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Saw this picture and wanted to share and ask for your thoughts. The caption that went with this (from FB) says: "There's this and the fact that Calvinism's so entrenched, we still see wealth as a sign of God's favor and poverty as somehow our own fault."

poetdi56 7 May 21
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8 comments

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1

The propaganda is still strong. People have been conditioned for a long time from generation to generation. More philosophy and critical thinking should be taught in schools.

0

This is just my opinion:
With capitalism it is necessary to maintain a large segment of society as the working poor.
Why else do they reward the poor for having children in the form of tax credits, supplements and deductions? With the world facing overcrowding and food shortages, why reward those who continue to have children and are producing this oncoming crisis?
I look forward to your replies for a differing view that I may not be aware of. Be nice, please.

You're forgetting that all US citizens are given those tax exemptions for dependents, not just the poor, so by your logic everyone is rewarded and incentivized in the same way for producing the population crisis which was foretold by overpopulation alarmists in the 1970s and didn't happen then and in my view likely won't happen now either. What lowers birth rates is education and wealth, actually. Or on the other end of things, resource constraints.

Personally I don't see the constituency of the left as some sort of permanently disadvantaged underclass. In the US the left has become much more elitist and so the wealthy and powerful are also their constituency (in fact, disproportionately and dysfunctionally so). Besides, there will always be people down on their luck or working their way up, without anyone having to either put them there or keep them there.

To me liberalism is far more aligned with the human condition: that is, life is universally difficult and we need to help each other through it. On the other hand, conservatism's ethos is more that of the rugged individualist who cannot acknowledge the role of good fortune but insists their success is entirely due to their personal pluck and persistence (and, of course, the favor of god in exchange for their fealty to him -- or some proxy such as their adherence to tradition). Conservatism also treats everything like a zero-sum game; we can't help the disadvantaged without diminishing those who are accomplished.

I'm speaking of American-branded liberalism and conservatism; it's a little different in other countries.

1

I read somewhere that 97% of US citizens would not sell their citizenship.* The protestant work ethic is strong in this one Obe Wan. We in the UK and Europe have a more balanced or bi-polar (depending on your perspective) political arena. With real socialists Ne-Marxists and landed gentry, plus all the shades in between. The left say they are working for the poor but so does the right. They both have vested interests. The former to keep their power base ie. downtrodden underclass. The latter to protect theirs ie. wealth. Pays yer money and...

*tried to google it but no luck

Well stated. Thank you.

2

The Grapes Of Wrath was an master piece.

Coldo Level 8 May 21, 2018
2

Steinbeck is right. If your poor in America, you look at it as a temporary thing.

2

I think the capitalist cultural hegemony is very strong in the United States. Who in America would dare to say out loud they're a communist?

It's hard enough to say one is a democratic socialist. As soon as one hears the word "socialist" it is assumed that the person is a Nazi - because no one wants to research and know what it really is.

@poetdi56

I've noticed the right wing media deliberate peddling this dishonest conflation. There was nothing Socialist about the Nazis.

@Ellatynemouth They hear the word "Socialist" and say (this has actually been said to me) well, they were the "National Socialist Party" without researching what "socialism" means - or meant!

@poetdi56

In a strange way, it's a direct echo, but a converse echo of the Nazis' original use of the word, which was used to deliberately trick a working class, disillusioned with capitalism into believing they were their allies.

@NotAndrew

I think Bernie Sanders is a Democratic Socialist, like Jeremy Corbyn. It's distinct from Socialism in that it doesn't want a workers revolution or to overthrow the ruling class. It's all for the status quo but less barbaric than neoliberalism.

1

I agree, but I think it's slowly becoming less like that.

How so, @tnorman1236?

@poetdi56 I think more poor people, instead of feeling like they can make it, feel like it's hopeless, and that they'll never make it. And I think our societal Calvinism is only entrenched in the Establishment.

@tnorman1236 Yes, I see that. I also see poor people vote against their own interests. I read an interesting article a few years back that says that in the US, this behavior dates back to the civil war, when poor whites were "promised" a seat at the table, giving them a leg up on the soon-to-be-freed slaves.

@poetdi56 Yes, that's true. There are a lot of poor people who vote against their own interests, but now I think it's more because they've been fed on a steady diet of right-wing propaganda, that provides simple answers that appeal to their sense of injustice. For example: If you don't have a job, it's because those dirty Mexicans are taking it!

1

Yep we're all just Ferengi.

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