And since you asked for an example, let me give you some details.

He was diagnosed as level 2 but at his last evaluation he was level 1.
Meals used to involve constant screaming and very little eating. Now he usually eats well. He will even spontaneously try new food. He used to have tantrums and meltdowns multiple times daily, some days with every transition. Now he sometimes goes a day or even two without one, although he averages about 3 a day. He used to just run off sometimes in public and we'd have to chase him - sometimes into the street even. He doesn't now. He is in a school based program in his clinic. He often counts to 100 just for fun. He reads small words, knows his alphabet and the sounds of most letters. He can do some simple addition and subtraction (1+ anything, 2+2, a few subtractions). Oh, and he can print any letter and prints his name. He is very academically advanced for a 4 year old.
And he's been getting swimming lessons for 4 months from someone who uses an ABA type approach. He can float on his back, holds his breath underwater, and can swim underwater and pop his head up for a breath and go back to swimming.

I'm not sure what your experience has been but ABA has helped my son a lot. Please see my post above.

@towkneed, just because you're child has made short-term gains in apparent ability level doesn't mean s/he won't experience the trauma and resulting mental illnesses as an adult.

ABA is ALWAYS abuse.

@TaraMarshall Very rarely is something "always" something else. I am involved with my son's therapy first hand, have observed it in action, and am free to observe it at any time. Let me tell you what his ABA conists of.

The therapists at my son's clinic meticulously record his behavior, down to the number of seconds he spends having a screaming outburst. They have a behavior based color chart. When he has an outburst - screaming, hitting or throwing things - they will move him to a different "lesser" color. If he stays on green he is rewarded. He is praised effusively for positive behavior, like sharing toys or having to wait for access to something. He may be given a small "edible" if he does something particularly good or something that has been difficult for him. They devise a "program" of rewards, responses and redirection based upon specific behaviors in specific situations.

Periodically they examine the data they have taken. Has the number of tantrums increased or decreased? What about their duration? What toys/activities did he enjoy that can be used as rewards? They then use these results to determine if their current "program" is working or needs modification. They target behaviors that are destructive, self destructive or unhealthy (like not eating enough or enough variety). We often let them know about specific things that we are concerned with - like hitting his 2 year old brother without reason.

Here is another example of something they used that we now implement at home. Currently he has a "crying" chart wherein, if he has an extreme outburst, we show him the chart. It has small smiley faces velcroed to it. After 5 seconds we remove a smiley face. It has 5 smiley faces. We almost never have to remove all 5, and often just show him the chart. Even if we remove them all, there is no prescribed "consequence" - it's not for that. It simply allows him to focus on something else, to realize that he is in control of his own behavior, and that screaming is not an acceptable response in the instance. We don't use it if he's hurt or for anything else except when he has a very extreme reaction to something that he will ultimately have to experience without reacting in such a way. Like when he doesn't want to put on his shoes before school, or gets upset when he can't have a sweet before dinner and has a tantrum.

This is ABA in our lives. And it is based firmly upon theory. And saying this is abusive is absurd.

Perhaps you don't realize that inherent in your statement is the implication that I would allow abuse to my son. I did a lot of research concerning ABA before starting my son in it. I know about its history and have studied it's theory. There's nothing inherently abusive in it's practice. That is unless one finds it abusive to prevent destructive or unhealthy behaviors in children. If so, then that seems to be against any parenting.

@towkneed,
Reliance upon others for external rewards. Check.
Removal of self-motivation. Check.
Compliance training. Check.

In the REAL WORLD, motivation largely has to come from within ourselves. And non-compliance is a social skill, unless you want your child to never be able to say "No!," when someone wants them to do something.

I've seen the results of that, including hosting a pregnant HFA girl on my couch for months after her religious parents kicked her out.

@TaraMarshall Everyone relies upon others for "external" rewards. Hence the word "external".

No one is removing self motivation. That is not even possible as pleasure has a basis in biology and fundamental drives.

There's no "compliance training" going on. Although I do wonder how extreme your definition of "compliance training" is and if you think public schools engage in it when asking students to wait to be called to speak.

Your arguments are all based upon untrue assumptions and generalizations from specific cases which you seem to have cherry picked to suit your beliefs. I am living it and am trying to present you with real world facts and examples counter to your statements and you are responding with what is obviously canned talking points that don't make sense when considered in the context of the example.

Oh well. I joined this community to meet like minded people. Not be upset by people who presume to know better than I what is good for my children. I was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt before blocking you, which I will do later today.

In my opinion, along with many on the spectrum, Autism Speaks is a hate group

[facebook.com]

@matthew1954 I've heard people say similar things before. But I really think you should look up "hate group":

"A hate group is a social group that advocates and practices hatred, hostility, or violence towards members of a race, ethnicity, nation, religion, gender, gender identity, sexual orientation or any other designated sector of society." - [google.com]

Being so hyperbolic often serves to illustrate your own cognitive distortion or else that you are loose with facts.

@towkneed, Autistic people are a distinct group. Just because our communities are mostly online rather than in person doesn't invalidate our experience of them.

Autism $peaks advocates for prenatal testing so no more Autistic people are born. This is EUGENICS, which was the first step on the way to many genocides in the past, even though last century it was simply practiced through sterilization of people suspected to have "defective" genes based on simplistic and wrong ideas about race and cognitive ability.

@TaraMarshall Look, I don't want to venture in a debate over whether Autism Speaks is good or bad. I'm sorry if it seemed that I was taking their side. I simply don't think "hate group" is appropriate. They are not advocating for anyone's extermination. They do not promote violence - quite the opposite actually. I don't agree with their stance on many things, but I know they have helped move the needle on what I think is some positive legislation.
And while I understand where you equate them with eugenics in their drive towards prevention, historically eugenics in practice included sterilization, separation and the removal of rights. I think that using such extreme terms is promoting fear and misunderstanding and is ultimately harmful to social discourse.

@towkneed, you really should read some of the language Autism $peaks uses when they talk about us. Including the use of the word "exterminate."

@towkneed, you really should read some of the language Autism $peaks uses when they talk about us. Including the use of the word "exterminate."