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The right wing success story.They have succeeded in achieving minority rule by electing the five man rt wing justices, their gerrymandering, corporations being looked at as persons, voter suppression, and unlimited spending by the wealthy for campaigns.

Marine 8 Dec 2

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Minority rule, what an ignorant statement.

I am sorry you feel that way but what would you call stacking the Supreme Court by not allowing a judge to be elected during the term the position was open. What would youn call the gerrymandering that has allowed republicans to keep positions they should have rightfully losted.. I assume you approve of preventing citizens of not being able to vote because of their color just by your statement.The koch brothers and their cohorts with all the money they and their corporations can dump into elections haqve bought elections and have used deceptive advertising to get ther vote.. It would seem the one who is ignorant is the one making the statement..Have a nice day.

@Marine Court stacking is and has been done since the countries founding. Gerrymandering as well. It is nothing new. Also keeping judges from being appointed is nothing new. The Senate has that power If you want to talk about money in politics. Please try and make excuses for Obamas 1 Billion dollar campaign fund.

Team Blue lost and still is somewhat losing. The system is for the most part not at fault. To blame the system is no different than a team that loses a game. Then proceeds to throw a temper tantrum. You would not accept this behavior from your child, but here you are doing it.

Team blue is well aware of how the game is set up. They failed to win. If they failed to even use the rules, then your leadership needs replaced, because your coaching staff sucks.

@Veteran229 Tell that to the Duponts,koch,rockafellers,,istahanes and all the other billionaires that outgave the dems billionaires 5 to 1. Add to that the fortune 500 CEO"s and the other millionaires that far exceeded the movie stars and the less than one hundred democratic millionaires who gace money. The old money group wants it all to itself. The Buffet's ,gates, and few others who donate to the dems have worked along their whole lifes to share their wealth with others. You cannot say that for the republicans who hoard their billions to the point they would never be able to spend it. We as the wealthiest nation in the world rank 37 in health care. It isn't because of the democrats! We are still fighting the right to vote and it isn't because of the democrats.We have spent between ten and twelve trillion dollars on wars since Bush 1 those should never aswell as vienam war should never have been faught. Guess who profited from these wars and continue to do so while receiving tax rebates and a hughe tax cut yup the wealthy who are invested in these companies own these companies and the corporations themselves. Give me a .break!

@Marine Old money became old money by making it in the era when wealth was not stolen. They then passed it down through the generations. This is the exact problem with America today. Government and wealth stealing has made it very difficult to pass money down. The boomers escalated things with the mantra of burning wealth because they made it. This montra is also purpetuated by the government and the federal reserve. Forcing future generations into debt for social programs and war. The military industrial complex needs destroyed just as much as social programs need destroyed.

@Veteran229 Everyone cannot be a millionaire and without the social programs that the wealthy made on the backs of the workers who would not share their wealth the majority of people in old age would be living in the street.
it was the unions that raised the standard of living in every country and it is the reason the same does not apply in Africa which lacked the union movement.You are trying to tell me that a family is hurting if it can only pass on a couple billion dollars. Please get real they could pass their wealth down to a thousand people and still be wealthy.

@Marine At the same time, it is also the unions ( aka workers party and other derivitives) that has destroyed nations when left unchecked.

Keep changing topics, I can keep destroying your illogic.

@Veteran229 The workers party was a commie one not to be confused with the unions elsewhere.

@Marine Oh yes right it off as just a commie thing. Lets just ignore Hitlers rise to power through the workers union of their country/era. Lets just ignore all the bad from history in the name of workers. That way you can defend your narrative. And so can also not see what happens when labor is given too much power.

@Veteran229 I do not deny the bad that came from the mob influence just like the bad that comes from the lack of regulations that the republicans are pushing thru however one cannot deny the good either. Let's take a look . Health care,eight hour work day. overtime,vacations,sick leave , workmans compensation, holidays and I am positive you took advantage of all of these if you worked for someone even if you never joined a union. I would compare the good over the bad anytime.

@Marine Overbearing regulations is what destroys small business. Which stops new markets from emerging. Which stops the mega corporations from being challenged. California is a prime example of this. Jobs are fleeing Californias because they cannot, or do not want to meet the costs of assinine regulation.

And you just pointed out the flaw of our current unions. They used to fight to create laws for fair labor, they no longer do that. Now they just attempt to suck a company dry. Union auto will be disappearing soon. They costs associated with meeting union contracts increases prices. Honda and others can produce a better quality vehicle for the same MSRP as Ford or GM. The lack of Union cost lets them sink that much into quality to out sell the competition. Ford is dumping sedans, because they cannot compete with Honda,Nissan, and Toyota.

@Veteran229 Hey there who owns then banks that charge30% on credit CARDS AND PAY .01% ON BANK ACCOUNTS. PS i am not the one changing toics I am the one responding to your questions.As to your statements about this has gone on forever it takes the elector's involvement to get the elected to do something.I write letters to my congress people, protest in marches, take part in visits by my elected officials, call my representatives attend opposition party gatherings, donate as much as I can afford, held elected office.Are you doing the same?Let's take a look at those social programs you seem to hate.Based upon a income of $50000 here is what you pay.per year
$248 for defense, $3.48 for FEMA, $22.88 for unimployment ins, $36.82 for snap food stamps, $43.78 for govn. disability and retirement for civilian and military,$235.81 for medicare and $4000.00 for corporate subsidies.I don't hear you complaining about the latter. Note these are what you pay in taxes and not on individual payments.

@Marine You havent brought up subsidies yet, they need abolished as well. Corporate welfare is just as bad as people welfare.

You had better reread this chain. I have asked no questions. Only systematically destroyed every talking point you have presented. Which is why you keep changing topics.

And now(once again) you are changing it to banks which i sort of covered in my second response to you.

Interesting.. But I see one participant looking out for everyone, while the other looks out only for himself/ family. Commercialism, via capitalism, has not set us up for a healthy future... It worked when there was a ‘virgin continent' to consume, but the easy pickins are gone. One thinks we should back off the consumption and leave something for future generations; the other suggests we should consume or sell every molecule ..leaving any proceeds to his kids (untaxed, of course).

Our economy is stratifying, but that’s not new, as ‘we’ took care of the industrial Robber Barons a century ago. But one thinks it’s a good idea to maintain a balance between wealth & workers, unions being the tool; the other thinks unions & workers rights should be crushed, so the industrial overloads may have total control.

It’s been a slow boil … incremental encroachments, uncalled ‘fouls,’ so to speak, by one team - the team that plays dirty.. As was originally described, one-sided supreme court decisions aimed to increase the power & wealth of the party having installed them … to the detriment of workers & minorities (including Atheists). One’s paid close attention to each disastrous decision; the other’s likely grinned with delight..

As I remember there being 8 ‘conservative (regressive) think-tanks’ to their ‘opponents’ 1 … wealth has encroached on politics as has religion. One, likely drawn here for the same reason as I, thinks both are tragically wrong; the other rarely chimes in to a discussion not revolving around wrong-wing politics or guns…

We need to compromise, as I remember this nation did during it’s greatest moments. To view ourselves as one, call it nationalism, or call it unity. But let a brilliant President toss out aggression, reach across the aisle looking for common ground & compromise -- and watch his far-wrong self anointed hostile opposition do everything in their power to make his presidency fail, limiting it ‘to one term’ (during the greatest Depression/ Recession of our lives!) … over the color of his family's skin -- then tell me what isn’t in their cold, dead hearts(!). One is appalled; the other likely flashes a brown-smeared grin every time his ‘preferred president’ (without doubt the worst in US history) resends executive orders, trade agreements, park designations, environmental regulations, treaties, or sanctions on hostile nations…

I know one thing - the Russians are loving it! ..while one wonders if there’s hope … and the other ..cheers it on? 😕

@Veteran229 You mean we should dump acid and heavy metals in the drinking water as just approved by trumper. Let the banks run wild and cause another recession like the last one,Just approved by trum,per Reduce OSHA rules so now workewrs must purchase thir own masks at 158 $ plus monthly filters at $75 without any reimbursement. working with toxic fumes. ETC I guess we just will not see eye to eye on things. Have a nice day.

@Marine No, your difficulty is in your lack of the ability to critically think. I said "OVERBEARING REGULATION". You have kneejerked to all regulation.

@Veteran229 We have an unionized Honda plant 5 miles from my home. They are doing well.

@Veteran229 I have My father lost all his pension after 45 years working to a corrupt union and our state is in debt because of stupid union negoiations but one cannot even begin to compare the bad as the corporations use every trick in the bag to save money. NJ chemical plants stopped providing workers with masks who are working with dangerous chemicals since OSHA reduced regulations, Wells Faego used crooked banking to cost many homeowners to loose their homes and the list could go on and on.Have a nice day we just do not agree but it was nice discussing thins with you You should join Spike and I on other matters. We do not agree either.

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Well if we were to have more options politically then most likely things like gerrymandering, voter suppression, media bias and the attacking of our citizens for not falling into a party line might just cease or at least become harder to achieve.

I’ve witnessed the corrupt behavior of both parties so I don’t feel sympathy for one side or the other.
And sadly y’all are both so ignorant that you’ve failed to acknowledge that with both major parties combined had less than half of this nations eligible voters actually turn out.

So republicans and democrats have it wrong and their fighting over the scraps

What did you do to correct the situation. It is easy to criticise.Why didn't you start a third or forth party
?If yoiu have the answer why are you keeping it to yourself?Where is the action?

@Marine I don’t belong to any party never have never will I vote for people based upon their individual merits as well as their intentions.

I’ve contributed time, and money to several candidates in the past 30 years. I’ve gone to and openly discussed issues with candidates from all parties running for certain offices and then relayed their answers to public forums.
I have and still reach out and if given the opportunity communicate both issues and solutions.

As far as starting a new party that would be completely ineffective due the fact that there’s nearly a hundred tiny individual parties that would benefit from merging but non of that still matters as long as when there’s political presidential debates we will only be allowed to see one democrat and one republican on the stage.

It will take what we potentially have at this moment and that is for the two parties to splinter and as in the democrats case the formation of either a progressive or socialist Democratic Party would have to form and then merge with other parties like the green, coffee and so on.

And on the republican side I see libertarians splitting the ranks as well as a resurgence of the tea party but rebranded.

And I don’t keep anything to myself I share it everyone that I can but on many different levels.

I am just one person and I’d love to run for office but I won’t for several reasons some very legitimate and others because society has been conditioned to not accept that we need political and social compromise and the media would most treat me like some kook or turn the power off every time I’d make a valid point.

Nonetheless we need to adopt an ideology that this is OUR country meaning the citizens not The politicians, corporations, foreign interests or the media.

That no matter what your race, social, economic, religious belief, sexual orientation or even acceptance of of this country is it belongs to you and we need to own it again.
We need cross table conferences where all of the segments of society can sit down and hopefully at least identify with each a little more at the end as well as compromise on solutions to problems that we all face and afterwards confront our political leaders to adopt these solutions.

There that’s what I got and if it’s not enough then give me some ideas and we’ll see where it can go

@Alshaytan [responding as I read] With this being your opportunity ‘to reach out,’ statements like “sadly y’all are both so ignorant that you’ve failed to acknowledge that with both major parties combined had less than half of this nations eligible voters actually turn out.” ..is a poor example of your capabilities…

I’ve watched several ‘lesser party’ candidates for president on the debate stage, they can get time if their polling shows they’ve some credible numbers, otherwise, the networks aren’t about to allow “nearly a hundred tiny individual parties” to eat up their time, or ours..

In a Parliamentary System, coalitions of smaller parties work, but not in a winner-take-all system like ours. Both parties are painfully aware of what happens when ‘their votes’ are split, they lose. Look how the R’s rallied around the most incompetent contender their party’s ever produced (least in my lifetime), did they split? Nope, they ‘won.’

...further into your desires ..which viable party comes close to, if not embraces them all..? No, that party didn’t give us Bernie, but he had sense enough to know better than to split off and run by himself. Politics is rough.. But Hillary'd earned it, and would have been a very solid and moderately progressive president … with her supreme court justice picks allowing this nation to progress toward your, and Bernie's - and my goals (for the most part).

We need cross table conferences where all of the segments of society can sit down and hopefully at least identify with each a little more at the end as well as compromise on solutions to problems that we all face and afterwards confront our political leaders to adopt these solutions.” - Yes!

The other tuff part of politics is the fact it brings out the most passionate among us. Long ‘working the Democrats booth’ at various town celebrations ..I’d usually wander over to the R’s booth … once saying, ‘though we appear to be on opposite sides.. I think we’ve ultimately more in common than the folks who simply pass us by, we care.’ They’d smile, I’d look over their shit ..then head home ~

Hey, thanks for your clarifications.

@Alshaytan I agree with everything you have said so we aren't far apert afterall. Have a nice day.

1

It’s a long-term, incremental & ongoing project, and they are in constant campaign mode…

Eventually, the majority has ‘enough,’ votes in a Democrat for president, the Democrat claws us to a safer place ..the nation goes complacent, even begins to believe the constant Republican propaganda … as all problems are blamed on ‘the democratic president,’ runs a nut against them - and gets this.

How far will we fall beyond the rest of humanity before we take this nation back..?

Varn Level 8 Dec 2, 2018

This has been the cycle since Truman

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Money is power. So is lying to idiots.

Educate your children, people.

That requires equality to be given and reinforced by education.

1

ameriKKKa being ameriKKKa

2

Unfortunately so.

2

No argument here.

4

Unless the Democrats can take back both house and senate and the presidency we will be govern by this minority for ma very long time.

But even if they do...Fox News will still blast lying scare stories all day etc. Are there really enough dems with the strength to say: nope - not having this shit any more?

@Gooniesnvrdie Easy to criticise where is your answer?What have you done to change the program? i haven't seen you leading any action.

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