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A question for all my female friends:

As a woman, do you feel society has achieved gender equality, and what do you think is still holding things back if your answer is "no"?

Piratefish 7 Oct 10
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8

When I can walk the streets without fear of attack down a non-scary street,
when someone listens to me in a meeting even though I'm not cursing, yelling or otherwise bullying,
when I'm given the benefit of the doubt that I know what I'm talking about when I take my car in
when I'm seen as advancement material, even though I'm child bearing age,
when the man I've been seeing for a year (and knows darn well I like to work) doesn't assume that I aspire to stay-at-home-mom-dom
When they stop trying to legislate my uterus, and insurance covers it for no other reason, than it is integral to my health and a part of my body
When men can show emotions other than anger, greed and lust and still be considered men
When men aren't praised for taking care of their own children, it is just expected and accepted as an every day occurance, not 'baby sitting'
When health care/drug trials include female subjects so they can actually predict how they'll work on us
When I angry cry no one calls me overly emotional (like a man yelling and getting red in the face is level headed)
When my personality and my brains count more than my bra and jean size
When men don't feel the need to compete for macho (seriously, who gave them the idea that some beefcake alpha idiot is the ideal?)
When everyone is considered a human being deserving of consideration and dignity, and gender is a secondary characteristic.

So, never, then...

@Minta79 Probably not in my lifetime, no. But why should that stop us from reaching it eventually as a society and globally?

@CommonHuman I'm feeling quite pessismistic at the moment.

6

And I actually find it odd that this post was under the heading Silly, Random & Fun. Because none of those adjectives strike me when I think of female equity. Sorry, you asked! ?

I thought about putting it under "political", but I wanted to avoid politicizing the topic if at all possible. And there aren't exactly a broad range of other categories from which to choose; ergo "random". I just wanted to get honest opinions and observations from women, in fact I would not have even selected a category, but the administrators make it mandatory. No offense intended. 🙂

I just learned I can change the category. So, after giving it some thought upon reading your reaction, I switched the category to "general and hellos". It certainly was not my intent to trivialize the topic.

@Piratefish kudos!

@Piratefish this topic IS political, but I applaud your enthusiasm to ask questions. I can give you some great links or books, if you're interested in learning more about how truly unequitable life in the US is for women.

6

Equality is different than equity. We don't have equity. When our society stops talking about the importance of children and families and start putting their $ where their mouths are, we'll get closer to equity. We need paid maternity leave FOR A YEAR. State funded daycare/early childhood education. Higher teacher pay (80% of teachers are women-roughly). Did you know that when men started to join the profession pay went up? Imagine. In fact, studies show that when women enter predominantly male jobs average pay drops? Sigh, just getting started.

I am aware that the U.S. is one of only two or three nations in the world that still does not offer paid maternity leave as a matter of policy. But it doesn't end there, we also are one of the only developed nations that still practices capital punishment and does not have universal healthcare or affordable/free college educations. We're too caught up spending hundreds of billions of dollars a year on war, the military, special interests, and subsidizing corporations and banks. Last I looked, the U.S. has fallen from first place in virtually every category that matters. In fact, I have read a poll recently that showed the U.S. being the nation posing the greatest threat to world peace. But that's what happens when you let banks, the military-industrial complex, and giant corporations buy the government.

@Piratefish agreed!

5

You're asking this after seeing Kavanaugh getting supported and confirmed?

@Renickulous The issue of punishment never came up. He was not on trial. It was a job interview. Not getting a job is not a punishment. His belligerent behavior in the Senate disqualified him. But, he was a rich, white guy...

@Renickulous His reaction alone should disqualify him from the highest deciding court in the US. No one who can't keep his wits about them no matter the circumstances should be in charge of the entire population.

What were talking about here is women's equity or equality, not whether kavanaugh did or didn't. If a woman justice had acted like him, OH wait! She wouldn't have, not if she wanted the job! But, a man doesn't have to worry about how he is perceived in an aggressive state. It's his right to be angry and hostile. #caseinpoint

@Renickulous "Most people in the US are white people, "
50 percent of the population is female.. why did you ignore the "guy" part of her statement?
Last time I heard the white male population will be a minority with a generation.. shouldn't the system of govt reflect that?

@Renickulous no. It wasn't. Every SCOTUS nominee under goes Senate confirmation hearings.

Boozy Brett's was a perfect example of how not equal women are in this country, though. Because his confirmation hearing should have been focused on his history of corruption and blatant disregard for the Constitution. Instead it was turned into a circus act where one teenager was belittled and dragged through the mud for being assaulted and another was given the boys will be boys, at least he grew up treatment. That double standard right fucking there is the embodiment of how not equal women are in this country.

@Renickulous Senate confirmation hearings ARE job interviews.

@Renickulous Because it gives him an automatic, undeserved pass.

4

No. What is holding us back is white male patriarchy. Unfortunately, it isn't just white males perpetuating the societal belief that men are superior to women. It is ingrained in our society and taught from infancy that women help men and men naturally have power.

Holli Level 6 Oct 10, 2018
4

Gender equality? You are joking, yes?

No, it was a serious question from someone who is seeking to gain more insight and a better understanding. As a man, that is difficult for me to do unless I ask questions to gain a woman's perspective.

3

Thank you for asking this. It shows you've noticed -- and it's much harder for people with privilege to see it than those without. We have a long way to go in terms of equity AND equality. Women really are not considered real human beings by too many people in this country. The Kavanaugh debacle was an example. Setting aside the entire issue of sexual assault, any woman who behaved that way in a job interview would be dropped from contention for any job and joked and laughed about. In this case they joked about the woman whose life is being shattered by the jokes, laughter, threats, etc.
I think it all comes down to the misperception that allowing women any power means that men lose -- in other words what is known as a zero sum game. The only people who see that are, again, the ones who feel they stand to lose power and privilege. I am about to turn 70 years old and while I've seen some small advances, they have been hard won and almost immediately there is a backlash. One step forward and two steps back. We need more men who recognize that this is really an issue and are interested in helping.

3

The issue is equity, not equality.

2

As you can see the USA ranks 49th and Canada ranks 16th. Still have a long way to go. Understanding the topic first from an economic, political, and historical standpoint helps. Most people seem to think because their personal lives are going okay that gender equality has been achieved. That is false and they are wrong. [undispatch.com]

2

From a sociological standpoint gender equality has not been achieved anywhere in the world, though the nordic countries are pretty damn close. Do not take my word for it. [un.org]

2

I'm not female.. sorry.. but one of the things I think holding it back is the younger generation of females who seem to actually believe it's not needed are necessary.. MULTIPLE times I have had young ladies tell me they are against feminism! Wtf??...
Think about it.. a white aged cis male arguing with a young female on the importance of feminism.. it just boggles my mind everytime ..

One of my best friends is anti-feminism. And I never can understand it. We can’t speak about it though because she gets very heated about the subject. If anyone book is feminist or any show is too feminist for her, she stops watching or reading. I honestly question our friendship often but that one still boggles my mind how someone who complains about things but doesn’t believe in the importance of feminism.

Some of us do get it. I hope it is a matter of youthful ignorance and with time and sadly, negative experiences, they will wisen up and change their views.

2

Gonna read the comments first before replying (even though I just realized it said "female friends" lol )

2

No. Women do not get paid as much as men in most jobs. But for me. I don't think there will be equality for my generation just by virtue of upbringing. I've been conditioned to believe my position in society is equal to Marian Cunningham. How can I erase this? I've never been a housewife. But I still see this as happy days.
I don't think men and women will ever be equal. After all, men do not give birth.

2

Now, let's look at healthcare. Did you know that women receive substandard health care? Break it down by race and it's mind blowing. Black women have it awful, especially in the birthing department. I can't remember the exact statistic, but they have way more complications than their white female counterparts.

2

Honestly, since women have a slight majority, I'm beginning to think women are their own worst enemies. That is my thought of late, that too many women are complicit in buying "the lie" that is right wing propaganda..in essence enabling our own subjugation.

I had a neighbor who was raised in the south, I though she was joking when she said that women didn't cut large meat like a roast, that was for men. She was dead freakin serious. I'm thinking it is women like this who have been brain washed from birth. Reared to see their role as narrow and subservient that perpetuate that women like this kind of crap.

@CommonHuman HFS!
Yes I agree, and this article illustrates how indoctrination works.
Won't cut large meat... omfg WOW.

1

I don't even know how to answer this. It's too big. In what areas do we still need to improve women's equality? ALL OF THEM?

1

Right-wing governments always repress the rights of women. Capitalist power structures thus hold women back.

0

I read this, and started to laugh, then burst into tears......

0

There is so much wrong with gender equality still. How is it fair that women get lower car insurance just because we were born with vaginas? Or the fact that once you get married your insurance drops as well for men. Somehow adding a woman to the mix changes someones driving ability? Or why do men get shorter paternity leave than women? I get women usually are the ones who carry a baby or stay with the baby but a fathers connection to his kid is just as important as a moms.

Or their is the issue that I am always taken for granted or looked over. When I was a supervisor at Starbucks and people needed to speak to who was in charge, they automatically asked for any of male coworkers working and treat me like Im dirt. Even when I would say I was in charge, they’d just want someone above me then because I wasn’t capable enough to deal with what they need though I am very capable.

I think a lot of the issues we have is that people don’t see a problem. Most don’t believe there is a gap. Or they don’t see the vast differences in how women are treated in comparison to men. The absolute worse part is how other women are I think the biggest reason for being stuck and not being able to progress. My best friend just quit her job because her female boss gave a position that was already below her to take to her brand new male coworker. They choice him because he seemed more authoritive because he was a male. They also gave it to him with zero experience managing when my friend has 10 years under her belt and killer references and she waa running circles around this dude. Yet they chose him because he “looks the part.” When we as women can’t even support each other and have each others backs, how can we expect men to help us fight back?

0

No way. I think too many men in power fear being a minority. They know how they think about and treat women and marginalized people and don’t want the tables turned and to be treated that way themselves.

I do think more men who are ally’s are speaking up though. I also see young people fired up and voting. This gives me hope

0

No. Other women.

0

It takes strength to walk an untrodden path and fully utilize our equality. In order to be equal, with a man, I had to divorce my husband because he wanted kids. This was the only way I could have a full time job and not be financially burdened with kids I did not want. Am I an oddity in society? Yeah. Do I let it hold me back? Hell, no. I have a full time job and a side job. I can decide that I want to go anywhere in the world at the drop of a hat. Nobody tells me what to wear, who I can be friends with, nor what I can spend my money on. Am I saying this path is right for every female? No. Maybe freedom is equality.

Walking a road less taken is wonderful, but that does really address the interwoven inequities that exist for all women to make all the choices that are right for them.

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