I really enjoyed reading your comment. Yes, some of that religious dogma in AA and NA meetings rubs on me a little bit. Early on, back in my Navy rehab days they taught us that you could make your higher power anything you so desired. And they gave plenty of examples for us agnostics and atheist. I found that I get my strength or that higher power thinking by realizing that my help comes from the fellowship, and the other people in the meetings around me and their stories and experiences, working the program. Also, speaking and sharing my ideas and thoughts. Listening to and hanging around the winners, the people with time under their belts.

I've had a very hard time in AA. Makes things alot harder for me. I even had this chick say she knew athiests that were sober but I was missing the whole point of it. Now I'm in treatment. Their website was entirely misleading. Their trying to build a church and that's pretty much it. This woman is a wannabe Joyce Myers. Prosperity gospel and all. Of course it's her prosperity. I'm frustrated as hell. They can turn a friendly athiest militant when he's trying to save his fucking life.

Please tell me more about SMART. Just came across it...

AA is a liberal Christian Religion for addictions and mental issues. Using the sin and redemption model. It's a minor cult.

Ironically, I credit AA with leading me out of religion. First it had me searching for a "higher power", but gave me the freedom to define it myself. I immediately took to that idea. I met my first atheist in AA, and he was a great guy. There were so many different beliefs in my group, that my search led me to use the group as my higher power. They were, and still are a great group of people. I no longer attend, but I've been sober 28 years, and still consider many in the group my friends.

I'll have to say some of my years in AA were the happiest I've ever been.I see some of the faults, but there is a lot of good too. The group I was in was an "I got your back" kind of place where you could trust people with your life. It wasn't a dogmatic group at all.

In my opinion, meetings are, or should be, primarily for newcomers - to introduce them to Alcoholics Anonymous (the book, the fellowship, the steps) and to sober people.

The actual personal work of recovery, discussions about working the steps, is done outside of meetings with my sponsor and others from the program. I go to meetings primarily to be of service to other atheist or agnostic or religiously antagonized alcoholics. To be available to show them exactly how a person can work a program from a secular point of view and stay sober.

I heard from another alcoholic that after a few years he no longer emotionally needed meetings. His sponsor told him to stop thinking about what he could get from meetings and start thinking about what he could bring to meetings. And while he was thinking about that, to try thinking about bringing AA to AA meetings.

I got sober in 1997 through AA. I was a believer then, too, in god. Not sure of the exact moment in time, but by 2000 I was an agnostic, and by 2001, a full on atheist.

I, too, found AA to be somewhat "cultish", and a little too religious in many instances. After the people in my home group found out I was an atheist, many took it upon themselves to convert me back to religion. Some made snide remarks toward me whenever they had an opportunity, and one even showed me outright hostility. I eventually quit the group because of this (and because of the pre-canned, scripted babble you referred to). It just got old knowing exactly what everyone was going to say before they said it. And it was boring to keep hearing about alcohol - especially after quite a few years without a drink. I could no longer relate.

However, I still have a "living" and "thinking" problem, which is part of what enamored me to alcohol in the beginning. It is those problems I have to focus on, and the best way I have found to do it is through fellowship with other recovering alcoholics. I just do this outside of AA now. I have been blessed to have met a number of good people with long-term sobriety who do not get preachy or push religion. They are just simply good friends who get me.

As for the disease aspect, I have to agree with the scientists and doctors: it is a disease and an allergy, and therefore, I must stay away from it. It is much easier to do now than it was 21 years ago when I quit. Then, it was often a day, or even and hour, at a time. Now, thankfully, I have not thought about or been tempted by alcohol or drugs in nearly two decades.

Glad you found your way, brother.

I got off alcoholism with my doctors help and haven't had a drink since, 1967. People who go to AA often try to tell me that I might fall off the wagon because I didnt use the services of AA or believe in a higher power or that I was never a 'proper 'alcoholic - it began to seem to me that AA is quite a cultish entity - A friend of mine wanted me to go to a meeting with her to see what I thought of it - I thought it was very shame based and a strange element with the men being in the seats of power- the religious bit is still there too and I wouldn't recomend it to anyone - it seems like it can get you off the drink but then what gets you off the hook of AA which seems very like a religion to me

If you want to look through some of the previous posts and comments there are a lot of good ideas and experiences.

Atheism isnt a disease either!

LMAO ! I'm a SMART Facilitator so I appreciate your share. There are a lot of truths to your interpretation of AA But I'd like to say that regardless of it's faults the infrastructure of self awareness is what I think helps most people. Now, whether or not it does much to enhance that, well that is up for debate. But again, some people going through Recovery lack couping skills or esteem to being a self care mindset and the community does offer that. Please don't mistake my defense of A as an advocate. I'm just a firm believer that Recovery tools can be found in all forms. Be up the good work sir. Be good to yourself, and others.