[jta.org] British and US soccer teams - fighting anti-Semitism - are participate on May 2nd in a...

dan325 comments on Apr 18, 2019:

Good on them. (I can't access the article, however.)

[rawstory.com] i posted this in politics and then decided to share it to this group too. i was ...

dan325 comments on Apr 17, 2019:

Couldn't happen to a nicer guy. Now he's free to work as a chef in a white supremacist compound.

So is anyone ever on here?

dan325 comments on Apr 17, 2019:

Evidently I am.

Both of these houses were awesome.

dan325 comments on Apr 17, 2019:

I'm so old that I was an adult when these cartoons first appeared.

how to appear blurry

dan325 comments on Apr 17, 2019:

I've always wondered how all those critters pulled that off.

Is Seltzer Jewish? And 99 Other Argument-Starters A new book offers an irreverent list of the ...

dan325 comments on Apr 17, 2019:

Okay, what about borscht? Jewish or Russian?

[jta.org] How Jewish groups are planning for the next Pittsburgh. Flee vs hide, communication key...

dan325 comments on Apr 17, 2019:

Good article, but they left out one more option - fight. Swarm the attacker where feasible; run into an enclosed room and station a couple of people on either side of the entrance, ready to grab the attacker's weapon and/or weapon arm as he enters; various other methods if anyone's interested. (These ideas are based on an Israeli krav maga instructor's book on surviving various types of assaults.) I realize this probably wasn't feasible for the Pittsburgh attack due to the advanced age of the victims, but it should be considered in most such situations. People should be taught the principles of when and how to attack an attacker, combined with when and how to escape. Sometimes a combination of attacking and escaping will work as well.

Works for me

dan325 comments on Apr 17, 2019:

And, I'm really good at it!

Probably won't get that wind in the face feeling, tho.

dan325 comments on Apr 15, 2019:

No bugs in your teeth, either (unless they're really slow).

[motherjones.com] Can Jay Inslee running on climate change be an effective Democratic candidate? ...

dan325 comments on Apr 15, 2019:

I heard this guy interviewed a couple of times and really liked him. I'd absolutely support him, although I can't see how he'll receive enough recognition to get into the top tier of candidates. I agree with him about climate change being the most important issue we're facing. He may not become the candidate, but at least he's forcing more attention to the issue.

[jta.org] This cartoon matzoh character is huge in Holland and not just among Jews. It's story is...

dan325 comments on Apr 15, 2019:

Very interesting - both amusing and serious. What next - a superhero kosher hot dog? I could really get behind that.

[msnbc.com] A watch over missing inaugural ball money for Fuhrer Trump adds another layer to odd ...

dan325 comments on Apr 14, 2019:

This, coupled with the strange Chinese lady who showed up at Mar a Lago with cellphones and malware that she purportedly intended to swim with, unquestionably brings us into the twilight zone.

[forward.com] Passover preparation with feminist rage. - a humorous piece worth reading.

dan325 comments on Apr 14, 2019:

Yikes! Why would anyone put herself through this? It makes me feel relieved to be a secular Jew, neither obligated nor willing to commit to the religion's bewildering tangle of rules.

Welcome to several new members of Leftists today. We do not like Fuhrer Trump or approve any of his ...

dan325 comments on Apr 14, 2019:

Interesting and disturbing article referenced by ToolGuy, below. The Democrats have always had a unique talent for shooting themselves in the foot and are showing every sign of doing it again.

Hi all.... Newbie to the group. Deleted my facebook, twitter, instagram, snapchat... about a year ...

dan325 comments on Apr 11, 2019:

Welcome, and feel free to speak your mind.

For some reason I think other introverts might relate to this too.

dan325 comments on Apr 10, 2019:

I know this song all too well.

[yahoo.com] Judge issues injunction against Fuhrer Trump asylum policy. - KUDOS TO THE JUDGE - HE...

dan325 comments on Apr 10, 2019:

This will be appealed, and if it reaches the corrupted Supreme Court, who knows what the outcome will be.

[nytimes.com] It will take over 2 years for the unstaffed Trump administration to reunite over ...

dan325 comments on Apr 10, 2019:

And now Trump is clearing out the DHS staff because they were terrible but not terrible enough, and he wants to reinstate the separation policy. Kinda makes me wish there was a hell.

I grew up in the 40's in Paterson, New Jersey with many Jewish playmates.I told my mother that I ...

dan325 comments on Apr 10, 2019:

Wait - you WANTED to be circumcised? Ouch.

[aish.com] 2 Odd Meshugana Failed Attempts to Establish a Jewish Homeland - In Siberia and ...

dan325 comments on Apr 10, 2019:

I'm surprised the world "leaders" didn't all get together and ship us off to Antarctica. (It's probably just because nobody thought of it.)

Hitler wrote "All it takes for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing". Many people ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

I think most of Trump's hard-core voters believed they were doing good, or at least making the best possible choice. I cannot get past the astonishing inadequacy of their thinking, however. As to Trump, his appointees, and his congressional enablers, I think they're doing what they think will benefit themselves and do not care one iota about anyone else.

[forward.com] I loved Audrey Hepburn. Dutch born, resistance fundraiser for the ballet, she was ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

I did not know any of this. I'd always assumed she was just another privileged, uninteresting movie star. Turns out she was worthy of great respect.

A good heartfelt op-ed against racism in the US (nothing directly to do with Judaism or ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

Excellent article and right on point. When the founding fathers endorsed the phrase "all men are created equal," they were full of shit. Black people weren't equal. Native Americans weren't equal. Women weren't equal. Poor people weren't equal. And although they've improved, those inequalities still prevail.

Now with trump destroying our country. It feel like it’s Good against Evil . Is it because he ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

It definitely feels like it's good against evil, and evil is kicking our ass. I think the Republicans started turning evil when the South embraced them because the Democrats were no longer actively supporting racism. This would have been in the mid or late sixties. Nixon accelerated the trend, and Reagan added the "greed is good" and "screw everyone but the rich" factors. It's been nothing but downhill ever since. Where does it end? Nobody knows, but so far, it doesn't look good.

[alternet.org] William Barr's congressional testimony makes it clear that he is Trump's in every ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

He's the AG for the US in name only. He auditioned for the job by writing in favor of presidential immunity. He's doing his best to bury the Mueller report. He's heading up Trump's battle to repeal what's left of the Affordable Care Act. It's been obvious all along that he's Trump's sock puppet. The Democrats and "moderate" Republicans who voted to confirm him should be tossed out of office in disgrace. (I'd rather see them tarred and feathered, but I think there's some stupid law against that.)

[theatlantic.com] Israel votes for Prime Minister as American Jews and Netanyahu, POS, grow ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

I agree so much that it hurts. Netanyahu and his right-wingers bring shame upon the rest of us.

I don't follow politics consistently, so I am only just now coming to this. As to Miller being ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

As to Miller being from the same broader species as I am, blech.

History repeats itself

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

The sooner, the better.

[yahoo.com] Fuhrer Trump orders firing of Secret Service Chief. - Is he worried that they are ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

I think he's firing everyone so he won't have to listen to them saying his proposed actions (pick almost any) are illegal.

[yahoo.com] Fuhrer Trump tells American Jews that Netanyahu is your Prime Minister. - WTF!!!!! ...

dan325 comments on Apr 9, 2019:

Did they really wear red yarmulkes with Trump's name on them? It must have looked like a clown college reunion. All they needed was to put propellers on top of the yarmulkes to look completely ridiculous.

Interesting that America could accept a gay president before an atheist president. A gay atheist ...

dan325 comments on Apr 8, 2019:

Pretty much the same people who would be against a gay president would be against an atheist president. The numbers and group composition (religious conservatives) wouldn't line up exactly, but they'd be pretty close.

I'm genuinely looking for feedback on a train of thought I recently had. As I'm not an expert in ...

dan325 comments on Apr 8, 2019:

This certainly seems like a theory that would be well worth pursuing through further research.

[yahoo.com] Fuhrer Trump shakes up the leadership of the Homeland Security Department. What does ...

dan325 comments on Apr 8, 2019:

Of course the Rethuglicans will submit to their fuhrer. And Trump is just following his usual policy of replacing horrible appointees with even more horrible appointees. I'm running out of negative superlatives with this asshole.

[jta.org] Its a Las Vegas honeymoon of sorts for Fuhrer Trump and Republican Jews - This makes me...

dan325 comments on Apr 8, 2019:

Save me a space at the vomitoreum, if I can refrain from puking long enough to get there.

Song for the constructed thought. [youtube.com]

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

I love this. One of my all-time favorites - maybe my favorite of all. Never heard it as a piano solo before - thanks!

[yahoo.com] Fuhrer Trump trolls Representative Omar as hating Israel at a Jewish Republican Party...

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

Trump is a compartmentalized anti-semite. He only hates Jews who aren't Republicans (i.e., most of us).

[yahoo.com] POS, Devin Nunes, Fuhrer Trump spy for his administration plans to send 8 criminal ...

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

I don't think he can provide these referrals in the name of Schiff's committee unless Schiff goes along with it. However, he probably can send them as an individual Representative. Who knows what the Justice Department (which has lost a huge amount of credibility under Barr) will do with them?

No people ...

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

I need to post that sign in front of my house.

Something like that

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

Where are these happy people of whom you speak, and what are they happy about? Inquiring minds want to know.

[m.facebook.com]

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

I grew up in a not-so-hot neighborhood in Queens (New York). I played roller hockey in the streets, walked where I wanted, went to Saturday matinees with other kids, was bullied until I learned to fight, was riding the subway alone by the time I was twelve, and wouldn't change any of it for today's sheltered world. (Well okay, I could have done without the bullying.)

Does anyone have reading recommendations for Middle East issues, particularly the history of the ...

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

"Dear Zealots" by Amos Oz provides a thoughtful and insightful perspective.

Move over God

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

Speaking as an introvert, I'm sure you're absolutely right!

Some Socialism Is Already Here! [huffpost.com]

dan325 comments on Apr 7, 2019:

Americans (especially older ones) have been conditioned to believe socialism is somehow evil, without even being sure what the term means. That's due to a combination of poor education and a concentrated effort by the owners of big businesses (especially big media) and their political lackies.

Before joining I just wanted to check with y'all to verify that I will be welcome. I am a left ...

dan325 comments on Apr 6, 2019:

As far as I'm concerned, you're welcome to join. I'll undoubtedly end up arguing with you on some issues, but you seem reasonable enough to make it worthwhile.

Imagination works!

dan325 comments on Apr 6, 2019:

Or blithering idiocy.

Put the blame where it belongs:

dan325 comments on Apr 6, 2019:

We can, but apparently the Republicans and centrist Democrats can't.

[yahoo.com] Michael Cohen wants to avoid prison and offers millions of files concerning Trump to ...

dan325 comments on Apr 6, 2019:

If these documents actually help to flush the orange turd and all his little dingleberries, it's worth letting Cohen go free.

Truth!!!!!

dan325 comments on Apr 5, 2019:

She's everything the Republicans hate - a brilliant, organized, articulate and ethical young woman who won't defer to their bullshit.

Greetings fellow Hoomans! I've just joined here, again. Thought I was already a member but WTH. I...

dan325 comments on Apr 5, 2019:

Depends on how you define "Zionists." If you restrict your definition to people who wanted a Jewish homeland to protect themselves from anti-semitism, then maybe, maybe not. The U.N., and particularly the British, were very influential in the creation of the Jewish state, mainly because they wanted a remote place to put Jewish refugees that wasn't one of their own home countries. Palestine became a British protectorate, which the British tried to hold onto but finally loosed, in part due to Jewish revolutionary activities (including terrorism). Finally, the U.N. carved Israel out of Palestine and declared it an independent country. I haven't really done justice to the whole history here, but as you can see, there's no simple answer to your question.

[aish.com] Are Jews Too Powerful? - Alan Dershowitz - I have mixed feelings about this lawyer's ...

dan325 comments on Apr 5, 2019:

I've always felt that Dershowitz is a right-wing putz, and this article does nothing to change my opinion. I agree with you about Israel. We have no obligation to support a country that behaves immorally just because it is a self-styled "homeland for the Jews" and we happen to be Jews. Decades ago, Israel was a place we could be proud to support. Sadly, that's no longer the case.

Are you openly Jewish? By language, by name or even by stating such in the normal course of ...

dan325 comments on Apr 5, 2019:

I'm very open about being both an atheist and a Jew, and particularly around those who are openly prejudiced against either. I prefer to let people know my status as soon as reasonably possible, so they can either avoid embarrassing themselves in the future or go ahead and expose themselves as bigots (which rarely happens). I don't have a Jewish name, nor do I observe the holidays or traditions (other than eating Jewish food whenever possible), but that makes me feel all the more motivated to express who I am.

Anti-Semitic Rally In New York City "There was a rally of “Polish nationalists” protesting a ...

dan325 comments on Apr 4, 2019:

Beware of those who embrace the term "nationalist." It's generally code for "white Christian supremacist." It's ironic that these "nationalists" taunted Jews by waving dollars at them, when their own reason for protesting was that they object to returning the property that their fellow nationalists stole.

[aol.com] Ohio Rep, who tried to overthrow Nancy Pelosi as Speaker of the House, Tim Ryan, throws...

dan325 comments on Apr 4, 2019:

Bleh. Better than Trump, but who isn't?

[msnbc.com] Trump eyes a non-economist, Herman Cain, for the Federal Reserve Board. He is not ...

dan325 comments on Apr 4, 2019:

Of course it's just because he supported Trump, although the fact that Cain's a fellow nut probably helped with Trump's decision. Trump's appointments are the ultimate Upside-Down - he appoints the people who are most likely to destroy the missions of the agencies they'll head.

Being a free thinker helped me as I could think outside the box. I discovered an old chess opening ...

dan325 comments on Apr 4, 2019:

A free thinker is simply someone who lets her/his mind explore beyond any set limitations, real or imagined. As @ponz111 did with these neat chess moves.

[jta.org] 3 Locations in Norman, Oklahoma are vandalized with swastikas and anti-Semitic ...

dan325 comments on Apr 4, 2019:

Ugh. It's like a kind of mental rabies. Since we can't shoot them, we need to lock these people away. (I really, really want to shoot them, but my damn personal ethical code says the death penalty is wrong. Crap.)

[alternet.org] Michael Bennett, Colorado Democratic Senator blows up on Mitch McConnell for ...

dan325 comments on Apr 3, 2019:

The judiciary is slowly becoming a Republican subsidiary. So much for checks and balances.

President Ignoranus' healthcare coverage explained.

dan325 comments on Apr 2, 2019:

Finally - Trumpcare explained!

[jta.org] 15 members of youth hockey team in Los Angeles, California suspended over anti-Semitic ...

dan325 comments on Apr 2, 2019:

I wish the article had given more information, particularly about the role of the coaches in all this. We need to get a better handle on this crap in order to fight it intelligently.

[diversityinc.com] Creepy Biden accusations provokes Michael Bloomberg to reconsider run for the ...

dan325 comments on Apr 2, 2019:

Just what we need. Another damned centrist.

[friendlyatheist.patheos.com] Illinois lawmakers file bill condemning anti-Semitic homophobic ...

dan325 comments on Apr 2, 2019:

Good for them. Groups like the IFI need to be publicly called out and condemned.

[washingtonpost.com] Massive disaster relief bill faces likely defeat in Senate over Puerto Rico ...

dan325 comments on Apr 2, 2019:

Bigotry is a hallmark of the Republicans in general (and a few of the Democrats) and Trump in particular. Of course, everything Trump does makes him look bad, because he's, well, bad.

We need a group for Aspergers only, No family or others, just those with Aspergers. Many of us ...

dan325 comments on Apr 2, 2019:

I'm an Aspie, and I'd sign up, but I like this group too and would remain in both. It might be good to open your Aspie group to all autistic people, though.

[nbcnews.com] White House whistleblower, Kristen Newbold, says Trump Aministration overturned 25 ...

dan325 comments on Apr 1, 2019:

Time to forget about his collusion with the Russians and go after his endemic corruption. Corruption and graft permeate every action taken by Trump, his family, and his associates. He even cheats at golf.

I am currently in Washington DC attending the National Legislative Organizing Committee meeting of ...

dan325 comments on Apr 1, 2019:

I'm a member of JVP, and I support its values in full.

Classic Rock!

dan325 comments on Apr 1, 2019:

Hysterical. I especially like Earth, Wind and Fiber. (Sorry the damn "like" function isn't working.)

[dailykos.com] pLEASE sign and send the petition to your representative that we need legislation to ...

dan325 comments on Apr 1, 2019:

I've already signed it.

[patheos.com] Islamic Jihads and Jewish Pogroms - a way of life for Muslims and Jews, a life of ...

dan325 comments on Apr 1, 2019:

Isn't religion wonderful?

[nbcnews.com] Trump threatens potential border closing next week - WTF!!!!!!

dan325 comments on Mar 30, 2019:

I'll be surprised if he actually attempts it. I think he's just emitting gas, as usual.

The kids are holding their breaths, crossing their fingers, waiting till we are gone and stop fkn up...

dan325 comments on Mar 30, 2019:

I think that when the kids of today begin seriously experiencing the effects of climate change, inadequate medical care, and income disparity, they'll look back on Trump and the Republicans with total disgust and loathing.

Some days, a little peace and quiet is all that is needed.

dan325 comments on Mar 30, 2019:

Only days with names ending in "y."

[hillreporter.com] New allegations that Jared Kushner appears to be extorting money from the ...

dan325 comments on Mar 30, 2019:

Why, it's almost as though the Trump and Kushner families are a bunch of crooks!

NRA Opposes Expansion of the Violence Against Women Act [thedailybeast.com]

dan325 comments on Mar 29, 2019:

So these sorry excuses for men are saying that abusers should be able to carry guns, because restricting themselves to beating up women isn't quite manly enough for them?

End Citizens United, in fact, the entire legal bribery in Murica

dan325 comments on Mar 29, 2019:

Jimmy called it. He's one of the few xtians I respect.

Has your size affected your ability to attract romantic partners? I am at the size ("super-sized," ...

dan325 comments on Mar 28, 2019:

I'm afraid the experiences you had with the BBW websites (where you had to cull out a variety of scammers and crazies to get to a couple of nice guys) are typical for all women, large or small. Too many men tend to be assholes.. Many men love fat women of all sizes (I'm in that group), and a subgroup is particularly drawn to super-size women. Of course there are fewer BBW lovers than men who prefer average-size or skinny women (due in large part to arbitrary societal pressures), but given the scope of the Internet, there are still plenty of us to go around. The problem, as you stated, is weeding out the assholes, but again, that's true for all women. Like you, I was active in the fat acceptance movement for many years. Like all civil rights efforts, it always seemed to require ten steps forward and nine back to advance one small step. The problem is society's entrenched bigotry, which is further enabled by the medical and weight-loss industries. You did right in sticking to your principles, and you have my respect, for what it's worth. There's no guarantee that things wouldn't have turned out worse had you not made the choices you did. I'd hug you in person, but I guess we'll have to settle for virtual.

This is Still happening..

dan325 comments on Mar 28, 2019:

It's a sad state of affairs when the police are as scary as the criminals.

Hello, brand new to this app. I'm an INTJ, what about everybody here?

dan325 comments on Mar 28, 2019:

I'm also an INTJ. Glad to have you aboard!

With Fossil fuel lobbyist Bernhardt being nominated as head of the "Interior" can Trump honestly ...

dan325 comments on Mar 28, 2019:

Trump's not only filling the swamp - he's stocking it with his hand-picked poisonous snakes.

meet the sacklers [youtu.be]

dan325 comments on Mar 28, 2019:

Disgusting people.

I'm starting to believe it's easy to fool people

dan325 comments on Mar 27, 2019:

Only the stupid ones (i.e., the majority).

A friend and I went to see the film about Ruth Bader Ginsburg. We decided to get past two people ...

dan325 comments on Mar 27, 2019:

People like this woman are human stains. They're gratuitously cruel for no apparent reason other than a need to feel superior, stemming from their repressed realization that they're actually inferior. Sorry you had to go through this crap.

[aish.com] Reincarnation and the Holocaust. Some Jews feel they died during the Holocaust and ...

dan325 comments on Mar 26, 2019:

I doubt that reincarnation is any more real than resurrection. Our "selves" are just manifestations of the electrochemical activities within our brains. When our brains die, it's all over - we're just gone.

Last night I saw a commercial for the Freedom from Religion Foundation on television. My wife turned...

dan325 comments on Mar 26, 2019:

I don't think this particular issue is quite that sinister. MSNBC and a couple of other channels routinely run FFRF commercials. The only reason you don't see them on mainstream channels is that the stations themselves refuse to run them - too "controversial" for their regular advertisers.

Hi everyone, here is a thought that's been bouncing around in my head for a while, I have noticed ...

dan325 comments on Mar 26, 2019:

In my dreams, I'm often outgoing and interactive with groups of great people. I've never met those people in the real world, and when I am trapped into interacting with others, it's usually very awkward and unpleasant. The imagined people are a better lot crowd, I guess.

What we can do to make the world a better place for every one to live, for example instead of ...

dan325 comments on Mar 26, 2019:

Only if we can miraculously improve human nature. The rich, powerful, and privileged will always try to take control and exploit the rest of us. Throughout history, it's happened without fail.

Nina Simone said it best: Mississippi Goddam!

dan325 comments on Mar 26, 2019:

I was stationed in Mississippi for 9 months back before the civil rights movement. It was an obvious preview of hell.

[washingtonpost.com] What to watch for as Attorney General Barr releases more on the Mueller ...

dan325 comments on Mar 26, 2019:

I think you're right about Barr being Trump's Cohn. Barr has managed to muddy up the waters very skillfully. Of course Mueller's decision to leave it up to Barr to decide whether Trump should be pursued for obstruction was not helpful - he should have suggested leaving it up to the House. Now it's up to the House committees to try to sort this mess out. Blech!

I have to be under the influence to handle large crowds.

dan325 comments on Mar 25, 2019:

I have to be under the influence of handcuffs and the threat of death.

Super busy ...

dan325 comments on Mar 25, 2019:

Very cool picture. Add a dog to the mix, and make the cat white, and there I am.

A great tweet from David Frum; David Frum ‏ Verified account @davidfrum Follow Follow ...

dan325 comments on Mar 25, 2019:

Frum is generally much too conservative for me, but he's proven himself to be an honest man. I never would have expected the above post from him, but that makes it all the better.

This is not a complete and total vindication of President Trump. 10 Important Conclusions. ...

dan325 comments on Mar 25, 2019:

It's nowhere near a complete vindication. Barr's report is next to useless; Mueller's will tell us a lot more.

[alternet.org] Why the United States bombed Auschwitz but didn't save the Jews - They bombed oil ...

dan325 comments on Mar 25, 2019:

I've always suspected that. I don't think Eleanor was, but I'm not so sure about FDR.

on the right track

dan325 comments on Mar 25, 2019:

Good to know it's laid out in writing. Wouldn't want them just executing people willy-nilly.

Alexandria Ocascio-Cortez is 100% accurate

dan325 comments on Mar 25, 2019:

She nailed it. This will be a long, hard struggle.

what are you up to?

dan325 comments on Mar 24, 2019:

How about those of us who drink (a little) and swear (a lot) quietly?

Teens who seek solitude may know what's best for them, research suggests Despite stigma, solitude...

dan325 comments on Mar 23, 2019:

Most of the time I preferred it, except for the girl-crazy part.

So is it just me or do the thoughts of a surprise party give you the heebie jeebies also?

dan325 comments on Mar 23, 2019:

Scares the crap out of me.

This is where we're at..

dan325 comments on Mar 23, 2019:

Yikes. He's 100% right.

[haaretz.com] Holocaust restitution group in Germany seeks eviction of German seniors from homes ...

dan325 comments on Mar 23, 2019:

Probably the same reason restitution wasn't made to the American slaves or the native Americans. Nobody likes to admit they did wrong, especially if on top of it they have to return the property they stole.

[dailykos.com] Nazi behaving ICE border officials accused a 9 year old US citizen child of lying,...

dan325 comments on Mar 23, 2019:

I don't know if it's possible, but I'd like to see a class action suit initiated on behalf of all of the children that have been abused by ICE. How those "only following orders" types can sleep at night is beyond me - they have to be morally dead.