TomMcGiverin's Profile

how many red flags can you name at the top of your head?

mordant comments on Feb 17, 2019:

Not wanting to meet friends or family might reflect anything from someone trying to cut you out of the herd and isolate you so they can control you, to a profound introversion or a sense that some of the people you hang with are toxic. My wife's extended family are real asshats and even she will ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 18, 2019:

@mordant My Match profile essay is totally different and much longer than the one I have on here. I did remove all the content on that one about the whole issue of family. As for the one on here, I think most women on here would get what I mean about that, at least the ones living in my area of Iowa, where we are bombarded with tons of propaganda about family friendly activities, family being first, etc. We Agnostics and Atheists are usually not very family connected in the first place, if for no other reason than being non believers and non conformists, so I'm not worried about leaving it on my one here. Women will get it and agree, at least the ones from my area. I have mentioned before in this forum that my hunch is that not having kids as well as being estranged from family is far more common among members of this site than the general population. In a nutshell, what I mean by not being very family-oriented, directed at the women from my area I am seeking to meet, is that I am not close with my family and that if I am not interested in dating someone who wants to visit their family with me every week or spend my time with them babysitting their grandkids with them regularly or spend most of our time together attending the grandkids ballgames, etc. I'd be glad to visit their family with them once a month or so, but I would rather spend most of our time together just the two of us. I don't want to be joined at the hip with a woman. I want us both to have friends outside the relationship. Yes, there is a lot of words and body language to it, but I bet most Agnostic women are on the same page as me and would get it pretty quickly.

places to meet people?

resserts comments on Feb 17, 2019:

I agree with a lot of what's been said here. Go places you find interesting without the primary goal being to meet anyone, specifically places where there's something to do and something to learn. E.g., if you join a book club, there may or may not be someone there you fancy, but you'll be exposed ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 18, 2019:

@resserts Thanks, dude. I guess after my wife's death, I thought it would not take that long to meet someone compatible to at least date, considering that my marriage to her was my only LTR and that it was a long and happy marriage. But instead I have found that my one good marriage and relationship resume doesn't., at least not by itself, impress anyone about my credentials as a potential partner with women on Match. That is a disappointment and a bitter pill to swallow. It seems like women who are divorced, which is the vast majority on dating sites, prefer to date fellow divorcees than men who are widowed. I'm sure they have their reasons, one of which is they want a partner who has shared that experience, but it galls me that they are picking that over meeting someone who might be better at relationships that someone who has had a failed marriage. I will give someone a chance even if they have been divorced, but at the same time, there's a good reason some people are divorced. In my case, it's not my fault that I'm widowed and I'd like to think that counts for something with most women.

places to meet people?

resserts comments on Feb 17, 2019:

I agree with a lot of what's been said here. Go places you find interesting without the primary goal being to meet anyone, specifically places where there's something to do and something to learn. E.g., if you join a book club, there may or may not be someone there you fancy, but you'll be exposed ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

You make a lot of good points. I am already doing all those kinds of things that involve interests I already had before becoming widowed. Those things do add to my life, as do my continued friendships. But I still miss having a partner and will be a lot happier if I find one. I was single until I was 36 and just know that I am much happier with a partner than without. Those years with my late wife before her dementia were the best and happiest years of my adult life for good reason. I want that again, even if it's with someone very different than her. I'm not going to fall into lying or rationalizing about that like I see so many people do on this forum.

how many red flags can you name at the top of your head?

mordant comments on Feb 17, 2019:

Not wanting to meet friends or family might reflect anything from someone trying to cut you out of the herd and isolate you so they can control you, to a profound introversion or a sense that some of the people you hang with are toxic. My wife's extended family are real asshats and even she will ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

@mordant I hear you. My late wife was a good match because her family was all out East. She was Italian-American too from upstate NY. She was not estranged from her family, but she had good boundaries with them and they did lived so far away that we visited together only once a year. They did not intrude on our lives at all. She was a very independent person who had lots of female friends here. I can't really say how functional a family they were because by the time we met all she had left of her immediate family was her mother and her sister. The mother already had dementia when we met and her sister is a Borderline Personality disorder who I clashed with from the start, as did my wife regularly. Since they both died, I have kept in touch with the sister by phone and we started getting along better after my wife got dementia, out of our mutual concern for my wife.

how many red flags can you name at the top of your head?

mordant comments on Feb 17, 2019:

Not wanting to meet friends or family might reflect anything from someone trying to cut you out of the herd and isolate you so they can control you, to a profound introversion or a sense that some of the people you hang with are toxic. My wife's extended family are real asshats and even she will ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

@mordant That's precisely what I am planning to do soon, even tho it feels sort of dishonest, it's better than being pre-emptively rejected by women (due to their cynicism, defensiveness, etc.) before I even get the chance to meet them and discuss it. Women in the Midwest, unlike the coasts, are just so damn less independent from their families that ones on the coasts, at least in my experience. So with them saying you are not family-oriented is like saying you don't believe in God to a Christian. It is like a fucking religion in itself around here, the whole worship of family thing.

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

@Gwendolyn2018 True, Gwen, but it does seem like the rarity of a reply is correlated inversely with how much higher the woman's looks level is from mine.

how many red flags can you name at the top of your head?

LiterateHiker comments on Feb 17, 2019:

1. Lies. 2. Complains about his/her ex. 3. Plays victim. 4. Controlling 5. Mean 6. Constant lateness 7. Lousy lover 8. Poor communication 9. Lashes out 10. Blames others. Refuses to take responsibility for their own behavior. 11. Does not follow through on promises. 12. Says "I love ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

@SeaGreenEyez Love the feline thumbs up!

how many red flags can you name at the top of your head?

mordant comments on Feb 17, 2019:

Not wanting to meet friends or family might reflect anything from someone trying to cut you out of the herd and isolate you so they can control you, to a profound introversion or a sense that some of the people you hang with are toxic. My wife's extended family are real asshats and even she will ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

Totally agree. It depends on what the friends and family are like and also how they treat the new friend or partner. I admit that I am not family-oriented, unlike the vast majority of women my age in my area, not on this site, but on Match. Those women also make a big deal in their profile essays about how big family is to them and it seems like a defensive move on their part to put off guys that don't want to spend either any or more than a little time with their family. I get all that and in my profile essay I make it clear that I am quite willing to do that, just not spend the majority of my time with the woman around her family. Even that does little good, because you can't force someone to read the words on the screen without adding on all their own baggage, fears, and misinterpretation of what you write. So even tho I don't bother messaging the women who do state they are family-oriented, I still get rejected by 90% of those I message because these women cynically assume that I am unwilling to spend time around their family at all. I have my reasons for not being family-oriented, but it's not something you can effectively address in a profile essay because of what I said above about interpretation. At best it's something you can discuss in trading messages or in person, but only if the other person is open-minded and trusting enough to let you get that far with them.

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

@Gwendolyn2018 Makes sense and that matches my experience too with paid dating sites. I've almost never gotten a reply when I messaged a woman expressing interest who was more than one point above me on the looks scale. It's like they couldn't be bothered to reply to the men who are below their league in looks. For that matter tho, I rarely get replies anyway when I message women, but the better-looking the woman, the less likely the chance of a reply. With women who are two points higher on the scale than me, It's almost never happened.

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

@Gwendolyn2018 That's because on dating sites people are presented with such a large amount of choices that they get overconfident about what level of looks in others they realistically have a chance to attract a partner in. Everyone, or almost everyone, is looking to trade up, like they are shopping for a car. They see all the different models of looks in people on the site and forget how limited they are in what models they can "buy" based on their own level of looks, overestimating how much the "worth" of their own model is. It's like trying to buy out of your price range for a car.

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

@Gwendolyn2018 Speaking of looking around at others, I began doing that years ago out of curiosity about this subject. And it has long been my observation at bars, restuarants, movie theaters, and concert shows that when you see people who are obviously a couple, they are very evenly matched in their relative attractiveness on the looks scale, a pair of 6s, a pair of 5s, a pair of 7s, etc. Like they were paired by a software program....

Adventures in Job Seeking: Yesterday I drove deep into the suburban Eastside for an interview ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 16, 2019:

I once interviewed for a job where basically the guy talked for an hour and a half and barely asked me anything. By the end I was uncomfortable about how it seemed like it was never going to end. I didn't get the job and I have no ideas what was going on with him. I suspect what happened that caused...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 17, 2019:

@Deiter Exactly, this guy did almost nothing but talk about himself for the whole interview. WTF?

No truer words have ever been spoken. ????

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 15, 2019:

To all the naysayers who claim there were no conspiracies behind the assassinations of JFK, RFK, MLK, Malcom X and Paul Wellstone, among others, just see what would happen if this man had ever gotten anywhere near being president. The major parties and corporations are so terrified of him that they ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 16, 2019:

@48thRonin It's very hard for people to first recognize that they live in a feudal plutocracy, then admit that they are so powerless and then finally agree to not react with willful denial of those facts because of how scary that feels. Most people are not strong enough to live with that kind of fear of their govt., but some are. In the former Soviet Union, people were every awake, even if that made life harder. Here, people are weaker and prefer to remain ignorant.

No truer words have ever been spoken. ????

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 15, 2019:

To all the naysayers who claim there were no conspiracies behind the assassinations of JFK, RFK, MLK, Malcom X and Paul Wellstone, among others, just see what would happen if this man had ever gotten anywhere near being president. The major parties and corporations are so terrified of him that they ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 16, 2019:

@48thRonin Interesting. I have found that I just can't talk to most people about this kind of stuff because it's just too scary to them to think that they really have little to no control of things when it comes to the system no matter what happens with elections and voting at the federal level.

No truer words have ever been spoken. ????

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 15, 2019:

To all the naysayers who claim there were no conspiracies behind the assassinations of JFK, RFK, MLK, Malcom X and Paul Wellstone, among others, just see what would happen if this man had ever gotten anywhere near being president. The major parties and corporations are so terrified of him that they ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@48thRonin Don't you get sick sometimes of ignorant people that accuse you of being nuts for believing that all or most of these deaths were conspiracy hits? I know I do....Most people are idiot sheeple who believe everything and only what the corporate media tell them.

No truer words have ever been spoken. ????

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 15, 2019:

To all the naysayers who claim there were no conspiracies behind the assassinations of JFK, RFK, MLK, Malcom X and Paul Wellstone, among others, just see what would happen if this man had ever gotten anywhere near being president. The major parties and corporations are so terrified of him that they ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@48thRonin I've heard rumors they threatened him and his family. After what happened to Wellstone, that is not an empty threat...After Cheney got pissed with Mel Carnahan of Missouri opposing the Iraq War and then his widow getting elected after Mel's convenient plane crash, the creeps learned their lesson and made sure they took out Wellstone and his wife in another plane crash. They may be ruthless creeps but they learn from their mistakes, at least in how to hurt people.....

This should make for a spirited conversation: The following is but one dude’s experience and ...

Hathacat comments on Feb 15, 2019:

Not my experience at all. I could look something up as proof (and to reassure myself that I WAS right) and he would still say I was wrong, or transfer it to "Well, by looking up the facts, you did it wrong". I don't, and never have yelled, which he would do as if yelling made him right. (Why I ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@Dandewine Most women in my area don't understand this because most have not been thru it. And even among those who have, most will not admit that this happens often so they will see my attitude towards family and not having kids as a red flag to reject me on instead of trying to find out what the story is behind it and if the problem is not me, but my family. People are generally fearful and lazy in their thinking, they just assume the worst about the person who is not mainstream and move on to the next profile. It's easier and safer than taking a risk, so that's what women do in this situation.

No truer words have ever been spoken. ????

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 15, 2019:

To all the naysayers who claim there were no conspiracies behind the assassinations of JFK, RFK, MLK, Malcom X and Paul Wellstone, among others, just see what would happen if this man had ever gotten anywhere near being president. The major parties and corporations are so terrified of him that they ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@48thRonin I hope you're right about her, but I used to feel afraid for Obama that some racist, if no one else, was going to shoot him. But after he got elected and started acting like a continuation of Bush's policies, I knew that he was just another sellout who would obey the ruling class and that they would make sure nothing happened to him.....I was proven right. If he had tried to be like Bernie, Nader or Cortez, the shadow govt. would have whacked his ass and set up some racist as a patsy, like with MLK.

This should make for a spirited conversation: The following is but one dude’s experience and ...

Cabsmom comments on Feb 15, 2019:

I generally apologize to anyone I argue with because I hate having tension between someone else and me. Even if I wasn't wrong in the big picture, I can always find something I did wrong in the argument. Maybe my attitude was wrong. Maybe I didn't listen enough to their side.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@germangirl90439 True. Glad I found that with my late wife.

This should make for a spirited conversation: The following is but one dude’s experience and ...

Hathacat comments on Feb 15, 2019:

Not my experience at all. I could look something up as proof (and to reassure myself that I WAS right) and he would still say I was wrong, or transfer it to "Well, by looking up the facts, you did it wrong". I don't, and never have yelled, which he would do as if yelling made him right. (Why I ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@Dandewine I saw a lot of sick shit between my parents as a kid. Like you, my mother would cry and then go to bed when my parents fought but she would also yell back at him sometimes too and he would also hit her. And people wonder why I am not family-oriented like most people in Iowa......Glad I never had kids and took the risk.....

This should make for a spirited conversation: The following is but one dude’s experience and ...

MissKathleen comments on Feb 15, 2019:

Hmmm... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=h4QnDf140f4

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@MissKathleen I do think that happens a lot. I have worked with guys that I've seen do this with women where the apology was not at all sincere or heartfelt, but instead only strategic.

This should make for a spirited conversation: The following is but one dude’s experience and ...

VictoriaNotes comments on Feb 15, 2019:

Abstract "Despite wide acceptance of the stereotype that women apologize more readily than men, there is little systematic evidence to support this stereotype or its supposed bases (e.g., men's fragile egos). We designed two studies to examine whether gender differences in apology behavior exist ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

Thanks Victoria.

This should make for a spirited conversation: The following is but one dude’s experience and ...

DoctoralZombie comments on Feb 15, 2019:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/20855900/

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

Thank you DZ. Glad we have scholars like you and Victoria, among others, in our midst.

This should make for a spirited conversation: The following is but one dude’s experience and ...

Cabsmom comments on Feb 15, 2019:

I generally apologize to anyone I argue with because I hate having tension between someone else and me. Even if I wasn't wrong in the big picture, I can always find something I did wrong in the argument. Maybe my attitude was wrong. Maybe I didn't listen enough to their side.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@germangirl90439 I would not be able to stand a relationship with someone so arrogant they could never admit they were wrong or apologize. Too damn much like my parents, esp. my father when I was young. It left me determined that I was never going to replicate those relationships with a woman.

If you're my Valentine, I won't be miserable now.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 14, 2019:

I still choose to be miserable, lol. Since I sang it at karaoke on Tue., I'll quote it for my fellow Moz lover DeStijl, "And heaven knows I'm miserable now".

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@DeStijl For lack of a better term. Sing songs from a lot of diff artists, whatever. Everything at karaoke is a cover song, lol.

What scents do you like on a man? Opinions welcome regardless of gender or orientation.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 15, 2019:

This ? reminds me of the immortal Ken Shabby, from Monty Python fame. "I use Essence Of Polecat.... Makes my skin nice and scaly....".

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@MissKathleen I still think it was the funniest TV series I've ever seen British or American...

If you're my Valentine, I won't be miserable now.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 14, 2019:

I still choose to be miserable, lol. Since I sang it at karaoke on Tue., I'll quote it for my fellow Moz lover DeStijl, "And heaven knows I'm miserable now".

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@DeStijl I have more vocal range (low to high) than Moz. I just love his songs. I cover a lot of other artists besides him..

What scents do you like on a man? Opinions welcome regardless of gender or orientation.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 15, 2019:

This ? reminds me of the immortal Ken Shabby, from Monty Python fame. "I use Essence Of Polecat.... Makes my skin nice and scaly....".

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@MissKathleen You had to see the show....

So, I was half way to Wheeling when I got the text.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 14, 2019:

If he doesn't call tonight and seem truly, deeply apologetic, you will know his earlier text was BS and that he is a bum. Hope things work out soon with someone, even if it's not him...Glad you still ended up having some nice food on V-Day.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@ProudMerrie True.

So, I was half way to Wheeling when I got the text.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 14, 2019:

If he doesn't call tonight and seem truly, deeply apologetic, you will know his earlier text was BS and that he is a bum. Hope things work out soon with someone, even if it's not him...Glad you still ended up having some nice food on V-Day.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 15, 2019:

@ProudMerrie Calling that late was horseshit. I think you have your answer.

So, I was half way to Wheeling when I got the text.

Stephanie99 comments on Feb 14, 2019:

Then again, for my first date with a very special person who I was with for years, I had work issues and was very late. That was before cell phones so I wasn't able to call and tell him. He still waited and wasn't even angry.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 14, 2019:

That's how you know they're really a keeper!

So, I was half way to Wheeling when I got the text.

Dancing comments on Feb 14, 2019:

Oh no! Sorry that happened to you. It is nice when you have more than one egg in the basket. It doesn't hurt as bad when one disappoints.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 14, 2019:

She's right. It's always easier to roll with it if you have other prospects, not that I've ever had that yet except for once in my earlier dating career before I met my wife. And even then it was only for a short time after I had placed a personal ad. I remember tho it helped me relax more when I met a women knowing they were not the only prospect I had. There's a lot of difference between that as well as what you have now and being a player, which is something more sustained and dishonest.

More than familial love. More than romantic love. Beer love.

Mitch07102 comments on Feb 14, 2019:

No offense, but if beer and burritos are the top of your love chain, you have issues. Serious issues.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 14, 2019:

@Deiter C'mon Deiter, we all know you have serious issues.....

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 14, 2019:

@Stephanie99 I never said anyone was ugly, I put them in the same class of looks as me, average, which I have had confirmed about me by many other folks. Sometimes the truth hurts and I have grown to accept that about other's opinions of my looks. The truth about how the online dating world works also hurts when one is not part of the upper leagues or classes of looks. That is not any judgement on the character, heart, or personality of those who are not great-looking, it is a reality of how that world works, which will not change, much as we would like it to. You may have noticed that Irishtx Judy seems to agree with me. I lost count long ago of the number of women who appeared to be the same level of looks as me that never replied to my messages to them. As Gwendolyn said in her comment a while ago, even most average-looking people are looking to "trade up" a little by only being interested in those who are a point or two above them on the looks scale. That's part of why there is so much frustration on the paid dating sites among those who are average or below looking. Not saying this accounts for all of my rejection by average-looking women that I have reached out to, but no doubt it accounts for some of it....

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 14, 2019:

@Stephanie99 You both must have missed the thread where Gwendolyn eloquently laid out a discussion on the subject of leagues and classes of looks regarding dating sites. She also used to write a column for a dating site. My last relationship was my marriage with my late wife. I began grieving the loss of her while she was still dying of dementia, in 2014, before she died two years ago. You don't know me and you are presuming a lot. We are done here.......

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 14, 2019:

@Stephanie99 Yes, it does work out to about $20 per woman that I met, but another way to look at it is that's about the price of one dinner per woman. Still worth it because I never bought a dinner for any of those women, only bought their coffee on the first meeting, maybe $2 cost. The few times I ate a meal with any of them, they paid for their meal, even after I offered to pay for the first one. I'm not rich, but I can easily afford this. If I meet someone more than once for a meal, I tell them in advance I would like for us to pay for our own meals. If I dated someone steadily, I would be more flexible about this, as I discussed in another thread....

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 13, 2019:

@Wildflower We'll have to respectfully disagree on that.....You yourself said that your experience of getting little interest on that site was due to your level of looks.....The guy I knew from the singles group had the same lack of interest in him, met about 6 women in one year on there. And he even had the handicap of having never been married. You can imagine how attractive that was to women who read his profile......

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 13, 2019:

@Stephanie99, @Wildflower That's kind of what I figured. I met a guy my age from a local singles group that was on the same paid site and had the same kind of experience. He's about the same level of looks as you and me, which I think for you as well is average looks. Like the research studies on dating sites have proven, paid dating sites are really only good for those who are above average-looking or better because those people get all the attention and interest as well as end up going on almost all the real dates while the average-looking or below just sit on the sidelines in frustration. The real dating on those sites appears to be all between those who are 7s-9s on the looks scale. 6 of those months were free, BTW, because if you pay for six months and don't find someone to date steady, they give you another 6 months if you have kept your profile visible the whole time, had a photo the whole time, and messaged 5 new members each month.

After almost 3 weeks on a dating site I have removed my profile because I just can’t take anymore ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 13, 2019:

The paid site I'm on seems to pretty well stay on top of the scammers and I think that's because they are the largest site out there and realize it's in their best interests to have staff police the scammers and help them maintain a good rep. They also have a free 6 month extension of your ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 13, 2019:

@Stephanie99 Already checked out that scene. Most of the people at dance lessons are already there with a partner and coupled. Also went several times to the practice/ballroom dance socials that were at a dance studio. Few women there my age, some of them already coupled, nobody that looked attractive enough for me or me for them. As I've said in another thread on this site, I've already done my research on trying to find women to date. Most people on this site are innocently speaking in ignorance about the reality of how you can and can't meet someone at our age. Because, unlike me, they HAVEN'T done the research.....

Every time I get on plenty of catfish, I immediately get messages from random women looking to ...

ToolGuy comments on Feb 13, 2019:

POF is less of a problem than FB. Most of mine come to me through FB, Messenger and lately Twitter. My Twitter PM has about 7 women there. Only one in recent memory from POF. Kind of a unique twist. I was first contacted by a woman on behalf of a shy friend or shy daughter of a friend (not really ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 13, 2019:

Yup, no doubt "she" is really attracted to average-looking old guys like us, lol!

Every time I get on plenty of catfish, I immediately get messages from random women looking to ...

ProudMerrie comments on Feb 12, 2019:

That's the same MO as the male scammers -- their photos are often movie star handsome and they're always looking for a wife. I like to lead them on until they cross the line and I can report them and get them booted off. But I do love just screwing with them sometimes and making them think they ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 13, 2019:

@CarolinaGirl60 Trolling for gullible women who are a sucker for a man in uniform, lol.

When I was 5 years old my mother always told me happiness was the key to life.

of-the-mountain comments on Feb 12, 2019:

Too bad our childhood logic is so alluring that we are taught not to listen too it!

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 13, 2019:

@dalefvictor One thing's for sure, Lennon was never anybody's fool.......

Every time I get on plenty of catfish, I immediately get messages from random women looking to ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 12, 2019:

See Deiter's two posts about an alleged Russian beauty that is after him, lol. I personally don't have any experience with that on this site. Had a lot of it on Our Time and only a bit of it so far on Match. Match seems to do pretty well at keeping them off their site because the staff appears to be...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 13, 2019:

@CarolinaGirl60 Guess Match won't be contacting you anytime soon to appear in one of their TV commercials as an endorsing member. We're all too old for them anyway and also not good-looking enough.

Every time I get on plenty of catfish, I immediately get messages from random women looking to ...

Cast1es comments on Feb 12, 2019:

Yet, except in my case , it's men trying to ,"romance," women into sending them lots of money,

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 12, 2019:

Like the old country song, " If you've got the money, honey, I've got the time...", lol!

Geriatric kamikaze pilot blasting through space at 35 mph

Sticks48 comments on Feb 12, 2019:

A hair raising story if there ever was one! :)

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 12, 2019:

@LiterateHiker Way more hairy than my two worst winter experiences, but the one thing in common was probably the real, palpable fear I had each time that I was in real danger of going off the road, getting stuck with no help for hours, and probably dying out there in the snow and cold. Each time I was driving down two lane roads that were white out and deep in snow, coming home from work and hoping I could blast thru the snow drifts on the road without getting stuck or hitting a stalled/stuck car in front of me that might be beyond my vision thru the heavy snowfall. After surviving both episodes, I resolved that I would never again risk my life driving thru deadly winter storms for a fucking job......

Geriatric kamikaze pilot blasting through space at 35 mph

Bendog comments on Feb 11, 2019:

"Women can't drive Kathleen" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0TcKBXVRps

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 12, 2019:

@LiterateHiker Professional driving instructors, including the one who taught me how to drive a school bus, have always said that women are easier to teach driving to because they start out with fewer bad habits as drivers. Confirms your case.

As rental prices rise, women stay in bad relationships to survive. [broadly.vice.com]

NoMagicCookie comments on Feb 11, 2019:

Brings to mind a teacher I once knew. She wore shorts and short sleeved shirts. Her job was educating a student who had oppositional defiance disorder. Her student (he was larger and stronger then she was) would often beat and kick the teacher without mercy. After noting her being beat up by her...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

Ah. the joys of capitalism, where being poor or in debt keeps you enslaved to abusive situations because you have no better options and the state will not entitle its citizens to have their basic needs provided for if they leave the abusive situation. Student debt is now the new form of indentured servitude like in colonial days of this country.The new economy of gig jobs, no OSHA enforcement, and contract employment is also the same way workers can always be found to work under the most inhuman conditions, akin to plantation slavery of the old days, because they will otherwise have only the options of crime or homelessness and starvation. And don't tell me that shelters and food programs are adequately preventing this or that even when they do that people are still able to keep their dignity and humanity.

As rental prices rise, women stay in bad relationships to survive. [broadly.vice.com]

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 11, 2019:

That's a longtime sociological fact, that when the economy is bad or rental prices are high, that more couples stay together out of economic need. It's a sad thing that few people talk about or admit, at least while they are doing it. Better economic times, not surprisingly, see higher divorce ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

@CarolinaGirl60 Sounds like he is also one of those damn Libertarian types, ie. "I made it all on my own, never needed charity or help from others, etc." What a lying, deluded fool. I hope you call him out on his shit and remind him of how he would be dead without all the money and help from others. But, that's your call as to whether he's worth the effort. You can't fix stupid, or delusional, for that matter.

I swear if my cat poops one more time.... I'll just clean out her litter box as usual ?

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 11, 2019:

The cat always knows that they are in charge, lol.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

@Capricorn Good to know that if you do croak for real, that she's smart enough to survive a while without eating you, lol!

As rental prices rise, women stay in bad relationships to survive. [broadly.vice.com]

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 11, 2019:

That's a longtime sociological fact, that when the economy is bad or rental prices are high, that more couples stay together out of economic need. It's a sad thing that few people talk about or admit, at least while they are doing it. Better economic times, not surprisingly, see higher divorce ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

@CarolinaGirl60 Neither one is more than mere survival, if even that in the case of the latter. That's why I'm socialist. Good people who are sick, unemployed, or in poor relationships should not be left with only those kind of choices or have to pawn their dignity to have a decent standard of living. This country is wealthy enough to provide that for everyone if we weren't all so divided on bullshit issues like race, sexual orientation, and cultural issues. We would have a government that served us, instead of the rich and corporations, and made sure everyone had their basic needs met if the private sector failed to provide it, like healthcare has proven to be a failure with private insurance.

White people can't be terrorists! [youtube.com]

LiterateHiker comments on Feb 11, 2019:

White men have committed more mass shooting than any other group. https://www.newsweek.com/white-men-have-committed-more-mass-shootings-any-other-group-675602

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

Two words... Tim McVeigh. I know this post is tongue in cheek, but even my sick sense of humor is a little uncomfortable with this line.

As rental prices rise, women stay in bad relationships to survive. [broadly.vice.com]

MissKathleen comments on Feb 11, 2019:

Women need to start sharing housing.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

That how women's shelters, first for abused women, and now for both abused and homeless women, first began back in the 70s.

As rental prices rise, women stay in bad relationships to survive. [broadly.vice.com]

thinktwice comments on Feb 11, 2019:

That is one thing I worked hard to prevent....I never want to be in a relationship because of homelessness or other financial worries...I would rather live with a group of like minded people than an abusive or non-working relationship....so sad

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

A while back I was considering taking in a male friend my age, but things worked out with his marriage. He would have had to sleep on the couch, but it would have been like a modern day Odd Couple.

As rental prices rise, women stay in bad relationships to survive. [broadly.vice.com]

kiramea comments on Feb 11, 2019:

I stayed with my last boyfriend way too long because I didn't have the money to move. If I had it to do over again, I would have found a way. I just didn't want to make my children homeless.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

I can't fault anyone for putting their kids first.

Geriatric kamikaze pilot blasting through space at 35 mph

Bendog comments on Feb 11, 2019:

"Women can't drive Kathleen" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0TcKBXVRps

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

Calm down dude (man in video)..... Bendog's tongue firmly planted in cheek......

Girlfriend wanted a cat ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 11, 2019:

Kitten has different colored eyes, just like David Bowie did.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

@Lisamarie68 So was Bowie, and I say that as a straight male fan of his. BTW, your cats are adorable.

I am really pissed off.

silverotter11 comments on Feb 11, 2019:

All of what you point out was well known and many tried to point out the truth of the gop/trump tax scam. Sadly they listened to Paul Ryan, mcconnell and trump. I heard many republicans in my apartment complex saying how good it would be, they would not listen to the truth. The only people who ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

@freeofgod I love to keep quoting LBJ, because he was so funny and wise about many things, but he once said something like that about Nixon. An aide of his asked him how he could tell that Nixon was lying in a TV appearance and LBJ said " Because his lips are moving". In my book, the only pol that was funnier was Bob Dole....

Geriatric kamikaze pilot blasting through space at 35 mph

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 11, 2019:

My dear, I bet you can't wait for spring and weather for biking and hiking....

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

@LiterateHiker Nope. You're a brave woman with the way you drive and hike. I'm more of a timid wimp, lol.

Retirement destination?

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 11, 2019:

I'm staying here, already retired, even tho the winters suck. because I will always need my friends too much to move away and I don't make new ones that easily. Even if I met someone special to share my life with, I'm not going to take the risk of moving away from my friends and ending up without ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

@OCJoe Especially when you get to be a senior, it's hard to make close friends from scratch. Plus, unlike you I'm widowed and looking for someone to date.

The things that we find aren’t all new but our forefathers decisions to ignore them in pursuit of ...

Elganned comments on Feb 11, 2019:

Unfortunately, the SCOTUS decided otherwise. It will take a Constitutional Amendment to fix it. I'm not holding my breath.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

Actually the SCOTUS decided this long before Citizens United. It was back in the 1970s in Buckley v. Valeo that money and speech were ruled to be the same thing. So real campaign finance reform would take a constitutional amendment overturning both decisions or else would take the court overturning both decisions. Neither one is ever going to happen......

The things that we find aren’t all new but our forefathers decisions to ignore them in pursuit of ...

WilliamFleming comments on Feb 11, 2019:

Corporations are just people. I don’t see how you can legally prevent people from donating money to whatever they want.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

Bullshit. I will accept that premise once we see one executed for the murder of an employee they are responsible for due to their policies. And I know for a fact corporations have already murdered many employees over the years in their pursuit of profits over safety.

I had a pain for 2-3 days in one testicle, pain was very similar to pain when it's hit.

flithyMONKEYmen comments on Feb 11, 2019:

Ummmm

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

Fry is so clueless......

I am really pissed off.

silverotter11 comments on Feb 11, 2019:

All of what you point out was well known and many tried to point out the truth of the gop/trump tax scam. Sadly they listened to Paul Ryan, mcconnell and trump. I heard many republicans in my apartment complex saying how good it would be, they would not listen to the truth. The only people who ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

@silverotter11 I don't bother trying to educate or argue with those kind of folks. As I've quoted before on these boards, the eternal words of a former college prof of mine, " Confuse not the minds of the ignorant, they will only hate you for it". Speaking of H& R Block, I am off to there later this week for my taxes. Now that my late wife's estate is settled, my return is fairly simple so I will go there.

I am really pissed off.

silverotter11 comments on Feb 11, 2019:

All of what you point out was well known and many tried to point out the truth of the gop/trump tax scam. Sadly they listened to Paul Ryan, mcconnell and trump. I heard many republicans in my apartment complex saying how good it would be, they would not listen to the truth. The only people who ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

A lot of average income people got conned by Trump and the other Repubs about the tax cuts, but those kind of people are always either too dumb to see that those cuts are only designed to help the rich and corporations or else too embarrassed about being chumped to ever admit it to anyone. Here in Iowa, also, a lot of farmers voted for Trump believing his lies about taxes and trade policy as well as renewable fuels and are now finding that he lied about all of it. He imposed tariffs that are hurting farmers as well as reneging on fuel standards so that ethanol made from corn here is not used as much for gas as he led farmers to believe it was going to be.

Hi I'm looking a man who truly needs my love

maturin1919 comments on Feb 10, 2019:

Did you guys start eating popcorn without me?

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 11, 2019:

You guys are so bad! As Deiter said recently, I'm sure she has enough love for all of us, lol.

DATERS! Throughout time the first meeting between a man and a woman was called a date.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 10, 2019:

The protocol has changed with online dating. Nowadays the first meeting of two people is for coffee in a public place. It is pretty much an informal interview meeting. That is why I call mine coffee meetings. If the first meeting goes well and both people are interested in seeing each other again ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 10, 2019:

@lerlo Far from my first rodeo. I'm old enough that I did voice personal ads, without much success, back in the early 90s for a few years before I met my late wife.

DATERS! Throughout time the first meeting between a man and a woman was called a date.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 10, 2019:

The protocol has changed with online dating. Nowadays the first meeting of two people is for coffee in a public place. It is pretty much an informal interview meeting. That is why I call mine coffee meetings. If the first meeting goes well and both people are interested in seeing each other again ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 10, 2019:

@lerlo In the old days before internet dating, people who connected thru mutual friends or personal ads would meet up for the first time usually on something more substantial than a coffee meeting, since they wouldn't already have the online messaging and profiles to trade info first. They wouldn't know what each other looked like. So with the advent of online dating, the coffee meeting became the natural way to start the in-person process after some info as well as photos had already been exchanged. Women basically set this new protocol since they preferred a relatively brief, safe, public way of meeting for the first time.

Honesty and/or the lack of it is one of the biggest factors in relationships today.

MissKathleen comments on Feb 10, 2019:

Except that society pressures us to be “like everyone else” from infancy, so we learn to not be ourselves. It can take a lifetime to overcome.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 10, 2019:

I hate forced conformity and have always resisted it. Unfortunately, I'm part of a small minority. There are very few of us in the Midwest.

Why is it that nearly all of the ladies who show up with high compatibility scores for me are in ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 9, 2019:

Don't count on it. In my local area, no new women my age have joined in the last 15 months. As far as the handful my age that are in my area, I messaged almost all of them long ago and struck out with them all. Of course, none of them were ever involved in the forums and interested in the community ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 10, 2019:

@BBJong Have already tried that, doesn't work.

Men don't like intelligent women.

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 10, 2019:

All other things being present with the woman (common interests, physical attraction that's mutual), I won't date a woman that's not intelligent, emotionally strong, and independent. I'm not attracted to women who don't have these last three qualities. But I concede that my standards are probably ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 10, 2019:

@MsDemeanour I'm going by the statistics I've read. Gays and lesbians are supposedly about 10% of the population. Agnostics and atheists are supposedly about 2-3% of it.

Men don't like intelligent women.

ladyprof70 comments on Feb 9, 2019:

My experience is that men say they want an intelligent woman, but their definition of 'intelligent' is someone who is smart enough to recognize how smart they are and who doesn't drool on herself. I think intelligent women are also generally independent and strong and I'm not sure which or how many ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 10, 2019:

@ladyprof70 The part about schedules makes sense, but I'm skeptical about your statements regarding men's occupation being that typical of female docs. And even so, it says that they will not date a blue collar or service worker (no matter how well educated or intelligent), even if he can support himself. Probably because that would sound too embarrassing to their high income, upper class friends. As always, money or social class rear their heads in the selection process.....

Men don't like intelligent women.

ladyprof70 comments on Feb 9, 2019:

My experience is that men say they want an intelligent woman, but their definition of 'intelligent' is someone who is smart enough to recognize how smart they are and who doesn't drool on herself. I think intelligent women are also generally independent and strong and I'm not sure which or how many ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 10, 2019:

Because they won't date below their financial or class level with someone like me who would appreciate them. Instead they insist on only dating men at their own level of money and status who probably feel threatened and in competition with them. Men who can easily date someone younger or better looking to be a trophy wife and not any kind of threat or competition to their ego. Some pick mates for their achievement and how impressive their resume sounds when introducing them to friends, family, and at parties. The smarter folks choose according to who values relationships more than achievements and is better at actually doing them than most people are.

How do you deal with someone you really like, have to deal with an hour or more transit and might ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 10, 2019:

Good luck, taking turns staying overnight sounds good, like cutie says. But I won't do LD.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 10, 2019:

@zorialoki Long distance relationship.

Why is it that nearly all of the ladies who show up with high compatibility scores for me are in ...

TomMcGiverin comments on Feb 9, 2019:

Don't count on it. In my local area, no new women my age have joined in the last 15 months. As far as the handful my age that are in my area, I messaged almost all of them long ago and struck out with them all. Of course, none of them were ever involved in the forums and interested in the community ...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 9, 2019:

@BBJong Yup, esp. on Match, I just can't catch a break with so many of the women my age in this area being farmer's daughter types that all grew up in the Midwest and are big on family, country music, college sports, social drinking, and Christianity, etc.. They sure don't want an Agnostic, hipster, non-conformist like me. On the other hand, whenever I do run across a woman on Match that is a transplant from the coasts, they always turn out to be exactly the kind of hipster I want. But they don't want me because it costs a lot more to live on the coasts than here and those women are also higher income than me and are used to being with doctors, lawyers and other big money types. So I can't win either way.........I'm too old and stubborn to move, so what's your advice John?

Why is it that nearly all of the ladies who show up with high compatibility scores for me are in ...

DevraisA1 comments on Feb 9, 2019:

I feel exactly the same way, but in reverse! Most of the men I am compatible with are nowhere near me. What is going on? I didn't think finding an intelligent, funny gentleman who lives in California would be so difficult.

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 9, 2019:

That's what I would think too. All the women I've got to know on this site that seem compatible with me of course live far away too, at least a few hundred miles away and I'm not doing LD.

After a thought-process-altering experience with a man with whom I became embroiled on an online ...

SecularCat65 comments on Feb 9, 2019:

I'm 65 an didn't have my first(what i thought would be for life) relationship in my mid 50s . I brought her to meet my parents while my father still living an she got to meet the family who fell in love with her as well.She had health problems while we were together an it was breast cancer that took...

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 9, 2019:

I hear you, man. I met my late wife at age 36 for my first serious relationship and she died two years ago. No kids myself and dating at our age is so tough to find anyone compatible. I started seeing a therapist a couple years after my wife got dementia and it helped me cope with that as well as now dealing with being widowed and trying to date. Don't have the cats or Netflix, but that sounds like a good move. I tried a couple groups for widowers as well as singles group for over 50 folks too, but they all turned out to be of little use after a few months. None of the groups had my type of folks in them, except the singles group had a woman that I became friends with and am still friends with. I found with the widower's groups that I had already finished my grieving after going to them several months so I quit as there wasn't anyone there I would want to date either and that they were almost all way older than me, same as with the singles group. The women in the singles group were almost all divorced and not interested in dating again, plus they all seemed bitter about their divorces. Not a very positive environment.

Greetings Agnostics! Call me Mr.

FrayedBear comments on Feb 9, 2019:

A 45 yo. Polish acquaintance brought to Australia a drop dead gorgeous 23 year old with multiple uni degrees several years ago. No longer in touch so I don't know if they did get married. His vain 8 yo daughter thought her father had brought her in as a playmate for her!

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 9, 2019:

@FrayedBear Just kidding FB.

Greetings Agnostics! Call me Mr.

FrayedBear comments on Feb 9, 2019:

A 45 yo. Polish acquaintance brought to Australia a drop dead gorgeous 23 year old with multiple uni degrees several years ago. No longer in touch so I don't know if they did get married. His vain 8 yo daughter thought her father had brought her in as a playmate for her!

TomMcGiverin replies on Feb 9, 2019:

Maybe Trump mentored him...

Greetings Agnostics! Call me Mr.

ProudMerrie comments on Feb 8, 2019:

There's just nothing a girl loves any more than solid concrete.