#WHAT IS THE NATURE OF REALITY?
Scientists tell us what we experience is empty space with a little energy in it. What is energy? Some say it is the force to do things, but that says what it does, not what it is.
Scientists also tell us 96% of our reality is dark matter & dark energy, which means we have no idea what it is. Scientists also tell us particles can be in two places at once, & influence each other at a distance without any known connection. They also tell us a partical can also be a wave, but a wave in what?
They tells that what goes into a black hole ends at the "event horizon", & what happens in a black hole is a "singularity", which means they don't know what happens there. Scientists tell us on the quantum level, the sub atomic functioning that creates reality, things appear to be random.
This scientific view seems to mean chance & uncertainty rule our lives, but randomness my reflect our lack of ability to understand, not anything in reality. So what is our relationship to this vast mystery?
Does our being really matter? In the vast mystery we live in, are we real or just a brief blip in some universal process? Are our lives just imagination in some vast changing conscientiousness, which changes to unconsciousness? Do we have a soul or a hole?
3
Enjoy being online again!
Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.Create your free account
7 comments
Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.This is how I see it:
Cosmically speaking we don't matter. The universe does not care whether we exist or not.
Evolutionarily speaking we are here to procreate before we die. Evolution only needs us to live long enough to have babies and see to it that they live long enough to procreate. But, we humans have evolved brains that allow us to contemplate our existence and to give it meaning that goes beyond just being, or just being here to procreate.
I am here due to billions of random events that just happened to result in me. Billions don't exist, or have never existed, because random events prevented it. I have no problem in knowing that I am here due to random events and not due to some fated outcome. I certainly prefer that to thinking I was created by some needy, vengeful, god to love and worship it--or else!
Because life is rare (especially self-aware life) and random, and finite, it has more meaning. As an atheist, I appreciate life, all life, much more than I ever did as a believer as I now know that we are all connected.
“We are all connected; To each other, biologically. To the earth, chemically. To the rest of the universe atomically.” Neil deGrasse Tyson
"We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." Carl Sagan
PS I absolutely think there is other life in the universe, and some of it is intelligent. There might be millions or even billions of other life forms out there--but given the vastness of the universe--life is still rare.
Joanne
Level 7
Aug 30, 2019
0
The “needy vengeful god’ is only the Abrahamic god and not a universal idea.
Tyson and Sagan are referring to Eastern ideas of creation.
Your thinking is akin to Buddhism (Theravada, not Mahayana)
It’s a shame we label these ideas which give rise to criticism and prejudice.
@Geoffrey51 Yes, I say that because that is the god I was raised to believe in and that is the belief I let go of; but, I don't believe any gods exist--needy, vengeful, or otherwise.
Life is indeed rare, especially self aware life, & random as far as we know, & extremely finite in the vastness of the universe & apparently even more finite in the even vaster reality we do not know.
The idea of a petty tyrant punishing god who created us to feed his ego by adoring him is indeed Abrahamic & not Eastern. The god of fear, who demands our absolute obedience, results from the despots we often knew in temporal affairs..
The East often sees "god" differently. We are part of god, just as a drop of water is one with the ocean. We are part of a dream "god" is having to realize its being. The separateness we feel is caused by the duality created by our language & perception
When we come to enlightenment, the veil falls away & we realize our at onement with the all of being. Ego is an illusion. We have ahimsa, which is a profound awakening to the reality of our being.
This concept sounds nice, but most of us are far from ahimsa. We are enamored by the soap opera created by our ego involvement. But some of us have a deep need to pierce the himsa (illusion) & experience our real self.
@Remiforce > Yes, the needy vengeful god is the Abrahamic god...the one I was raised to believe in. Which is why I mentioned that god. That said, there is no evidence that any gods exist, or that the universe itself has a consciousness; and science shows us that no god, or cosmic consciousness, is necessary for the universe to behave as it does; Therefore, even though I cannot know, as I do not posses all of the knowledge of the universe (or universes as the case could be), I see no reason, and have no need, to believe that any god, of any kind, does, or might, exist.
@Joanne If we have consciousness & we are in the universe, then the universe has consciousnessness, at least in us. It is hard to imagine our limited consciousness is the be all & end all of reality.
To my knowledge, science has no way of knowing whether consciousness is necessary for the functioning of the universe (or possibly universes). that is well beyond the pay grade of science. Science can only deal with what can be defined & quantified, but no one really knows what conscientious is. Some try to define it by what consciousness does, "Conscientious is what knows things", but that only tells us what it does, not what it is..
No one knows what is the relationship between our physical being, our brain functioning, & our conscientious, or how our conscientiousness is related to experience beyond our ego (our preception of ourselves)
As Shakespeare said, "There is more between heaven & earth, Horatio, then is drempt of in your philosophy" . To my mind, the question of whether "god" exists or doesn't exist is a moot point. We may be dealing with a principle beyond our ability to define & our concepts of existence or non existence.
@Remiforce Us having consciousness is different from the universe itself being self aware and having some sort of intent. Science does not care, it simply wants evidence. And, there is no evidence that the universe itself has a consciousness just because we do. Of course I cannot know; but, as I stated I have no reason to believe this is the case.
@Joanne Perhaps a re-framing of the idea by saying “There is consciousness in the universe”
I like the way you have framed this issue: all questions. And that is what we face—lots of deep questions and no real answers. For me it is the questions that are important because those questions indicate deep conscious awareness.
The implications of existence as conscious beings are absolutely staggering! We might have no understanding but at least we have awe, appreciation and gratitude. If you want to label that as “soul” then OK.
(Apparently there is also uncomfortable squirming and denial by many people)
WilliamFleming
Level 8
Aug 30, 2019
1
People want answers & not questions. Questions are painful, answers bring comfort. This is the basis of religion. Few have the courage to face the deep questions of their existence straight up. Religion offers an easy anodyne to our existential angst, a curtain to hide behind, so we don't see the mystery of our reality. Comfort can be a very adictive drug..
We may feel awe, appreciation, & gratitude for the mystery of our existence, but we also feel the squirming & denial. The beauty & terror of our reality is too much for us to accept, except, I believe, for those few who are enlightened
Nope, no meaning....just live every day the best way you can without causing pain to anyone else. Period. And knock off that "soul" crapola!
AnneWimsey
Level 9
Aug 30, 2019
0
I followed you in every way until you asked at the end if we had a soul. That would appear as if you are putting some religious idea into your reasoning. I still say that talk of a "soul" originated and persisted because mankind cannot correctly interpret their own dreams. In the dream you have flown off to another land and it was so real, but you were home again when you woke up. Maybe your "soul" did the traveling. This is all wrong thinking. In reality you went nowhere.
DenoPenno
Level 9
Aug 30, 2019
1
The notion we have a "soul" may very well be related to the fact we dearm. In ancient China, The Emperor drempt he was a butterfly. Was it the Emperor dreaming he was a butterfly , or a butterfly dreaming he was the Emperor?
In sleep, we slip the bonds of time, space, & reality. We experience consciousness without physical constraint. As Freud said, "Dreams are the royal road to the unconscious". We realize our existence is more than our conscious mind.
Of course this experience gives us the notion we have a being independent of our body, which some have called a soul.
Then we face the issue, are we a human being dreaming they have a soul , or a soul dreaming it is a human being.
In a dream, you did go somewhere. You went into the depths of your unconscious mind, which Jung posited as being connected to the Collective Unconscious of mankind. Some may bridle at this terminology, but how do we know our consciousness is strictly our own. Perhaps in our dreams, we are connected to a much greater reality..
Some may also bridle at the apparently religious terminology of "soul". This concept has been used to give hope of personal survival after death. Nobody really knows what happens after death, but this notion has made a ton of money for religions. No wonder so many people are turned off by the very word.
Why must there always be an answer or grand design?
RiverRick
Level 7
Aug 30, 2019
1
It's because Mankind cannot bear to contemplate the thought that life is meaningless and has no purpose, coupled with the fear of death being the absolute end of life.
Of course, it is also easier to manipulate people by promising them a reward in an afterlife in exchange for a lifetime of subservience.
Yes, Because human beings demand answers & context. If we do not have an answer, we make one
One thing that is perhaps true, (you can say no more for anything ) , is that, we are apes evolved to survive and reproduce on the plains of Africa. There is nothing about that which requires our brains and senses to be able to perceive or understand the greater workings of the universe, especially at much bigger or smaller scales than the human sized objects that are found on those plains. We just were not made for the job of understanding the universe, that we can even begin to get an idea of what may be going on, is itself amazing.
And we are not even at a human scale very good at understanding things, I well recommend reading up on chaos theory, if you have any doubts about that.
Fernapple
Level 9
Aug 30, 2019
2
I think really all we know is we nothing as all boundaries to knowledge seem to be superseded at some point
And the only thing we really know about energy is that it won’t go away it just turns into something else.
So, I am content that I don’t know and it’s futile for this bear of little brain to even consider anything outside my own back yard to be Truth.
Geoffrey51
Level 8
Aug 30, 2019
1
Energy flows into matter, matter into energy. Apparently we have interplay of matter & energy with dark matter & energy. Nothing is stable. All we know is change.
If you accept string theory, all our existence is vibration, but vibration of what? Vibration must have a medium to vibrate in. It is a mystery how we exist.
If you know what's happening in your back yard, perhaps you know the truth of existence too. You do not have to go far to find existence
@Remiforce I used to be an intrepid explorer until I became a bit of a Dorothy!
Enjoy being online again!
Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.Create your free account
Share this post
Categories
Agnostic does not evaluate or guarantee the accuracy of any content. Read full disclaimer.