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Turning the tables on the theists, I say "There's a lot more to life than faith. Our five senses and intellect have a lot more to tell us."

tioteo 8 Mar 15
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And we realize that our senses can deceive us so we often look for other things like science to confirm our senses rather than be told what those senses said.

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"Faith is believing what you know ain't so." --Mark Twain

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Having as a nullifidian rejected faith and all religions, to me at least, saying that ‘there's a lot more to life than faith,’ is a bit like saying ‘there's a lot more to life than cancer.’ As Peter Boghossian has said, 'faith is belief without evidence;' it is 'pretending to know things you do not know.' I’ve come to the position that the very attitude of faith, and the unwarranted deference paid to the religious expression of it in society, plays a significant role in stunting our advancement.

Even the author of Hebrews offered an oblique definition, “Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.” Hebrews 11:1 (KJV) I find nothing principled or virtuous in attempting to turn hope into a substance or desperately grasping for unseen evidence!

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Without faith is living and not just existing for a fairytail.

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I agree! Except for "...Our five senses..."

Why?

@NothinnXpreVails We have more than 5 senses. I was being facetious in how I suggested it. 😀

@SamKerry We do? Name them.

@pnullifidian Balance and direction being two more than the 5. There are more but are less obvious. I can't name those others.

EDIT: one more: sense of knowing where parts of your body are.

@SamKerry I'm not on board with the notion that balance, direction and locational knowledge of our body parts (proprioception) are senses. Rather, they are manifestations (or demonstrations) of the five—and there really are only five—sources of data. From before we’re born, our brains are fed a steady stream of sensory data, which are compiled, stored and accessed with or without our awareness. These data are used in creating models of the world which can be easily incapacitated by drugs or injury. But the pathways to the brain are the sensors, or data collectors, which build the models that inform our balance, direction finding and proprioception.

@pnullifidian Balance is neither from sight nor hearing. And definitely not from smell and taste. It's very closely related to touch. But it's not really either.

Get an ear infection and you'll lose some sense of balance but not your hearing.

But hey, don't debate me. Debate those that have suggested that we have more than 5 senses. I grew up learning that we only have 5. But somewhere along the way, I decided not to be so close-minded.

@SamKerry Dude, I don't want to debate you ... I'm just here for the conversation! And you're right about the inner ear and balance ... but isn't that an extension of touch (nerves)? Anyway, thanks for your reply! Peace.

@pnullifidian I suppose that sounded a little bit harsher than I intended. I forget to add the 😛 sometimes.

@pnullifidian all senses come from nerves. It’s just what those nerves are connected to and respond to that dictates what the sense is.
By suggesting that balance is similar to touch you seem to be saying that you are grouping all nerves that respond to mechanical stimuli. If so, then that would make hearing the same as touch. But we already separate those 2, and I suggest that most people would debate that touch and hearing are different.
Not all sensation on our skin is mechanical either: there are separate nerves for detecting cold and heat. These often get lumped in with “touch” though, despite being distinct.

@miffy Understood. I probably wasn't doing a very good job of making distinctions regarding the stimuli being detected. Sonic waves are a form of pressure, which cause the ear drum to vibrate, moving the small bones in the inner ear.

@pnullifidian the small bones in the inner ear then move air along the cochlea, where there are tiny hairs connected to nerves. As the air moves back and forth in the spiral of the cochlea, it pushes these hairs, whose movements are detected by nerves. Hence the "mechanical" sensing I referred to.
The other part of the inner ear is the vestibular system. It also uses hairs to sense movement, this time of fluid. This gives us balance. It's the same mechanical sensing, but few people would consider it similar to hearing.
The point is that the mechanism for sensing doesn't really matter. So long as it's used to detect a different stimulus, then it's a different sense.

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They reveal the truth over fantasy and dillusion.

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Amen, brother!

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