stand by.

Exactly...they hold a certain power and they are welding it, because together they just might create what they want, but clearly do not deserve, by brute force!

The Republican Party is the Party of the McCarthy Witch hunts and of the Donald. They will always be susceptible to a demagogue

Can’t discount that possibility! May depend on how the ‘planets’ line up?

Push them all over the edge is what I say

@Freedompath I was just joking. Basically calling all people who believe in Trump easily manipulated like a conspiracy theorist, which is like a flat earther. It was a stretch I know

@KevinMR anything is possible at the moment! I just hope whatever happens...is mainly on the humane side!

@Freedompath Me too!

We will have to push them off the edge of the planet.

It’s unfortunate that Biden is appearing likely to be seated as the next president. I just hope the republicans can hold the senate so they can keep the increasingly left wing gun control nut democrats in check. If they can do that it may work out but if the democrats gain control of the senate and precede to pass their radical agenda of packing the court, making Puerto Rico and Washington DC states and passing radical gun control I’d say it would be time to succeed from the union, hopefully peacefully.

The whole point is violence. Trump and the two convicted felons he invited to the White House for some light sedition telegraphed it for the White supremacist groups in a plan to cause riots and declare martial law...

@JeffMurray "The whole point is violence." I surely hope it is NOT. Though I will say I have read a lot of commentary and it seems larger forces are attempting to incite the citizenry. Hopefully, people can see through the manipulation.

@Flowerwall Larger forces? Larger than the President of the United States??

@JeffMurray Trump won't be winning any peace medals any time soon. But the nation has been under assault for a huge part of 2020. You do remember that don't you? No way you could have missed it. $2Billion in damage across the nation. I'm sure it must also be adding up because from what I hear this is STILL going on in places. Crime is general is skyrocketing too. A significant part of this goes back to dem leadership in cities. When the initial incident with George Floyd happened Dems mismanaged. Everyone knows about George Floyd and says they care, but what about everyone else who died in these riots? Why doesn't anyone care about them? Because there is not a media narrative telling people about everyone else! They are just FORGOTTEN. Residents in these cities are enraged with their government for what they view as "being abandoned", but you won't hear that much discussed.

The other point is who knows what else is behind all of this. There is a pandemic. There is government not focusing on readily available, low cost treatment options. There are global economic plans that I don't remeber ever hear being publicly discussed, the "reset", or if it was publicly discussed, I never heard. There is an election that has a huge amount of holes in it. Frequent vitriol online towards people who disagree. Now dealing with censorship of things based on politics. Yes, larger forces.

@Flowerwall That still doesn't seem "larger" than the President of the most powerful country in the world having a meeting with convicted felons where they plan riots so he can declare martial law and stay in power, basically becoming a dictator. Nothing you mentioned is more dangerous or more pressing than an authoritarian leadership of the most insanely powerful military the world has ever seen. Even if he's unsuccessful, his destruction of the fabric of democracy is paving the way for a wanna be dictator who isn't a bumbling fucking idiot, who can actually take advantage of opportunities presented.

@JeffMurray " where they plan riots so he can declare martial law and stay in power," I doubt it. But all of these election irregularities need to be explained. The idea of having real elections is paramount here. I don't know how Dems remain laregely unconcerned with the results. I think I read about 15 or 20% do believe there was fraud. So some, but about 80% are okay. We see voter turn out like never before, but if the day ever comes that faith is lost turnout will drop, drop, drop. I don't see how trust is even the goal anywhere. The courts over and over do not do their job. States are not doing their jobs. And media had no right taking a position in any of this. There are some senators that will call for an investigation, and everyone criticising the senators is clearly motivated by maintaining a believable lie. Why else would they utter a word against what is needed?

Also you used the word "white supremacist" to describe political opponents earlier, please stop attempting to use false names to associate ppl with. It's not good for Dems believability.

@Flowerwall First of all, the only people who believe there were election irregularities are lemmings who listen listen to everything the president says. Even his own officials have come out to say this was one of the securest elections on record. Secondly, there was clearly cheating in the last election. The president was caught on tape trying to coerce a foreign power into interfering and then, as you stated, we had record turnout. So I'm not at all concerned that a small percentage of people who are easily fooled by the president's conspiracy-theory-filled lies think there were problems. Losers whine, that's all this is. Finally, when I said White Supremacists, that's exactly what I meant. This was leaked so that groups like the Proud Boys would show up in DC tomorrow to help with the plan. Google it. They responded and even said they were going to wear the garb of other groups like antifa so they'd get blamed.

@JeffMurray "First of all, the only people who believe there were election irregularities are lemmings who listen to everything the president says. " Sure. You can keep telling yourself whatever you want to believe. If you are not aware of the longstanding history of voter fraud in this country, I recommend that you look it up. I suspect it will be a problem a long time into the future too. Unlike you, I won't label people as "sore losers" at that time because I like to think truth in the process is paramount.

I think you will be able to tell who Trump supporters are because they are carrying Pro-Trump signs and red, white and blue. I am not privy to any of this specific group's plans. If they dress like Antifa it will add more confusion to who is who, but maybe that would lessen chance of fighting. Who knows? I hear the national guard has already been activated. Dems should use this tactic more often and even handedly, because failure to do so reeks of political based, authoritarian control. And hopefully a retrospective look at these political based government responses will be used in places to sue based on unconstitutionality and unseat any proveyors of unequal treatment under the law.

@Flowerwall So you think there's rampant voter fraud even though Trump's own officials said there wasn't? And I'm the one that's telling himself what he wants to believe.

@JeffMurray I want an organised, comprehensive investigation. Once that is completed, with bipartisan participants at each step, than I will agree with the outcome once it is presented in a formalized report. And I will say Trump has cried foul in the past when I myself believe there likely was none, but that means absolutely nothing here. And when I say bipartisan I don't means Dems and anti-Trump Republicans, I mean truly bipartisan.

@Flowerwall Did you miss the part where Trump's own people said there was no election fraud? And we know those are legit sources because Trump said he knows the best people and hires the best people.

@JeffMurray Comprehensive investigation, please! This goes beyond Trump even. I think the entire concept of digital voting is very overrated and too susceptible to multi-tiered issues that can undermine democracy and public trust. This is something Krebs missed when he said "Safest". He may be highly skilled, very intelligent, but to make that claim is not smart outside of digital concerns, if that us not your area of expertise, it's misleading. It almost seems hard to believe that someone at his level of job responsibilty could make such a glaring error. That would be like a computer technician saying "there have been no robberies at this bank" because the digital records match, without confirming with the staff the cash is still safe. It's a big error and if I was the bank managet I would view it as being somewhere between absent minded, or negligent, or what else could it be?

@Flowerwall So the people desperate to find any appreciable amount of election fraud couldn't find it, but a bipartisan group that's not goal oriented will? Please, bro.

@JeffMurray If they don't find it then it's probably not there. Move on. Joe Biden is then the rightful Pres. and any questions can be referred back to findings.

"Not goal oriented"? The goal is to independently audit the elections process.

@Flowerwall That's my point!!! The people that WANTED to find it and TRIED to find it COULDN'T find it, so we don't really need to wonder if people who AREN'T trying to find it will.

@JeffMurray "people who AREN'T trying " Well then you sound like you mistrust everyone just from the very beginning, like a conspiracy that truth will never be found, everyone wants to hide the voter fraud.

@Flowerwall Dude, what the fuck are you not getting? A bipartisan commission wouldn't have the intention or goal of finding fraud. They should be neutral and without bias. So if people that wanted and desperately tried to find it, couldn't find it, or even think they could fabricate it , why would you think a neutral commission would find it?

@JeffMurray Because they would be following up on the evidence that was given and addressing point by point. Okay the goal should not be "find it" but answer the evidence, and figure out where cracks in the system are. If you say this election was problem free I'm going to put you in the same category as Krebs. The first step would be concerns given at various testimonies. Compile the state by state, and federal, lists and then answer them. Even if there is no further fraud found you can still accurately gauge what changes need to be made so that the public's confidence is strengthened and it ends building faith back into the system.

@Flowerwall I can't with this. I'm not opposing it. I think it's a ridiculous waste of money considering Trump's people tried as hard as they possibly could to find any evidence of court fraud they could and failed fucking miserably at every turn. If Trump or the RNC was willing to foot the bill with all the money they fleeced from their dumb fucking supporters if no widespread voter fraud was found, I'm all for it.

@JeffMurray "I'm not opposing it." Okay good that's enough. But public confidence in elections is important. I can see where there is a concern about cost, but it is a cost we must pay now.

@Flowerwall The "public" in question is only people who believe Trump's lies and are being told to question it only because he lost. If he had won, this wouldn't be an issue. We can't cater to people for being sore losers. Notice how Clinton didn't do any of this shit, and we even heard Trump on fucking tape trying to cheat in the 2016 election. We shouldn't have to pay any cost because we aren't deranged, conspiracy-theory-fueled idiots. They can pay all the costs they'd like for that luxury.