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So what happened to the 'R' number then, which was so important just a couple of weeks ago, has anybody seen it lately ? Has it disappeared of its own accord, or was it taken into a dark wood and quietly strangled, and if so by WHO or if not by who ?

Ps. The body of a number approximately three months old has been found, a large heavy man with shaggy blond hair is believed to have been seen in the area.

Fernapple 9 July 7
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An interesting point. I hadn't even noticed that it had gone. With the test and trace system in total disarray anyway it couldn't have been very accurate. I suppose it would be possible to calculate it on a local basis. I live in Highland region which has a population of just over 300,000 and has had 376 positive test recorded and only one in the past week it must be very low. Of course holiday makers are now flooding north in their campervans and to occupy the holiday homes and lets so it could rise.

Moravian Level 8 July 9, 2020
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It was not local enough.

I have no idea how they actually reach those numbers though.

It should be as local as your local pub. Science is now investigating transmission through the air( as other viruses are) as opposed to droplet transmission ( transmission by droplets is where the coughs and sneezes or any forced expulsion of air from the mouth is dealt with by the 2M rule and wiping surfaces) . This worries me because the atmosphere in the pub i.e. all the air that fills and circulates through the air together with smoke and sweaty moisture should be ideal for air transmission. It would also be the place where people who do not follow rules - like healthy lifestyle & hand-washing are more likely to gather together.

So we need more R values posted on the way in to each public house where alcohol is served. It might be more effective than a closure notice. But you must still have the choice to go in.

Mcflewster Level 8 July 8, 2020

It almost seems like our government is trying to engineer the second wave. If they really want people to come out and start spending money to kick start the economy, why don't they come out with strong firm regulations on masks and social distancing, so that people do so safely. Instead of, "Oh well if you feel like it." advice. Or are they still trying to hide possible damage to their image, caused when they ignored the advice of and the information coming from the W.H.O., to cover the fact that they were unable to organize the supply of enough masks. In other words, their image comes before public safety. I like this may make it a post.

The problem is that an Effective Reproduction Number would change drastically all the time. Basic Reproduction Number wouldn't really change (once it was accurately calculated). Anyway, the number of people in the pub, how close they sat, how segregated the groups/individuals stayed, the size of the groups, if they wore any type of PPE, what the temperature, humidity, airflow, and potentially UV light penetration was, if there was air filtration, if there was any natural or acquired immunity among the patrons and at what percent, the percent of initially infected individuals, etc. etc.

@JeffMurray This is good list of variables but it could be extended indefinitely. Humans I.e for social sciences generate the most varirables of all sciences

@Mcflewster True, I didn't think I did. The conclusion I was looking for from a reader wasn't, "Yup, Jeff named every variable" it was, "Yeah, Effective Reproduction numbers can't really be used as a risk assessment tool for individual areas."

@JeffMurray I take your point but what do we use? Boris seems to have abandoned explaining science to everyone. So thanks to some local councils local action has been taken quickly. If they get too heavy handed we can dispose of them within a year. How long will it take to dispose of Boris. He has had a year now and the longer he is there the more his influence will last even if he loses an election. Same for Trump.

@Mcflewster As sad as it is, you just have to assume every place is super contaminated and only enter/interact with places and people that are necessary. Additionally, you can get a sense of which places are higher risk by evaluating what people are going there. No one needs " to go to a pub, so pubs will generally have people that have been performing riskier behaviors (like being in rooms without masks with unmasked people they don't know), and thus, are more likely to have it. If you MUST go, try to stick to socially distanced patios with only people you live or work with all the time. You could possibly check social media to see if anyone is discussing whether or not staff members follow guidelines and enforce patrons following them as well. Around me, a lot of people post on Nextdoor about whether people follow the rules at local places.

@JeffMurray This is good advice and the approach that I follow. Just wish everyone would.

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