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A little knowledge: "
When would you estimate the "dumbing down” of America began? I submit that It is a relative condition. To some extent our society has always been relatively ignorant and under-educated, but I think the largest factor contributing to the current cognitive dissonance which is endemic in our society is the advent of computers and social media. The large majority of the "great unwashed" who were never educated, now possess the sum total of all knowledge. But there is a difference between truth and knowledge! In the words of Alexander Pope, "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing", but I would add that a lot of unverifiable knowledge can be even more dangerous!

fishline79 7 Feb 4
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Maybe when we stopped having any parameters for qualification to government positions and started electing movie stars, game show hosts and various dumfuks with absolutely no political acumen or background.

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The kids these days with their smartphones and tiktoks:

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This may seem to be an echo chamber statement on this site, but I think that religion and marketing have a lot to do with it. Since it seems to be worse in America than many places, and in America religion is strengthened by the lack of a state religion, and the separation of state and church, which made religions into free enterprises unshackled and unrestricted by the state, and highly competitive. Able and willing to do what all advertising companies want, which was to market the idea of. "Buy our product and get it all, everything you want, happiness, wealth, community, status, marital happiness etc. etc. "

And that helps to deepen the feeling that. "I want". Is a valid a source of truth, which need not bow to evidence, effort or wisdom. Because getting what you want all the time regardless, is promoted a a human right and transcendent truth in the US.

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I am quite certain it started in the middle 50s to early 60s.

Based on what evidence.

@fishline79 Based on the evidence that I was there and lived through it.

@dalefvictor But how do you know it didn't begin before that since you have no comparative data? I guess it was a stupid question anyway, because we have always been idiots! I base my assertion on stats from the DOE on test scores etc. and from working in schools and talking to students. They are not the same as when I was in school. What's more, they generally, don't seem to care.

@fishline79 The people who went to school when I did had a different structure to work with, if you were alive you would remember the new math, the way to have it so children do not learn math. Of course, there are those who will learn no matter what, but the there are also those who will not learn and then move to take political office.

@dalefvictor I'm too old for "New Math" but the math that had been around since the Greeks and the Persians was evolved to the level attained for thousands of years, and I can't imagine creating a new way to do math. It is a fixed science and an exact art and I don't think it can evolve and transform itself into something new. 2+2 still equal four. There's no changing that!

@fishline79 My primary school was an “experimental” school. I learned a “new math”, beginning in grade 1, which was in 1955. I still use it. It is very different from the NEW new math, which I find very confusing. As long as people DO learn to do maths to arrive at accurate results, I don’t think it matters which way they do it.

@MsKathleen I'm sure you are right. It's just a different "key" that opens the same "lock". We're near the same age. 1955 was the year my mother passed away, just before I started the third grade. It was a bad one for me! I never had any "new math" but algebra was a complete mystery to me. I guess it was started by Pythagoras but I know it was Greek to me! I'm an artist, and although there have been great artists who have excelled in maths, I am decidedly not one of them!

@fishline79 there was Algebra in my primary grades’ “new math”, so when I studied that in grade 9, it was very easy for me…and pretty much the same for geometry in grade 10. But maths never truly held my interest; words were where I was enamored. Also having a creative nature, I think I am both left- and right-brained. But who cares, I’m just an old lady trying to lead a peaceful life in a chaotic world.

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The concept of "dumbing down" of America is subjective and has been debated by scholars and experts for decades. It is difficult to determine a specific time frame or a single factor contributing to it. However, the widespread use of computers and social media has certainly played a role in shaping the way people access and process information, leading to potential problems such as the spread of misinformation and echo chambers.

I’m sorry but in the US, people are just plain stupider than they used to be. Television and poor nutrition are probably more to blame than computers and social media. Religion being brought into politics also can share the blame, because people appear to be predisposed to believe their religious leaders’ ignorant lies.

@MsKathleen I agree, my point only being that media is big enough for people to completely avoid all forms of truth in their political bubbles. That's something you couldn't do when there were only 3 networks and they were controlled by the fairness doctrine where every political position had to have equal time with opponents to that political position.
The fairness doctrine of the United States Federal Communications Commission (FCC), introduced in 1949, was a policy that required the holders of broadcast licenses both to present controversial issues of public importance and to do so in a manner that fairly reflected differing viewpoints.
In 1987, the FCC abolished the fairness doctrine, prompting some to urge its reintroduction through either Commission policy or congressional legislation. However, later the FCC removed the rule that implemented the policy from the Federal Register in August 2011.
So Reagan shot the fairness doctrine and Obama killed it.
We've had nothing but ever increasing polarization ever since.

@Willow_Wisp The REAL problem is with the education system. We used to teach children to research, to analyze, to evaluate, to THINK. Public education no longer does that. And if you do not believe that is intentional, you’re a damn fool.

The taking over of state governments over the decades has helped in the way they have controlled the school's cariculums and the school books they approved. These are politicians, not educaters making these decisions.

@MsKathleen You may be partially right, but as to television, it depends on what you watch. I watch a good bit of television, and used to work for "Public television" and in addition to old movies, I watch Animal Planet, Discovery, Nat, Geographic, "news and Information" channels (except Fox and other right wing propaganda) History Channel etc. and if you ignore the increasing commercial content I find that you can learn a lot from the medium. On the other hand, computers and Social Media can be very dangerous in the wrong hands, due to the unaccountability factor, especially among younger users. I am a "Baby Boomer" and I believe my generation was among the last to receive a relatively good "Public Education". Modern kids can't write cursive, they don't learn Geography or Civics, and History has always been relative or sketchy, even for "Boomers". Most recent products of modern education can't even speak their own language properly. An example I often use is the simple articles "the" and "a". "The" is pronounced "thee" before a word beginning with a vowel, and "thuh" before a word beginning with a consonant. Today, even trained TV journalists and school teachers don't know this simple rule of usage. Although the letter "A" is pronounced as a "long" vowel sound, ie. "Aee" and the article a is soft, (uh). If you want to glean general knowledge, it begins with having parents who are your primary teachers and who take the time to instill a desire to learn. In todays world of obsession with consuming, working, peer pressure and "Pop Culture", it is rare to find such a home environment. There are more factors such as overcrowded classrooms, and inclusion programs, and distractions and over-attention to sports etc. but that is my opinion in a nutshell. I have worked in education and have made several documentary films on the subject, including the first introduction of "I.E.P" programs in Pennsylvania. I also believe "cell phones" have no place in the primary and secondary school environment, but computers, if used properly, but not exclusively, can have a positive effect on the learning process.

I have ready access to information that wasn’t available as a kid with limits of an old encyclopedia, high school educated parents, and actual card catalogs in analog libraries.

Sadly people spend too much time polarized and siloed on social media, but this too is a social media site where good discussion can be had. There are still the deluded and lost in our midst.

If I want the latest on news about health and science I can peruse Google News and avoid Epoch Times like the plague, but find some decent references to original articles if not paywalled. There’s plenty of information, way too much and information is not knowledge and that’s not wisdom.

Cable TV is crap, but informative documentaries can be had on streaming or even Youtube. Entertainment too.

@Scott321 Don't get me wrong. Computers and the "Web" have put all knowledge at our fingertips. I donate to Wikipedia. But, as you say, the average person never even approaches the potential afforded by computers. They don't care. Knowledge has become old hat and un-cool. They're only interested in the damage they can do with technology. Youngsters love destroying things, and have no respect for life, property or knowledge. Of course you realize there are always exceptions, but they are getting rarer.

@Scott321 Just a reply: I have used a computer to teach myself Programming, C++, and Python, the rudimentary aspects of some graduate mathematics, writing. I listen to several podcasts and consider them to be great resources for information. Computrs and the Internet can be used to great advantages as well as great folly.

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I just do not know where to begin.

That's a good start.

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