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Did you know that thanks to the American military efforts to curb climate change occurring from pollution by their equipment is excluded in the efforts internationallly agreed upon?

Add your name to the petition to the attendees at the upcoming Glasgow conference.

[actionnetwork.org]

FrayedBear 9 June 29
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Ummm... I think I understood what you meant...

So, are you saying the rest of the world is using solar and hybrid tanks, and we're the only ones selfishly running on petrol? (Diesel, actually, I think, but why split hairs?) I find that hard to believe. I also find it impossible to believe that nations like Russia and China are going to do more than pay lip service to this issue, and then go right on using good old gas guzzlers. They are not the kind to surrender what they see as a strategic advantage, but they would love it if we did.

Call me crazy, but I tend to think it's the over 230 million private vehicles in the US, not the 225 thousand the Army owns, that is the real issue, along with comparable numbers of aircraft, ships, etc. And given the choice between an eco-friendly military and an effective one; until we come up with a way to do both, give me the effective one, please.

Effective against what?

@FrayedBear That's kind of why we have a military; we don't know. We've never known, throughout our history, when we were going to need it, why, or against what enemy.

In 1859, almost nobody seriously expected that 2 years later we would be at war with one section of the nation against another.

In 1939, almost nobody seriously expected that 2 years later we would be fighting 2 wars simultaneously against Japan on one side, Germany and Italy on the other. And during that war, almost nobody seriously expected that less than 5 years later we would become embroiled in a global series of brushfire wars against our allies Russia and China's client states, and in a cold war with themselves.

In 1989, almost nobody seriously expected that we would soon be leading an international coalition to expel Saddam Hussein's Iraq from Kuwait. And on 9/10/01, almost nobody seriously expected that we would soon be doing the same in Afghanistan to try and eliminate Al Qaeda's refuge.

The success or failure of the last endeavour has nothing to do with my point- enemies come out of nowhere. We are always taken by surprise. In retrospect, we call our politicians fools for not connecting the dots and say they should have seen it coming a mile away; but in the moment, people just don't see what they don't want to see. They assume the best will happen, that nothing will go wrong simply because it hasn't yet, and time and agan they're proven wrong.

That's effective "against what"- the unknown and unknowable. A strong military is an insurance policy. We need insurance.

@Paul4747 Crap Paul. US military has only been effective in boosting the US economy not in defending Americans from invasion. The only attacks on your country came from Mexico & the Japanese. The USA in every other instance have been the perpetrators of war, invaders & murderers.

@Paul4747 do you really need insurance that gobbles up so much of your spending that it dwarfs every other country by a country mile while your roads crumble, your bridges crack and buckle, your buildings collapse, and huge numbers live in poverty and ill health? To take your analogy it would be like someone paying half their salary on house insurance while their house crumbled and cracked and fell into extreme disrepair.

@Paul4747, @FrayedBear I am obliged to agree with your 'crap' comment FrayedBear, the US MICOMPLEX dragging countries like ours, Australia, into these wars, often wars that are crimes against humanity, like Vietnam and Iraq.

@FrayedBear @David1955 The US invaded Kuwait? News to me. The US invaded South Korea? News to me. The US flew airliners into the WTC and the Pentagon? That's fucking big news to me.

Our military budget is big so that others', for instance, Australia's, can be small. No need to thank us for maintaining a presence in S Korea and defending the Pacific since 1947. It's on us. David, your boys did good too. Nothing but respect for the Australian military.

Viet Nam, on the other hand- yeah, we fucked up. The best I can say is that they meant well, or at least they meant something.

I know exactly when America has been on the wrong side of history, and I also know when we have been attacked and when we have defended our allies. Wipe the "I Hate America" off your glasses and look at history through a clear lens.

@Paul4747 it's not America many of us disapprove of, but your class and power structure. Millions of politically alienated Americans agree, by the way.

@Paul4747 lol. In WWII America sat on the sidelines for two years making profit before getting involved. Who invited you into Korea?
Kuwait yes did invite you but it was your puppet, Saddam, who had gone rogue on you. And he was only your puppet because you want his & Iranian oil supplies.

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I'm shocked. First Agent Orange, and now this! I thought they were so nice too.

It isn't just the American militia contributing but their's, with the Chinese, probably equals all the others combined?

@FrayedBear

Law of adverage or percent wise. The country who has the largest population of the two sides, wins most likely. With China living way over seas and they have not been in a major war since 1979.

It's America only fearing itself and its offensive war budget based on martial law every year since A. Lincoln

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oh for feck sake

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