but one should know when the heart starts or stop it stops for 20 minute is that how long it take for one to total be dead? or after a heart starts it might take 2 weeks to become regular.

@1patriot 20 minutes may be too short for some and too long for others so it is not about how long there wasn't a beat. Life is not just about the heart beating. Embryo life begins before the heart beats.

@ecowellness but if we are measure a point of death we so must measure a start of life, the heart would be a good place to standardize that measurement.

@1patriot what does the medical and scientific world say is the start? That would be the standard.

@ecowellness they don't have a standard that i know of....some states say when a heart beat starts. some say the women has the right to abort a babe the day before birth....i call that murder...

@1patriot they don't have a standard? Try looking stuff up. [ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]

@1patriot "There was a wide agreement between physician testifiers to the Commission that a definition of death which referred to irreversible loss of brain functions was required."

@1patriot [ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]

@1patriot every reference I posted has a standard. The standard is the same in all of them.

@ecowellness i abortion it's not that way....did you read the MeMe it's different in many states. and it's not standard. what your sending is what science say it starts as embryo and when your dead your many cell live beyond the last beat of the heart. the meme is about abortion....

@1patriot not the standard? Post some facts please. Did you not read the links I posted?

@1patriot you claim it is murder. That one way thinking disqualifies you from having a fair discussion on the subject. If it is murder and millions of abortions have been done, who is convicted of murder?

@1patriot you claim abortion is not the way? OK, what is the way? Once again you talk one dimensionally about a complex topic. What do you know about unwanted pregnancies or pregnancies that must be aborted? How many babies have you had?

@1patriot BTW, there are more natural abortions than medical abortions. Ever heard of miscarriages? That is natural abortion. Who is the murderer there? Perhaps miscarriages should be illegal too. Abortion is a natural thing or can be a medical procedure. What are you doing to solve the problem? Try asking a body to stop miscarrying. Since miscarriages are very natural, you think medical abortion is murder? Post evidence when a person who did an abortion was convicted of murder?

@ecowellness fuck off i read them and they are the claims NIH has made as the start and and end of life it is the opinion. they claim is science or you make claim. if you mother aborted you the day before birth you wouldn't be here simple as that. i not going to debit this for the next few days i as i have many other things i am working on. but it my opinion that if your mother aborted you the day before your birth it's murder... you don't agree fine!

@1patriot sorry to hurt your feelings. Now that you realize your argument is only a baseless opinion, you get nasty. If you are not an adult then I apologize for treating you like one. As a boy with little experience, little education and a lot of ignorance, you can be excused. You might have read what I posted. If you comprehended it and are honest, you would admit it weakens your stance. What experience, education, medical or scientific knowledge do you have that causes you to disagree with the links I posted? Do you understand what a fact is? Why haven't you posted any facts? You seem ignorant many late term abortions are done for the mother's safety. Generally the fetus will kill or harm the mother and the fetus is possibly dead. So you think aborting a dead fetus to save the mother is murder? Are you fine with the mother dying so the dead fetus is saved?

@ecowellness you want to fucking fight over a fucking meme, when your killing your baby the day before it 's Birth it's murder so fuck off! your killing them when ever there's a heart beat in my opinion. so fuck of again old man! i don't have to to fucking debate when live start and ends and turn into 50 day discussion. if happen natural there fuck all you can do about unless you doing all that shit like drink and drugs that kill your baby any way. it was a simple question you are willing to give it a simple answer. stupidity at it finest

@1patriot You of all people mention stupidity? If exposing your ignorance and inability to grasp facts is fighting, then you prove my point you are very ignorant. Now you show anger. It is not surprising considering your arrogant ignorance.

@1patriot you said, " i not going to debit this for the next few days i as i have many other things i am working on". Pulling your head out of your ass must take days. You have replied several times so obviously you have the time. I'm not sure your feeble replies qualify as debating, sounds ore like ignorant arguing. Not only is your writing sometimes incoherent and words misspelled, indicating along with ignorance you lack education, but you don't even follow your own words. If you don't have the time to continue, why do you now have the time? It appears you wrote those words without meaning it. Can you make yourself look any worse? Not a single reply has merit without something to back it up. I suspect facts do not support your thinking so you have no interest in facts.

@1patriot if it's just a meme, why are you so angry and and testy? Using the f word indicates a low level of emotional intelligence. I gave you the chance to get out of the hole you dug, you keep digging deeper. Asking you for facts pissed you off. Facts get in the way of you being a knowitall who knows very little. And you are so quick to call things you have little understanding of murder. Judgmental much? Simple minds like yours are not a problem, simple minds that are judgmental, closed and angry are.

@ecowellness because i working on shit and don't have time to answer you mindless question i give you my answer my day of work is now over.... but i have decided i am not going to waste my evening talking about this Meme as i told my fucking opinion and i don't care if you like it or not!

@1patriot no one cares about your opinion but yourself. At least after all your illogical BS you admit it is just your opinion. Post a fact that supports your opinion. That would be a sign you can think. Ever think when you have no credible claims you should keep quiet? Is blabbering weird opinions the best you can do? Perhaps you have something better to do like get an education. For a while I wondered if you understood what an opinion is. When you hold your opinions higher than facts, science, reality and logic, it's a sign of a lack of many things. Instead of your opinion, do you have anything factual or of substance to say? Continuing to just post your opinions does nothing to help your credibility. Perhaps in a few years you will catch on. Take a stab at posting a relevant fact to boost your credibility a notch.

@ecowellness poor baby, you be dead soon, it don't matter i don't give a fuck about your opinion...have a good nite!

@1patriot This is not about if I like something or not. This is about logic, common sense, facts, science, medical understanding. One indication you are not in synch with reality is you focussed on heart beat as the only sign of life. I posted facts showing there is more than just heart beat to life and you failed to agree. That is a sign you can't handle facts that contradict your opinion. You lack understanding of what signs are used to know if a life is alive. Your claim abortion is murder suggests you lack understanding and compassion for the circumstances causing abortions. No matter why an abortion is done, it is murder to you, no concern for the mother or family. You want to demonize women for making difficult decisions that you have never had to make. You base your opinion mostly on one thing, emotions. How do I know that? Because low level intelligence people call abortion murder. Since adults know murder is a serious crime and gets people put in prison and abortion doesn't result in anyone going to prison, you proved you have low emotional intelligence. Dialogues don't go well when one bases input on emotions. I continued to ask for facts and you didn't post any. That is another sign you don't like facts or logic because usually they weaken your opinions. It's ok to have opinions, but problematic to have opinions based only on emotions. Logical and reasonable people avoid emotional opinions. Another sign you are too emotional is telling me to F-off. Another sign you are emotional is you said you didn't have time for this, and then continued having time for this. Usually when people realize they have lost the argument, they say something like they don't have time for this.

@1patriot you continue proving you lack emotional intelligence. Do you have anything of substance to say? Once you have lost the argument, attack the other person. And you didn't mean what you said saying you didn't have time for this. You contradicted yourself. You don't keep your word. At this point it is clear you are a phony and lack a basic civility for dialogue.

@ecowellness you Alzheimer’s disease is getting in the way old man this is what the post was...now go piss yourself some where! you did get all the shots i hope! cause it was you stupid ones that took it!

@1patriot you again prove you lack emotional intelligence. Insults are a sign you lost the argument and are embarrassed. I'd rather be old than an uneducated fool who has the emotions of a child.

@1patriot Here is your grade school level sentence. "you Alzheimer’s disease is getting in the way old man this is what the post was". You continue embarrassing yourself to spite me. You are not very bright. Nothing proves you lack emotional intelligence more than your angry, childish insults. Sorry to hurt your feelings again. Got anything of substance to say?

@ecowellness your the prick with big mouth look at the way your attacking me what 15 post or a meme on abortion and you have fuck all to say u speak in circles and right from the start it not to discuss the meme you were setting me for your mindless attack so fuck off once again....hope your proud to be an ass hole.....have a good life at 72 u got 10 years go ahead a waste it picking on people you must have been bullied at school so this is your way to get satisfaction, well i could care less. I sure you will reply as you need to have the last word lol

@1patriot I'm attacking you? Once again you focus on your hurt feelings. You're embarrassed. You forget that I pointed out facts that you either lacked the intelligence to grasp or couldn't handle. Sorry to post facts that hurt your tender boyish feelings. Sorry facts are attacks to you. But now that you are crying I'm attacking you after you insulted me and make shit up like a grade school bully, explain how pointing out your low level emotional intelligence and lack of education is attacking you. It's clear you lack basic intelligence and have a very low level of emotional intelligence. Your attacks and foul language prove that. You inability to write coherent and complete sentences with the fact you struggle to count is more proof you lack basic intelligence. Saying true things about you is not an attack. No wonder you couldn't handle any of the facts I posted earlier. Truths you don't like need to be downplayed, ignored or argued. The proof you are very ignorant is in your posts and words. It's ok to be stupid. But you advertise it by being arrogant, argumentative and childish. You have nothing of substance to say. At times you lost sight of the topic. Your intelligence is so low, you think abortion is murder, yet you couldn't explain how no one goes to jail for abortion. You do not know the difference between murder and abortion. You argue based on your anger and ignorance. You continue proving my points. Lack of intelligence, low emotional stability, lack of class, lack of education, lack of ability to think. You barely can write a complete sentence. You got my age wrong. You can't count correctly. More proof you lack basic intelligence. Time to get an education.

@1patriot speaking of not discussing the meme, you lead the pack on failing to discuss it. And 15 posts? You can''t count correctly. It's time to hide for a while and hope no one remembers your ignorance, low intelligence and low level of emotional intelligence. You remind me of the guy who never gets anything right. The fact you can't count correctly suggests a lower level of intelligence than I thought. The more you rant, the more proof you provide. It appears you have no problem with your low level of intelligence and low emotional level. Perhaps it helps when someone attacks you with facts.

@ecowellness as he has a tantrum lol

@1patriot you are a phony, no name and no picture. What are you hiding from? You remind me of the Russian bots that flooded the internet with idiotic BS. Get an education.

@1patriot and guess who has't said squad about the meme? Hypocrite much? Got any facts? Sorry to mention that nasty word again.