Fernapple's Profile

I cannot get over the circular reasoning of the good book being good because it says it is.

Daco2007 comments on Sep 29, 2019:

The problem with people who use the bible this way (and with trying to "reason" with them), is that they are convinced that this "book of books" was quite LITERALLY written by the hand of their mysterious, invisible "god." Therefore there is NOTHING anyone can say to that will open up their closed ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 29, 2019:

Why is is that when you meet people who only ever read one book, (or even worse listen to it being read, ) it always tends to be a bad one ?

SHOULD AGNOSTICISM & ATHEISM BECOME RELIGIONS?

EvanGamble1998 comments on Sep 28, 2019:

The problem is that a religion has a SHARED set of beliefs held by all members of that religion. Atheism and agnosticism do not have this. There is no doctrine. There are only things that individuals tend to believe.

Fernapple replies on Sep 29, 2019:

@Remiforce No sorry, almost all those definitions are in error, best do an online search for the up to date usages. Include also Humanism and Deism.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

Mofo1953 comments on Sep 29, 2019:

theology and philosophy are two completely different disciplines not even remotely related to each other, science isn't a philosophy, whatcha talking about Willis? I mean it's great to discuss theories or even assumptions, but this seems more like mental masturbation to me.

Fernapple replies on Sep 29, 2019:

Yes I agree with you that the three are completely different. The two points however are that. Firstly, they were not always different, and there was once a time when the church attempted to control all three, assuming the position of being the go to place, for all knowledge. And that in the past when both philosophy and primitive sciences such as alchemy were very much under the theist boot, the emergence of science, originally known as natural philosophy, started as a reaction to that. And secondly, that it is not in the nature of theists to respect the boundaries, and they will often overstep even today, so that it is needful to police those borders carefully, because respect for them only exists on one side.

Just a thought, but I joined this group sometime ago, not especially to comment or make posts, but ...

Marionville comments on Sep 29, 2019:

I do not get notifications for this group either...and all my alerts are switched on. I mentioned it already to @actofdog...but nothing has changed. Perhaps a mention to Admin would help.

Fernapple replies on Sep 29, 2019:

Thank you.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

TheMiddleWay comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Theology is philosophy about one specific question. There is no mandate that a believer inject their theology into other philosophical questions. I don't think science "was created" and certainly not to any purpose. Science wasn't there to discredit any school: consider that sciences original ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 29, 2019:

I am sorry but in my limited experience I do not find that. In fact I find that personal and mental progress is usually obtained when people make an effort to move forward, and one of the best motives for making that effort is the desire to resolve contraditions in our knowledge. I have certainly found that to be the case in my own personal experience, indeed I have found few greater joys than hunting down contraditions and eliminating them. I think that is true for many people, and history backs that up, because many of the greatest leaps forward in human thought came from people who could not accept contraditions. It is easy to confuse paradox which can not be resolved, with contraditions which can, and the acceptance of ignorance, which is understanding that we have reached a paradox or a gap in our knowledge, with reveveling in ignorance, which is uncaring apathy.

The ocean this morning.

Fernapple comments on Sep 28, 2019:

If you drive. Keep pressing your brakes, especially after you leave the water, to keep them dry, otherwise they may let you down when you need them most.

Fernapple replies on Sep 29, 2019:

@ChurchLess Oh dear. So every month or two you have to check that the body work is still attached to the carriage. Sorry, but you did post a sunset photo a day or two ago with the caption. " Another day in paradise."

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

skado comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Products will come and go, but the process that drives it all is the pursuit of salvation. Salvation from *what*, you ask? From cognitive, social, and adaptive dissonance. These conflicts are a permanent part of the human condition, and will always drive us to seek redemption. The answer lies ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 29, 2019:

@skado Yes that is exactly what is meant. Evolution gave us the tools to create things by accident, because we are able to use those tools in ways for which they were not gifted to us. But note the "no" in the second sentence, because except by very extreme accident it did not give any tools to deal with the secondary consequences of those creations, so that we have to invent second generation creations to deal with the consequences of the first.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

Austin-Cambridge comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Great post Fernapple, it has provoked some really interesting responses, thanks!

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

Thanks for reading and replying.

Just a thought, but I joined this group sometime ago, not especially to comment or make posts, but ...

Rignor comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Check to make sure that the alert settings for the group are correct. On the group page, the menu button should be next to the title.

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

Thanks will do.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

skado comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Products will come and go, but the process that drives it all is the pursuit of salvation. Salvation from *what*, you ask? From cognitive, social, and adaptive dissonance. These conflicts are a permanent part of the human condition, and will always drive us to seek redemption. The answer lies ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

@skado, @Austin-Cambridge Just posted this for SAKADO to enlarge. Evolution can not have forsight, therefore it could never foresee the emergence of language, and culture from the basics it provided us with, or the effects they would have. That is both our curse because we have no inherent tools to deal with the bad things that they create, and our freedom because we can ourselves create things that evolution never could, if those things do not destroy us.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

skado comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Products will come and go, but the process that drives it all is the pursuit of salvation. Salvation from *what*, you ask? From cognitive, social, and adaptive dissonance. These conflicts are a permanent part of the human condition, and will always drive us to seek redemption. The answer lies ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

@skado Evolution can not have forsight, therefore it could never foresee the emergence of language, and culture from the basics it provided us with, or the effects they would have. That is both our curse because we have no inherent tools to deal with the bad things that they create, and our freedom because we can ourselves create things that evolution never could, if those things do not destroy us.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

Geoffrey51 comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Can a believer in what or who do philosophy? Over the Millenia people have pondered who, what, why. Philosophy is not the domain of religion. Philosophy is people asking and questioning. Science proved or disproves. Neither are related to the outcomes of Theology as Theology is the study of God...

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

@Geoffrey51 Yes, whether it is right to mix systems was of course what the post was about, and myself I am certainly with you on the side of don't. It just struck me as interesting however to think that the we may owe science, originally known as Natural Philosophy, in part to the fact that the birth of science occured when it was forced to split off from traditional philosophy. Mainly because traditional philosophy had become so badly infected with its unnatural mariage to theology, in the late middle ages when the church dominated all thinking. Science after all quite quickly took its own route and never looked back to its roots in the classical world.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

KKGator comments on Sep 28, 2019:

I don't understand why anyone would/should "adopt" either philosophy or religion. It's not an either/or proposition. Neither are necessary to living a good life. Especially since a "good life" is just so completely subjective, and doesn't mean the same thing to everyone. Far too much ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

True, but I have always, at least since I joined this site regarded you as a philosopher, and a good one at that. As you say. " good life is just so completely subjective, and doesn't mean the same thing to everyone." Sounds like moral philosophy at least to me.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

Larry-new comments on Sep 28, 2019:

This question makes no sense. Science is not philosophy, obviously. Religion is not philosophy. Philosophy is neither.

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

The post was mainly from a historical perspective, and therefore concerned with the early days of science, when it was known as natural philosophy, as it has been until quite recently. And it would be hard to make science without at least a little philosophy, such as the idea of experimental method behind it, science has of course gone its own way and may render all other philosophies outdated to the point where you may well ask if any of the others are valid any longer. Though I would say that if you reject theology then you need some philosophy, at least moral philosophy just to function. Religion certainly is not a philosophy, theology is quite different or the question would not be asked. about believers.

This came up on another post, but your opinions please ?

Geoffrey51 comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Can a believer in what or who do philosophy? Over the Millenia people have pondered who, what, why. Philosophy is not the domain of religion. Philosophy is people asking and questioning. Science proved or disproves. Neither are related to the outcomes of Theology as Theology is the study of God...

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

Good point. But of course theocrats are usually imperialistic and do not respect the boundaries with other diciplines. And historically christianity also picked up much philosophical lore, especially in medieval times, transfused through Rosicrucian style ideaology.

Whats the biggest difference being atheist/agnostic has made in your life so far?

Mofo1953 comments on Sep 28, 2019:

Freedom from fear and a peaceful satisfying life.

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

Yes, people forget negative benefits like "freedom from" sometimes, yet they still count.

If you have 12 minutes and 42 seconds to spare, don't go dizzy easily, this might be worth watching:...

Marionville comments on Sep 27, 2019:

No thanks! The music’s okay without the vertigo inducing visuals. Can you tell me what it’s purpose is?

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

@Marionville Thought you must know the music.

My thoughts and beliefs regarding our planet is to cause as little disruption as I can.

Fernapple comments on Sep 27, 2019:

Actually forgive my last flip comment I just could not resist. I respect deeply your effort to tread lightly on the planet. I do the same and find that it is hard, there being just a few things that I can not live without, this computer for one. But I do try to keep it until it is old, and all of ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

@moosepucky Have compost heaps, try to use as little packaging as possible. Don't use much in the way of goods at all anyway. But like you it is travel that is my weakness, living in a deep rural area I have no public transport for short journeys. And living on an island means that you have to fly for the longer ones.

IF GOD EXISTS, DO YOU THINK HE, SHE, IT GIVES A FLYING FIG WHAT YOU THINK?

Fernapple comments on Sep 27, 2019:

I don't give a flying fig myself. Come on Remiforce most of your posts are interesting, but wait till the barrel fills up a bit before you dip in, don't scrape the bottom.

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

@Remiforce That's why I don't make too many posts, i'm hoping they have not seen through me yet. LOL. I like this reply it works much better. It reminds me of the so called problem of evil, which I alway thought was one of the weaker arguments. Since it assumes that there is such a thing as evil, which is a big assumption, it then assumes that god recognizes and understands evil and that evil is not just a human construct. It can therefore be used against a god like the christian god, who claims to be good, but not a deist god, or some of the ethically neutral gods of eastern philosophy.

If you have 12 minutes and 42 seconds to spare, don't go dizzy easily, this might be worth watching:...

Marionville comments on Sep 27, 2019:

No thanks! The music’s okay without the vertigo inducing visuals. Can you tell me what it’s purpose is?

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

Dear Marionville. You deserve an explanation. The Mandelbrot set is a mathematical construct, as when you make a triangle by specifying the length of three sides, so the graphics you see are created just by iterating an equation, over and over through a computer. The truly remarkable thing about it being that the set goes on forever, or at least as far as we know, but it is produced by a simple equation, in fact an equation so simple it almost seems like a joke, zn+1 = zn2 + c. The colours are just random colours chosen to represent answers to the equation in geometric form. Music is the William Tell overture. If you keep watching you will see quite new things appearing all the time, and remember no one designed this, apart from specifying the colours it all just appears.

I've just begun my 59th year! Woohoo! Does life get better as you get older?

Fernapple comments on Sep 27, 2019:

Depends where you start from, if your childhood was truly evil then life can't do anything but get better. Happy Birthday.

Fernapple replies on Sep 28, 2019:

@Wildflower Me too. Best wishes for your future. Some of us know that childhood can be a form of purgatory, but like they say, what does not break you leaves you stronger, and hopefully more empathic to others who suffer.

My thoughts and beliefs regarding our planet is to cause as little disruption as I can.

Fernapple comments on Sep 27, 2019:

Bidet.

Fernapple replies on Sep 27, 2019:

@moosepucky Leaves.

Cults.

Flowerwall comments on Sep 27, 2019:

I wonder what defines a cult from regular religious belief. What is the determining factor where you can say this is a cult now. I know strict Atheists will say ALL religion is a cult, but I don't mean that. I was listening to a discussion on the radio of this very topic, but I couldn't finish ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 27, 2019:

Yes I do think there is no difference, except having a share of power in the political establishment makes you a religion. In other words, if you can subvert democracy then you are a religion, if you can't then you are still a cult.

How do you get over the anger you feel at religion when you’re a new atheist?

Fernapple comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Take a holiday somewhere secular. UK is nice.

Fernapple replies on Sep 27, 2019:

@LenHazell53 Yes but that's the great thing, there is nothing like having a state church to kill religion on the streets. And OK nowhere is totally secular but anywhere in northern Europe has to be when compared to the US bible belt. What it is not is democratic. Since now that less than half the population is C. of E. why are they not kicked out. At the very least there should be a seat or two for the Muslims, Hindus and of course the Humanists and Nones.

Sadly this has merritt

JackPedigo comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Evidentially, children have to grow up really fast but many leaders are still stuck in the past.

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

Always was the case. To get on in politics you have to know how to comply with other peoples old outdated ideas. Have an original one of your own and you are dead.

First Falls Netanyahu, Then Falls Boris, Next It’s Trumpty-Dumpty

Marionville comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Unfortunately Boris is far from down, and certainly not out! He is defiant and unapologetic!

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

Thank you, for a second I though. "I have been spending too much time on this adictive site and missed some vital news."

Back in Yuma, after a long day of travel. Got Miss Lisa (@Sassygirl3869) here, too.

Fernapple comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Nice to know that some people on this site do manage to get together in person, that must be fun.

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

@ToolGuy If they were single females they may be a little wary of an approach from a single male, so that's how life goes. But I had often wondered if it would not be possible to get a seven or ten together locally for something like a Yuletide dinner, as an anitdote to all the Christmas horrors.

It has been raining here IN AZ today pretty much constantly since a thunderstorm began at 4 AM.

Fernapple comments on Sep 25, 2019:

We don't get a lot in this part of the UK, but the small ones we call midges, have been bad this year.

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

@LetzGetReal It can also be what you have eaten of course, some people say that spicy food, savoury herbs like thyme and especially the smell of garlic on your skin wards them off. Can drive the opposite sex to a safe distance as well, so two benefits.

A very good opinion piece for history buffs. Not what you learn in school. [rt.com]

wordywalt comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Anyone who has seriously studied political ideologies knows that communism and naziism knows that the two are only alike in that both are totalitarian systems. Other than that, their bases, intellectual structures, and organization are entirely different. ,

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

@wordywalt My problem is that I have a knee jerk to anything that looks like an over simplification. Sorry its just the deep pedantic bore in me.

A very good opinion piece for history buffs. Not what you learn in school. [rt.com]

wordywalt comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Anyone who has seriously studied political ideologies knows that communism and naziism knows that the two are only alike in that both are totalitarian systems. Other than that, their bases, intellectual structures, and organization are entirely different. ,

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

@wordywalt I am sure that they are very different in many ways. But there are no side issues. Quite the contrary it is the things which all societies and cultures have in common which are the most fundamental and important. Including and especially the things which they have in common when they break down into totalitarianism, such as a total disregard for human life. Are you going to tell me that the forty milllon or so who died under those political systems are a side issue.

A very good opinion piece for history buffs. Not what you learn in school. [rt.com]

wordywalt comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Anyone who has seriously studied political ideologies knows that communism and naziism knows that the two are only alike in that both are totalitarian systems. Other than that, their bases, intellectual structures, and organization are entirely different. ,

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

@powder As i say, one of the few things that all totalitarian governments do have in common is that they all try to rewrite history. Whether the EU is trying that or not I do not know. But I do think that the so called liberation of Poland is certainly questionable. It is a funny liberation which does not even talk to the counties government in exile, and ships off large numbers of its senior army officers, who had been fighting the Nazi to be killed on mass.

A very good opinion piece for history buffs. Not what you learn in school. [rt.com]

wordywalt comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Anyone who has seriously studied political ideologies knows that communism and naziism knows that the two are only alike in that both are totalitarian systems. Other than that, their bases, intellectual structures, and organization are entirely different. ,

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

@powder I do not think it is ever quite that simple, after all A Hitler was for years a speaker for the communist party, and the Nazis believed in creating full employment by increacing public spending, which is about as left wing as you can get. The left right spectrum is a nonesense really it never really works for anyone, not even A. H.

A very good opinion piece for history buffs. Not what you learn in school. [rt.com]

wordywalt comments on Sep 26, 2019:

Anyone who has seriously studied political ideologies knows that communism and naziism knows that the two are only alike in that both are totalitarian systems. Other than that, their bases, intellectual structures, and organization are entirely different. ,

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

They were certainly very different in many deep fundamental ways, but I can't agree with totally different. All human societies have many basic things in common, such as for example both the Soviets and the Nazi did their best to rewrite history. Perhaps as the EU is today.

It has been raining here IN AZ today pretty much constantly since a thunderstorm began at 4 AM.

Fernapple comments on Sep 25, 2019:

We don't get a lot in this part of the UK, but the small ones we call midges, have been bad this year.

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

@LetzGetReal Yes, though it is more likely that it is due to higher rainfall and milder winters, since they breed mostly in standing water which does not freeze solid. On the other hand lower numbers of things which feed on them such as dragonflies may not help.

DO YOU THINK YOU WOULD TURN TO THE COMFORT OF THE CONCEPT OF GOD WHEN YOU'RE DYING?

Fernapple comments on Sep 24, 2019:

What is even worse is that the final comfort we give to many animals, is often denied to humans because of the historical legacy of theism.

Fernapple replies on Sep 26, 2019:

@Remiforce Death I have no problem with, and it is more than acceptable, but the dying is a different matter. I have witnessed people lying for hours in pain waiting for pain relief while medical staff were busy elsewhere, being forced to exert great effort for days on end to fight for breath by their bodies own reflexes, when they long since wanted it to be over, and lying for hours in their own shit thanks to a general lack of care. Not to mention the possible tedium of have nothing to do but stare at the ceiling for days after the power to communicate with others has gone. And that is is lucky few whose debility did not last for years.

DO YOU THINK YOU WOULD TURN TO THE COMFORT OF THE CONCEPT OF GOD WHEN YOU'RE DYING?

Flowerwall comments on Sep 24, 2019:

I did hear that some Agnostics/Atheists changed their minds on their death beds. One of the people was Charles Darwin. I heard this in a sermon, so I don't know the exact source of the where the Pastor heard it.

Fernapple replies on Sep 25, 2019:

@Flowerwall Yes I heard from a good historian, though I can not remember who, that it is quite untrue. Though who knows what happens on a death bed anyway. And of course there is no real evidence that Darwin ever left Christianity in the first place, for although he did not practice, to my knowledge he still remained in the church.

DO YOU THINK YOU WOULD TURN TO THE COMFORT OF THE CONCEPT OF GOD WHEN YOU'RE DYING?

Fernapple comments on Sep 24, 2019:

What is even worse is that the final comfort we give to many animals, is often denied to humans because of the historical legacy of theism.

Fernapple replies on Sep 25, 2019:

@Remiforce Yes I know there are practical dangers as well, but I do think that such problems can be solved, the main reason is still the legacy of theism. I have spent a lot of time by death beds, mainly those of people with cancer, and I can tell you that the amount of unneeded suffering caused, is beyond all imagination. I can also tell you that the line put out by the medical people, that they can manage death well with drugs and give a good quality of death, is often just BS, they tell to relatives and themselves to make their own jobs endurable, the reality is that for the most part they fail completely in that.

DO YOU THINK YOU WOULD TURN TO THE COMFORT OF THE CONCEPT OF GOD WHEN YOU'RE DYING?

Flowerwall comments on Sep 24, 2019:

I did hear that some Agnostics/Atheists changed their minds on their death beds. One of the people was Charles Darwin. I heard this in a sermon, so I don't know the exact source of the where the Pastor heard it.

Fernapple replies on Sep 24, 2019:

Its an urban myth.

Sometimes Catholic life can be humorous.

MissKathleen comments on Sep 24, 2019:

I love this story. My sister, the Sister, probably wouldn’t, even though she is married to “him”. After three tries with mortals, she finally got the “perfect” husband. And she doesn’t even have to do his laundry.

Fernapple replies on Sep 24, 2019:

I wonder if they have anything in common with those women who start relationships with prisoners, especially those serving life or on death row. Who they know they will never have any real contact with.

Intrepid scientists witness final days of Venezuelan glacier [apnews.com]

KKGator comments on Sep 24, 2019:

But Climate Change is a hoax created by the Chinese. Right.

Fernapple replies on Sep 24, 2019:

I hate to risk your ire, because I know that it is hotter than any of the fires of hell imagined by theists. But I think . "Climate change is a hoax created by the Chinese." Wrong.

A great (IMHO) video on the "dreaded" populist phenomenon. [youtube.com]

Marionville comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Spiked is a dedicated platform to bring an extreme, anti-EU agenda into the public domain. I therefore have no desire to comment. It is funded largely by the Charles Koch Foundation...it’s sinister tentacles reach everywhere.

Fernapple replies on Sep 24, 2019:

@OwlInASack The thing with evil regimes, is that they always appear strongest just before the times turn against them. Maybe I am wrong to assume that things are going to get worse, perhaps those little people beavering away below the radar will make a difference one day. I found the rise of J. Corbin a great hope, not because he was on the hard left, but because he was the first major politician for a long while who did not come from a patrician background, so it can happen. While in the education system the idea that education should be about raising expectations seems to be taking hold again, as we see with so many children taking an interest in things such as the environment. The old unholy alliance which used to exist in education, where the right saw the teaching of morality and raised expectations as only suited to a minority of the well educated upper classes, destined to serve the establishment, and the left saw it as a middle class betrayal of lower class values, may be fading. It would be hard not to see now what the long term consequences of that alliance are. I have to go now, have a good week.

A great (IMHO) video on the "dreaded" populist phenomenon. [youtube.com]

Marionville comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Spiked is a dedicated platform to bring an extreme, anti-EU agenda into the public domain. I therefore have no desire to comment. It is funded largely by the Charles Koch Foundation...it’s sinister tentacles reach everywhere.

Fernapple replies on Sep 24, 2019:

@OwlInASack Yes it is sad to hear anyone defend stupidity and ignorance on principle. Which is why I do not think that the Brexit issue is the main point here anyway. People are driven to defend outrageous ideas, such as anti-intellectualism, which they know in their hearts make will only make them look foolish, only because of the deepest desperation. It is only a trivial symptom of the deepening divide between the now hereditary patrician class and greater majority. And I am sorry to say that it is going to get deeper and I see no power on earth that will stop it. Racism is growing only because minority races like all minorities are seen as favourites of the political establishment, which of course they are not. Except in so far as the political establishment uses political correctness as a propaganda tool to appear to have the moral high ground, and thereby cover its deeper failings. That the political establishments adoption of a morality which it is plainly only faking, since its greed, moral decadence and complete callus indifference to real suffering, are obvious and transparent, of course only discredits all morality, and makes the minorities into a human shield. Since because hate is rarely well directed, the blows increasingly rain down on the minorities and other false targets such as intellectualism, only because they are seen as the outward face of the political establishment, while hatred spreads. Such things are only serving to take the blame which belongs with those who failed to teach moral values, and set an example of poor moral values themselves. Or show any remorse for abandoning their responsibility to educate the majority and stand for the high moral standards, which those trusted with leadership should.

A great (IMHO) video on the "dreaded" populist phenomenon. [youtube.com]

Marionville comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Spiked is a dedicated platform to bring an extreme, anti-EU agenda into the public domain. I therefore have no desire to comment. It is funded largely by the Charles Koch Foundation...it’s sinister tentacles reach everywhere.

Fernapple replies on Sep 24, 2019:

@OwlInASack I do not point the finger at the liberal left political establishment at all, and yes it is almost certain that the right may have to take most of the blame. But however you can not exonerate the left completely, nor can you neatly split the political establishment into two groups, that simplistic political spectrum view is the heart of the problem, much of the political establishment is in that sense apolitical anyway. And even to the degree to which it may be a purely right wing problem. which I doubt, it is still a failing of the left that it did not prevent the right from its wrongdoing.

I had no idea of his power!

Robecology comments on Sep 23, 2019:

He's perhaps the most intelligent, progressive, provocative pope they've ever had. He works hard to fulfill the vows to serve... He's a critical link between the #religulous of the world and us scientific/agnostics... He's one of us....disguised as a religious leader. ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 24, 2019:

@Robecology Yes but it is in the nature of life, that good people working hard with the best of intentions are often the ones who do the greatest harm. The man and his effects on history are two different things.

A great (IMHO) video on the "dreaded" populist phenomenon. [youtube.com]

Marionville comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Spiked is a dedicated platform to bring an extreme, anti-EU agenda into the public domain. I therefore have no desire to comment. It is funded largely by the Charles Koch Foundation...it’s sinister tentacles reach everywhere.

Fernapple replies on Sep 24, 2019:

@OwlInASack Yes I do agree that most of them are. But throwing insults only shows the contempt and moral failing of an equally if not more spoiled and privileged political establishment. Do not forget that they may be, "ignorant, less educated and anti-intellectual", "racist" and sometimes "massively privileged and unaware of it," and who was it who failed to raise them above that state ? Let me see, I think that would be a resposibility of the political establishment. The education of the majority is a responsibility of the political establishment alone. There is no one else. Yes it maybe that such a task is impossible, but that is only an excuse when every effort has been made, and you can not say that the political establishment ever used it position to, promote its own wealth and priviledge first, was never corrupt and never wasted resouces on fractional disputes between its left and right. Yes the majority of people may have many failings but make no mistake they are what the political establishment made them, and the buck does stop there.

I had no idea of his power!

Robecology comments on Sep 23, 2019:

He's perhaps the most intelligent, progressive, provocative pope they've ever had. He works hard to fulfill the vows to serve... He's a critical link between the #religulous of the world and us scientific/agnostics... He's one of us....disguised as a religious leader. ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 23, 2019:

@Robecology Yes but that could just lead to the making of a few token gestures by the church, which would do much to stifle its critics but little to correct its real evils.

So recently, a while after losing my faith, i finally realized i didn’t know anything about the ...

Varn comments on Sep 23, 2019:

As far as I know ..there isn’t such a thing as “*agnostic atheism,*” but you’re headed in the right direction! Hey - talk away! Don’t know that we can throw open our doors ..and lavish you with food & attention ...or offer you a daughter, or immortality … but we can assure the shit you...

Fernapple replies on Sep 23, 2019:

I may be wrong, but a gnostic atheist is one who claims to know there is no god, and an agnostic atheist is one who does not believe there is a god.

I had no idea of his power!

Robecology comments on Sep 23, 2019:

He's perhaps the most intelligent, progressive, provocative pope they've ever had. He works hard to fulfill the vows to serve... He's a critical link between the #religulous of the world and us scientific/agnostics... He's one of us....disguised as a religious leader. ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 23, 2019:

And is that good or bad.

Why why why do religious people think they can make a believer out of an atheist?

NoMagicCookie comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Why? Because they have been indoctronated into a faith based cult that does not sceptically / logically evaluate reality. Instead of my wand I usually respond with: I find your assertion laughable as I value demonstrable truth. Demonstrable means you can demonstrate and test a truth claim ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 23, 2019:

Sounds like hard work but I may give it a try.

Interesting Things That Don't Exist Physically - Language is imaginary.

Fernapple comments on Sep 22, 2019:

No don't agree, love can not be none existent , because as you say, " produced by the cumulative effects of physical, chemical, and psychological responses in our bodies." And the cumulative effects of physical, chemical, and psychological responses in our bodies, are real, therefore love is real, ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 23, 2019:

@adaptable1958 It is not easy to tell the two apart. Love for example is as said, " produced by the cumulative effects of physical, chemical, and psychological responses in our bodies." . And so likewise is pain, so here is a simple experiment. Go to church sit in a pew for half an hour and pray to the imaginary god that one of your arms should fall off. Then go home put your gas stove on, turn the flame well up and lay your hand on top of it for half an hour, it will not hurt since pain is imaginary, if god and pain are both the same you should still have two working hands.

Louie, my charge for the weekend.

Fernapple comments on Sep 22, 2019:

I hope he takes you somewhere nice and gives you lots of healthy exercise.

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

@Jolanta He will look after you well then.

Interesting Things That Don't Exist Physically - Language is imaginary.

Fernapple comments on Sep 22, 2019:

No don't agree, love can not be none existent , because as you say, " produced by the cumulative effects of physical, chemical, and psychological responses in our bodies." And the cumulative effects of physical, chemical, and psychological responses in our bodies, are real, therefore love is real, ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

@adaptable1958 Yes but there are two different levels of organization devised by the mind,because many of our imaginary systems are not real but are metaphors for things which are real, like love, money and inches, but some are metaphors for things like god and art which are not real in any sense. It is important not to mix the two up.

Perhaps sometimes you can do great things with just one plant.

Cutiebeauty comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Beautiful plant but what's that white on the ground, sand? Looks nice

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

@Cutiebeauty There are also boats, lifebelts, surf boards, a pond which is trying hard to be the sea, an old rusting anchor, beach huts and a lifeguard tower, shown.

A great (IMHO) video on the "dreaded" populist phenomenon. [youtube.com]

Marionville comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Spiked is a dedicated platform to bring an extreme, anti-EU agenda into the public domain. I therefore have no desire to comment. It is funded largely by the Charles Koch Foundation...it’s sinister tentacles reach everywhere.

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

I did not vote brexit and can not really comment on the US , but I do think that the labeling of those who did, with the rude names such as xenophobic and racist, has been a deplorable show of prejudice and name calling, which does reflect very badly on the remain side. I am sure that some of the brexit voters were both, but the reaction certainly exposes the fact that real unthinking contemp for the majority does exist in the political establishment, and to a degree justifies the wish of many voters for a more civil world and an end to class prejudice, which was no doubt expressed in the vote.

Perhaps sometimes you can do great things with just one plant.

Robecology comments on Sep 22, 2019:

I concur with the beauty of a monoculture border...but that spike is definitely not Verbena bonarensis. If you google it and type in images...you get things like this; ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

No it is not total monoculture, there is a bit of laburnum a spike of Echium and one or two other bits. I did think of editing and adding 'mainly' to the first line. But then I thought, no leave it simple and you might catch a pedant. LOL

Perhaps sometimes you can do great things with just one plant.

Cutiebeauty comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Beautiful plant but what's that white on the ground, sand? Looks nice

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

Yes sand, its a pretend beach, though it is twenty miles from the sea.

A great (IMHO) video on the "dreaded" populist phenomenon. [youtube.com]

MattHardy comments on Sep 22, 2019:

I'm not sure how I feel about flyover images of my home town being captioned "deplorables"

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

You would like a stronger word used ?

They say a person needs just three things to be truly happy in this world: someone to love, ...

mcgeo52 comments on Sep 22, 2019:

Could be right, I'm not really sure.

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

@mcgeo52 I think there is some truth in that, certainly that the main point about money is security. There was I remember a stat. produced a few years ago looking at income and happiness, which found that money is important to happiness for poorer people, but that extra income did not have any effect on people's happiness when they passed £15,000, (about 17,000 dollars) per year.

Wheelin' it in the MC - Part 1 - Street Photography 9 is in the suburb of Royal Oak

Fernapple comments on Sep 21, 2019:

Love the second one, that is a very cool lady.

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

@Lincoln55 Yes it was the bike that made her look cool, looks like a comfey one too.

Maybe this describes your views on things.

Geoffrey51 comments on Sep 21, 2019:

I love the use of “inhuman” rather than the expected “in human”. Gives a completely different spin. Nice one!

Fernapple replies on Sep 22, 2019:

Thank you.

Name something absurd about religion that you can't believe people actually believe it.

Fernapple comments on Sep 21, 2019:

The talking donkey who could see invisible angels.

Fernapple replies on Sep 21, 2019:

@silverotter11 Yes a lot, but though the donkey in Shrek was very funny, it was not nearly as funny as Balaam's.

Name something absurd about religion that you can't believe people actually believe it.

Fernapple comments on Sep 21, 2019:

The talking donkey who could see invisible angels.

Fernapple replies on Sep 21, 2019:

@silverotter11 Numbers 22:21 the story of Balaam.

I must get something off my chest: when I post and express a closely held opinion here on ...

Fernapple comments on Sep 21, 2019:

Look, just see offensive evil creeps like me as a challenge, turn it round on them lead them by the nose to the flaws in their logic. And if they block you for being really nice, count it as scoring a point. But unless they are threatening never block them, don't give the the satisfaction, but even ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 21, 2019:

@Winkiedink54 Will try harder.

Climate Change: The Trouble With Trees [youtube.com]

Robecology comments on Sep 20, 2019:

So #1. Earth is only 30% land. #2. Only 25% of that land is covered with forests; for a total earthly percentage of 7.5% CO2/O2 exchange. Even is we allow for 50% of our land coverage to become more forest-covered...that's still only 15% of world-wide total oxygen production. #3. Oceans cover ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 21, 2019:

@Robecology Yes but sorry while I agree that population is by far the main issue, and the main issue in all environmental damage. (If there were only ten thousand of us on the planet, it would not matter a bit what we did.) Things like global warming can not be tackled by any single approach, we have to totally commit and address it on all possible fronts as hard as we can, using every tool to hand. Even then we will almost certainly fail but there is no excuse for not committing fully.

Climate Change: The Trouble With Trees [youtube.com]

Robecology comments on Sep 20, 2019:

So #1. Earth is only 30% land. #2. Only 25% of that land is covered with forests; for a total earthly percentage of 7.5% CO2/O2 exchange. Even is we allow for 50% of our land coverage to become more forest-covered...that's still only 15% of world-wide total oxygen production. #3. Oceans cover ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 20, 2019:

Very true, but it has to be said that no one answer is enough, we have to do everything we can. Though trees are one of the small things.

How do you feel about light hearted things in the garden.

Cutiebeauty comments on Sep 20, 2019:

I like it... Looks interesting.... We should always have fun with the things we love...

Fernapple replies on Sep 20, 2019:

True.

Many of us pursue pleasure with such breathless haste that we hurry past it.

AnonySchmoose comments on Sep 20, 2019:

Thought provoking quote.

Fernapple replies on Sep 20, 2019:

@Marionville Pleasure is just warm sunshine. ( Mind you you probably have to come from the British Isles to understand why.)

Many of us pursue pleasure with such breathless haste that we hurry past it.

Cutiebeauty comments on Sep 20, 2019:

Oh yes.... And so many miss out when they pull out their cellphones and start taking pictures of everything! They see nothing...

Fernapple replies on Sep 20, 2019:

Yes I agree, you can make photos or you can make memories, so often people are so busy doing the first they forget to just look, smell, feel and listen.

IF YOU SAY YOU "BELIEVE", IS THAT ADMITTING YOU DO NOT KNOW, & IS KNOWLEDGE EVEN POSSIBLE?

Fernapple comments on Sep 19, 2019:

Simple there can never be absolute certainty of truth from either, you can only make approaches to the truth and try to find the closest position you can. Which usually means that which is supported by the most evidence and most resists disproof. That is why science works by disproof. If I throw ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 20, 2019:

@Remiforce You should put the last line into the quotes group page.

There are no clouds in my coffee, Carly, but the black glass top of my desk is full of them.

Justjoni comments on Sep 19, 2019:

Love this

Fernapple replies on Sep 19, 2019:

@TheoryNumber3 No the bins add something, they make a pattern and carry the black of the coffee cup through. Though you could have cropped the street out for more impact.

Do we need religion to provide a sense of justice?

WilliamFleming comments on Sep 17, 2019:

From a cosmic perspective the concept of justice is meaningless, however, in our daily lives the concept is socially useful. If you are playing chess you have to go by the rules of chess, etc. I think for some strata of society religion does provide a useful guide. For others prison is the guide....

Fernapple replies on Sep 18, 2019:

@WilliamFleming Of course but isn't our sense of justice just a tool for living in a group too. The fact that it can be distorted by cultural programming, does not affect its basic primal nature.

Do we need religion to provide a sense of justice?

WilliamFleming comments on Sep 17, 2019:

From a cosmic perspective the concept of justice is meaningless, however, in our daily lives the concept is socially useful. If you are playing chess you have to go by the rules of chess, etc. I think for some strata of society religion does provide a useful guide. For others prison is the guide....

Fernapple replies on Sep 18, 2019:

@Remiforce Sorry but you need to do a search on animal morality, there are hundreds of studies out there on the instinctual origins of morality and especially a sense of justice. It does not start with human culture. But even so whether it starts with human culture or in our animal natures, it certainly does come before religion, religions claims to have created morality and justice are no different from the claims it once made that it could bring the rains, just a way to get money and devotion out of people for pretending to provide what was theirs to start with.

A party from the county gardeners trust was the last group visit of the year to the garden ...

dede18 comments on Sep 17, 2019:

please tell us, is this a public garden which you're responsible for? it looks pretty big! but also, I don't see any autumn colours yet ... too early?

Fernapple replies on Sep 17, 2019:

It is a display garden attached to a plant nursery, we do tours for groups for publicity and raise money for the village bowls club by doing teas for them in the garden. The autumn will be here soon but the colours don't start until October usually in this part of the UK. On good days it is still warm to sit out, but the nights are getting colder, I shall close the business down for winter at the end of the month.

Not everybody wants thoughts and prayers after a disaster - CNN

WilliamFleming comments on Sep 17, 2019:

An offer of thoughts and prayers is nothing more than a simple expression of sympathy and support. IMO if such expressions seem offensive the offended parties are having irrational thoughts. Perhaps they are insecure in their unbelief, or they are thinking that they’ll be swamped in a sea of ...

Fernapple replies on Sep 17, 2019:

A bit rough, after all they may not mean it. LOL

There may NOT be life on other planets

Fernapple comments on Sep 14, 2019:

Your headline should read " intelligent life" not just life, since that is what you are talking about, that is not a very intelligent headline. The rest is very interesting, pity that spoils it. Though it has to be said that there may be more than one genetic route to high intelligence, and there...

Fernapple replies on Sep 16, 2019:

@JeffMesser Yes I have often thought that, that is why even microbes on Europa, or fossils on Mars would be so interesting, because we could possibly learn if they had any convergent evolution with our microbes, and if they use the same or similar DNA codes, or even RNA , or something quite different.

There may NOT be life on other planets

Fernapple comments on Sep 14, 2019:

Your headline should read " intelligent life" not just life, since that is what you are talking about, that is not a very intelligent headline. The rest is very interesting, pity that spoils it. Though it has to be said that there may be more than one genetic route to high intelligence, and there...

Fernapple replies on Sep 16, 2019:

@JeffMesser Exactness is not a property, but a quality, and being stuck means failing to advance to higher qualities. I am sorry we got off to a bad start, and so I will man up and admit I was a bit quick to critic a small fault, because it was late at night and I was washed up and grumpy. I should know better, I learned early not to post or comment when drunk or worn out, because standards tend to be high on this site. Now are you man enough to admit that your intro. was a bit sloppy, and then we can move on ?

Politics have no relation to morals. - Niccolo Machiavelli

Freedompath comments on Sep 15, 2019:

I see that now...but I once thought it has something to do with ‘serving the people.’ How can you ‘serve the people,’ without morels? I feel angry when I am ripped of, physically or mentally!

Fernapple replies on Sep 16, 2019:

A nice serving of morels, fried in a little butter, will certainly keep most of the people happy most of the time.

I thought that being the people you are, you would like to see a photo of a ruined church.

Justjoni comments on Sep 15, 2019:

How magnificent! Closest thing in North America is likely Anasazi ruins such as Mesa Verde, in terms of age. Really no comparison.

Fernapple replies on Sep 15, 2019:

I would though like to see the Anasazi ruins, they are certainly on my bucket list.

Watching Secrets of the Dead on PBS, it about a complete Bronze village in the Fens of England.

Dhiltong comments on Sep 14, 2019:

Human intelligence probably hasn’t changed in millennia, just our accumulated knowledge.

Fernapple replies on Sep 15, 2019:

There is some evidence which says that our brains started to decline after the advent of agriculture.

Just a thought that I've had since I was young trying to understand the rotation of the earth, and ...

Rob48 comments on Sep 14, 2019:

I have no understanding of the math or physics that might apply to time travel, so I can't address that portion of the post. However, I've always wondered what the explanation is for the fact that we sense none of the movement of the earth, even though, as you state, it's rotating at nearly 1000...

Fernapple replies on Sep 15, 2019:

@Winkiedink54 Thank you. I never taught although I do do some public speaking.

Don’t be afraid of words. Be afraid of hubris.

Fernapple comments on Sep 13, 2019:

At first it would seem that the vital question is not whether you call it god or nature, or if you call nature god, but whether it is in any meaningful way intelligent, or if nature/god is just an unthinking series of mechanical accidents. But then you have to say that even that question, even if...

Fernapple replies on Sep 15, 2019:

@skado Sorry although it does relate to the post where you quoted. “What is God’s nature?” It was mainly triggered by your last reply to TheMiddleway.

Famous writers and their odd ways of writing: writers -- 9/12/19

Fernapple comments on Sep 14, 2019:

Sad they don't mention one of the commonest, going for a walk first, many used that one including Charles Darwin.

Fernapple replies on Sep 15, 2019:

@Julie808 Me too, they say that their is a real link between just the physical act of walking and brain function. Perhaps because, when we were hunter gathering, walking defined the working day, our brains are therefore programmed to change up a gear when they sense we are walking.

This occurred in a comment on another post, but I thought it worth quoting.