Agnostic.com

3 1

Here a few reasons I believe it is likely that Jesus did exist as a historical figure:

  1. It is very likely the historical Jesus was born and raised in Nazareth.

In both gospels of Luke and Matthew contradictory stories were created to explain how Jesus was still born in Bethlehem but ended up growing up in Nazareth (Matthew 1:18-23; Luke 2:1-52). Seeing as the authors wanted Jesus born in Bethlehem because of the prophecy by Micha in the Old Testament (Micha 5:1-2), it is very unlikely the authors would have invented the unnecessary idea that Jesus was born and raised in Nazareth. In fact, a prophecy not found in the Old Testament seems to be created out of this air to justify Jesus growing up in Nazareth (Matthew 2:21-23).

In the Gospel of John it is also mention that the Messiah is supposed to come from Bethlehem and the religious rulers are confused because Jesus was not from there. (John 7:40-44)

  1. There is very strong evidence throughout the synoptic gospels that Jesus was a Jewish Apocalyptic Prophet who believed that God would return with the Son of Man, overthrow the evil forces ruling the world, and set up a physical Kingdom on the earth. He taught parables that clearly taught living right would allow one to enter into that Kingdom when God returns (Luke 12:35-47; Matthew 24:42; Matthew 25:31-46). He clearly seemed to believe this would happen during his generation (Matthew 24:32-35). This contradictory to later Christian theology which teaches salvation by grace through faith and that not of works (Ephesians 2:8-9).

The strong evidence throughout the gospels of Jesus being a Jewish apocalyptic prophet clearly paint a picture of a historical Jesus whose followers later added fabrications and embellishments to his ministry and even changed the entire meaning of his message.

It also seems likely that these were historical teachings taught by a historical Jesus that remained in the gospel accounts when the oral traditions were written down, despite the fact that they went against the grain of later Christian teaching. If Jesus did not exist we would not expect to find contradictory teachings to other Christian sources.

  1. In the epistles thought to be genuinely written by Paul (1 and 2 Corinthians, Galatians, etc.), Paul mentions the apostles (1 Corinthians 15:3-8) and even claims to have met Jesus's own brother James and the apostle Peter, claiming even further that he had a confrontation with the Apostle Peter (Galatians 2:11-21). While Paul could have made these connections up, it seems more likley to myself that a historical Paul really did meet with and know these apostles.

  2. It is very possible that some of the disciples did not believe Jesus resurrected from the dead (Matthew 28:16-17).

This would more likely be a historical remnant that made into the gospels as it does not seem likely to be something that would have been made up had Jesus not existed historically.

All this information is taken from and credited to Bart Erhman's books "Did Jesus Exist?" as well as "Jesus: Apocalyptic Prophet of the New Millenium".

Andrew

AHWalter1989 5 Apr 8
Share

Enjoy being online again!

Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.

Create your free account

3 comments

Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.

0

Using a religious text to validate historical facts and characters is a fool’s errand, whether it be the Vedas, Tanakh, Bible, Quaran or the Book of Mormon.

0

Sounds like you've been reading Ehrman(sp?). 😀 I guess it doesn't matter is Jesus existed. What matters is if magic existed. Honestly, the thing that caused me to turn away from my family's christo-obsession was the fact that magic simply ain't here. If god was so magical, there would be SOMETHING. Anything. Prayers that work, healings, mountains running a10k. ANYTHING. But Fortune tellers, magicians, witches, whatever... Pick some modern majic thing and it will be some dude doing a thing to get money and claiming it is magic. There's nothing modern, no matter how minor, that anyone could demonstrate is supernatural one would think, if good is SOOOOO important, SUUUCH a big deal, so necessary to believe, that if you followed some path to discover this god... THERE WOULD BE SOMETHING THERE!! But there never is. Same with Jesus. Maybe he lived. I don't know or care. I'm only certain he ain't magic.

Right, I definitely don't believe in the Supernatural elements of Jesus ministry for his resurrection. This is stuff that just really interest me and even the points that I made in the post set aside I find it extremely hard to believe that he didn't exist at all.

And yes I have a lot of Ehrman books lol

the Bible goes into that, "miracles are for the lost" basically

@AHWalter1989 apparently as near as we can tell no one lived in Nazareth in the first century AD. Before and after, yes, but imo Nazareth was deliberately chosen for its etymology. Jesus (Joshua) was the most common name then, and Nazareth, can anything good come from it? "Jesus of Nazareth" thus equates to "John Doe from Nowhere" in a certain idiom, perhaps; bc rabbis were identified with their "school," "Paul of Tarsus," etc

1

I have some responses to the post but it’s late here now so I’ll get on it tomorrow.

I will say though that to establish the gospel narratives as fact is like attempting to ascertain where the little pigs obtained their straw, sticks and bricks.

Nice didactic story but the detail as far as factuality is concerned is irrelevant.

word

You can include a link to this post in your posts and comments by including the text q:481899
Agnostic does not evaluate or guarantee the accuracy of any content. Read full disclaimer.