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Intelligent Design. ( not the religious concept).
Try and imagine a world without religion.
Imagine a civilisation where all decisions are made logically without emotion. Environmental problems could be addressed, there would be no need for poverty and starvation. We would have population limits. We already have the knowledge and technology, but we don't do it. Too much self interest, competition, greed desire for power over others.

Rugglesby 8 Jan 26
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1

it takes a lot of work to be human. We have come from a pool of evolution that focused on biological manipulation to survive in an ever changing environment. We, and some other species in a limited capacity, have developed the evolutionary means to do the opposite: we manipulate the environment to suit our biological needs.

in my opinion, what we face now is a period of conflict, of a prior system of survival that relies on emotional identification(good, bad, love, hate) to survive. it conflicts with our more recently evolved method of environmental manipulation. for instance, people that crave sweet or salty foods, do so because of our evolutionary identification with those substances as essential to our homeostatic body function. this is what dictates our emotions that drive us to seek out these substances, and rewards us for consuming them. we now mass produce these substances through a progression of industrial development. yet, our emotional state still dictates the consumption of these products at the same rate as when they were scarce.

we must settle this conflict as a species, and decide what will not rule our cities or nations, but will rule our minds, before we will ever reach the next step in the structures of our society.

awesome response

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I believe that much of what happens is because of natural instinct, "survival of the fittest", so to speak

I am what many call a naturally giving person, If I have some"THING" I rarely make an emotional attachment, even to money, so I donate a lot, buy things for people, help in as many ways as I can. BUT if there were a famine and it came to feeding my family, I think I could kill over food to survive.

Yet I still own a large house and property, have helped my 3 sons become homeowners, have helped 4 foster kids become home owners. We Have paid rent for people I have never met. But would I give them my house. NOPE, my food, Nope.

I think we are all hardwire to take care of ourselves first

wow, you seem to have it somewhat covered, you understand harsh reality but when the opportunity permits you have been very charitable.

@Rugglesby well, thank you!

1

Compertition and greed are our evolutionary raison d'être. It is the selfish gene with intelligence. Many people have expounded this idea of logical systems of govt from Socrates to Marx. They do not work. Many reasons have been attributed to this, Maxists will say it was the implementation and personality cult etc. but it is simply top down systems are shite.
Okay you`re planning a trip. Do you want to go to a planned city or one that just grew? Rio or Brazzaville? Manchester or Milton Keynes? Sydney or Canberra? Then you are told that you cannot go to some of these places unless you go by sailing ship because of the carbon footprint !

Our raison d'être must be to survive, perhaps thrive and to reproduce with offspring fit to to do the same. I guess in some ways I am an agrarian socialist. I think part of the reason many of these experiments have failed is the competition with a stronger and at least temporarily more viable alternative. Evolution has shown how many lifeforms flourish for a long time, but if the don't adapt they can end suddenly. Civilisations have come and gone before, ours will also. Side issue, your screen name just fell into place, love it.

@Rugglesby You are also forgetting how much emotion has to play in our better treatment of others. You see a starving child on TV, it is emotion that makes you want to help. Logically why bother? The child is nothing to you, they are very unlikely to grow up and find the answer to cold fusion. Why feed the world when you can more efficiently feed just a small elite, with less environmental impact? Then what of the arts or sport? Where would they be without emotion? Science itself is powered by emotion. It tries to take it out of it`s work but it is still the engine that drives it. Do you imagine someone like Madame Curie was not driven by strong desires? No the society you yearn for is one that I and most others would not care for

1

I tried to, it created an absolute state that ruled over a humanity under the whip forever.

1

Geeze .... wheres the uforic feeling of hot sex going to go? Where's that rush of meeting someone you really like and they seem to like you back? I kind of like having feelings and learning how to understand and control them...

In my case the hot sex remains thankfully, I seem to have limited emotions, and they exert almost no influence on me. Have only realised in the past 10 or so years what an emotional void I was, others have said I have been like it all my life. Could go a very long way to explain why I have been unpartnered for most of my life.

@Rugglesby. I'm sorry brother... I wish you well.

1

I wonder what it would be like? Utopia or just the future?

I don't know, I see our current civilisation as totally dystopian, I throw ideas out there, and see how people respond to them. It helps me refine my thoughts. I usually have no attachment to these ideas and on this one the responses have been incredible, lots for me to digest.

Good.

1

I guess you don't listen to Radiolab, Vulcans would be poor.

Damn, not familiar with it, hang on while I google, ta

1

Money is a faith based system.

@273kelvin whatever that means you just said... MONEY.

@GipsyOfNewSpain Money is a faith based system Uk banknotes have " I promise to give the bearer on demand the sum of... " US ones " In god we trust ". It is all faith based. Without faith in the cusancy it losses value.

@273kelvin OK.

@273kelvin @GypsyOfNewSpain Yep, money is a faith based system, one I have no faith in. I go through periods in my life trying to divest myself of it, I am in one of those at the moment. I am not wealthy, but I have a little $$ at the moment, and am trying to do things with it to ease my future. Running out of ideas.

@Rugglesby Imagine how different society will be without a concept of money.

0

The world had no religion before we came along. Population limits will be impossible without war and strife, because we like sex (and that inevitably leads to procreation). To control population with abortion is barbaric and murder. I would like all religions gently pushed aside, but there is no civilized way to do so. The final points? I do not have qualms with self-interest, competition, and greed. But I do agree that power over other is pointless and grievously short lived.

I have this ideas for birth control, genetic manipulation that renders everybody infertile unless the couples combined I.Q. exceeds that of a potato.

2

Sounds good, but getting rid of religion would not get rid of self-interest, competition and greed.

0

ants already do that and termites

they got queens, workers, slaves and armies.

we all are slaves. all ants get what they need from the top to the bottom and have the same common goals.there a lot more complex than that and I've never heard them called slaves.

1

That sound like a great world. I have those same concepts bouncing around in my skull. I add one other factor, no money.

a big YES to that one.

4

John Lennon "Imagine"

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