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Creepy McCreeperson..

At what age, if any, does it become creepy for a man to hit on, or flirt with a 21 year old girl?

Please explain your answer.

AMGT 8 Dec 15
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6

The formula is half the man's age, plus 7. So to date a 21 year old, you should be no more than 30.

Curious where that formula came from. Does it have a scientific basis, or is it folklore? Does it mean that it's cool for a 70 yo man to date a 42 yo woman, but not a 41 yo?

I think 10 years difference on both side is pretty fair. Beyond that they should consider adoption

I'm not sure where I heard it. And ultimately, of course, what two concenting adults do is their own business.

There is no formula.That is ridiculous.
The legal formula is for both consenting parties to be over 18.

@AMGT
HAHAHA! That's awesome!

0

There is a world of difference between hitting on someone and flirting. I know a number of octogenarian flirts both male and female I don't find anything creepy about any of them.
Why does age matter? I have seen some creepy 21 year olds hitting on women their own age.

As in anything there are lines that should not be crossed, and part of flirting is knowing what those lines are and recognizing that you are making the other party uncomfortable.

1

Tough question, considering both parties are most definitely adults. In a way, I feel like age is just a number so long as adults are involved. That said, as a 45 year old, I know that I would have little to nothing in common with a 21 year old woman. Could I find one attractive? Absolutely! Might I flirt with one? Probably not intentionally but I am a poor judge of age sometimes and I might think she were closer to 30.

Right or wrong, men are visual people and any man who tells you that a young woman (~21) could not be attractive is lying to you. Generally speaking, most men no matter what their age would find a 21 year old woman attractive. Maybe it's just because I'm not the overly aggressive type, but I think most flirting is harmless. A 60 year old flirting with a 21 year old would be pathetic for sure. Probably a little creepy too, but that's mostly for the target of the flirting to decide.

LEGALLY adults. Developmentally? I still maintain that my father was a child, in his 60s... granted, he was a very high functioning child. 🙂

Similarly, I have met younguns that scare me with their maturity! 🙂

And, for the record, I work with developmentally delayed adults who really are children, despite their chronological age.

@Gnarloc Heck, I'm 45 and still act like a teenager sometimes when I'm taking a break from the realities of working and paying bills. 🙂

My oldest daughter is 13 and she is very mature, intelligent and well-spoken for her age. I sometimes forget myself that she literally is still a child but it does show on occasion.

Some of the people I work with are in their late twenties and early thirties and even there I can tell a difference in how they view things and their overall level of maturity. There is little substitute for personal experience that comes only with age.

@KevinD872 No argument there, in fact, I think you are supporting my commentary. 🙂

In fact, I agree that a LOT of growth occurs twixt 20 and 30.

5

Consenting adults, blah blah blah, not my place to judge. But, speaking for myself I'd be disinclined to flirt with a woman so young. I can't imagine we'd have much in common, and perspectives are vastly different the further apart the ages are, especially at such a young age (more wiggle room as people get older). I might have considered 21 compatible when I was 30-ish, but I'm not sure. At 40, I'd maybe consider 30 — but I'm talking hypothetically, and each individual in reality would deserve to be considered on their own merits.

I think it 'scales' as we get older, something you are hinting at.

At 21, dating a 30 year old is a bit much (lots of change between 21 and 30). 21-25? Sure.

At 30, dating a 40 year old doesn't seem too far along to me. As they are at similar development levels.

Similarly, a 35 year old dating a 50 year old... again, it's a stretch but not too much of a stretch.

A 40 year old dating a 55 year old seems ok to me, easily ok and depending on the individuals, 40-60 doesn't seem too much.

A 50 year old and a 70 year old? Would anyone notice? Really? But, a 40 year old and a 20 year old we'd ALL notice and probably be judging.

@Gnarloc, well stated. Yes, that was something I was hinting at. I think life experience is more similar across age gaps as we get older, so it makes less difference (as you said, 50 with 70, vs. 20 with 40).

0

Old enough to be the parent.

So, a 5 year span?

I say that because the youngest known mother was 5 years old!

And yes, I know she is an outlier. How about we freeze normal 'fertility' at 16? So, a span of 16 years or less?

It's late and I'm tired so not sure I'm understanding, so yeah, personally think a 15+ age gap is pushing it.
If anything, and this is just off personal exp bias. Women statistically live longer than men so a much older spouse is increasing the likely hood and sooner, the older the man, that one gets to join the shitty club of widowhood. That did not pay off in my case however.

and gross at 5 year old mother. Nightmare fuel !!! o.O

0

A 21 year old woman is a young adult, not a "girl". She can vote, go to bars and clubs, join the military etc. without her parents consent.
What else is creepy to you? Different races dating? Same sex relationships? Where do you draw the line at who you are judging?
We have a legal age of consent for a reason. Outside of that you are just judging consenting adults and their choices and THAT is creepy AF.
Judging relationships based on age is the type of behavior I would associate with religious types.

@AMGT It is a little disturbing that you want to preface your comments with a warning to me "of suffer(ing) any more contempt" before I answer.
Am I understanding that right? That this was meant to be a warning from you? A bit of a bully sort of thing to do don't you think? That I should not discuss your post for fear of contempt from my fellow agnostics.
I never thought a forum of "freethinkers" would try to stifle free thought or conversation this way. If I am misunderstanding your intent behind your statement, please let me know what you really meant.
By the way, I did read through most comments. I can't say all of them, however. Is there one in particular you are referring to or would like to share with me?

I think the real issue is not age or flirting but how you feel about people and the difference in age between them.
You have an issue about dating age differences. Many people do. There is no formula for this, legally, other than the age of consent in the USA being18 and over. If we aren't discussing the legality of dating then we are really talking about or feelings about age differences. Opinions.
Sure, we can talk about the science of brain development to bolster an argument about our feelings of being "creeped out" but then would it not stand to reason we should change the age of consent to 25 or 26? No sex till then? Change the age of adulthood? Change the age to drive and vote?

This is really three separate discussions you rolled into one:

  1. What is it to be creepy or creepiness? Can it be quantified? Can we study the center of the brain that produces these feelings in us? Is creepiness the behavior of the individual or the person perceiving it?
  2. What is an appropriate dating age difference between consenting adults? Legally, scientifically, your feelings aside?
  3. Why do people send unsolicited sexually suggestive sexual messages online? Is this simply bad behavior? Or is there something deeper at work in the brain? What is the science behind this?

While it is unfortunate your 21 year old adult daughter experienced sexually inappropriate comments from a person, whether that person is male or female, the same age as her or 40 years apart is hardly relevant. What is relevant is the persons behavior. The man in the scenario you shared in your comments was inappropriate. That is not ok.
The fact that the man was vastly older than your daughter is a whole other conversation.
You ask "Would I encourage a relationship?"
I would not encourage any relationship between any people if one of the people is offended by the others behavior, regardless of their age. It doesn't seem like you are asking a serious question. Who wants to date an asshole?
If you are asking if I would encourage a relationship between two people with a 40 year difference in age, practicality aside, it is none of my business and do not have an opinion about it one way or the other just as I do not have an opinion about an interracial couple or a same sex couple.

By you using the word "creepy", common with middle schoolers and HS kids, you attempt to "other" a person. To separate him or her from us and put them in your "creepy" box.
You are saying in so many words that you find age differences (in dating) creepy and looking for agreement here. You are trying to shame or ostracize people for behavior that is not illegal, but simply outside of your comfort zone or understanding.
Your comments seem to support this.
This is the same sort of thought that was (and still is in some places) applied to interracial couples or same sex couples. Many people considered it "creepy" to marry or date outside of ones race or to date the same sex. It was deemed illegal for many years until we wised up.
That feeling of "creepiness" towards these groups of fellow humans led to them being ostracized, disgraced and even led to their deaths by execution, murder and suicide.
By all means, call the man out on his bad behavior but his age, just like ones sex or race is hardly relevant other than he should know how to act at this point in his life.

Instead of a discussion about neuroscience and evolution, we are really discussing your feelings and opinions. Not science. Not law.
You're a mom, you're protective of your daughter. We get it. I think that is a more interesting topic. How about a discussion of the neuroscience of protectiveness or sexual aggression?
There were many great answers about peoples opinions on this subject but ultimately they are feelings and opinions and not based in science.

0

So far this is the creepiest post I've seen in a while...and I Redid. If someone has to ask this question I'm just gonna assume they've probably crossed some inappropriate boundries.

Not that it matters so long after the fact, but @AMGT wasn't a creepy guy asking about boundaries. She is a former member here who was asking this q bc a somewhat older guy was hitting on her 21yo daughter or niece and she wanted to get some outside opinion.

1

If you get parental consent, it doesn't matter.

Roy Moore

so glad we are 1 moore less! ugh!

0

If he is a man of God then any age is unacceptable to hit on a 21-year-old woman. Creepy Bible thumping jerk (:

0

Don't date anyone younger than your own children.

Lol ... my youngest is 47 years younger than I. You've just opened magnificent vistas for me @Paul628

0

If she's 21, I don't think his AGE is what constitutes creepiness, but more his manner. Does he act aggressive, will he not take no for an answer, does he otherwise cling or stalk her?

Zster Level 8 Dec 16, 2017

I will add that age IS a factor if she is a minor, given the local law of consent. Don't get me started on the number of grown men who hit on my friends and/or I without any initiation or encouragement on OUR part when I was under age and mostly interested in boys close to the same age.

4

Well I'm 53 - and sure as hell all the 21-year-old girls I hit on think I'm as creepy as fuck!

lol

0

It all depends on the amount of money in his bank account.

0

It can seem creepy but in the realm of things, it just doesn't matter. If both parties are consenting adults, it would be up to them. Some people find some older people sexy. How many 21 year olds would love Curt Russel to hit on them or maybe Sam Elliott? Some older guys may be sexy to some younger girls. I know a lot of younger girls look sexy to me but I would only hint at hitting on them unless they appeared interested. It don't have to be a lifetime commitment type thing. Sometimes a memory of a lifetime can come from a chance meeting of some guy you thought at first was a creepy old pervert. Now you can be satisfied in the fact you were right. I feel young at heart but I still probably wouldn't hit on a woman under 40. Now when they hit on you, it's a different story. She's probably a hooker.

1

I wonder why you made this post.... hahaha

0

I don't really hit on women at all. Especially with this 'me too' movement going on, it seems like every woman is at the ready to judge me a creep at any second. I know that's probably not true, but there's more to it than just that. (I hear women tell stories about getting hit on at place X and how they just want to get their shit done.) Now, if some young gorgeous woman thought I was brilliant and wanted to hook up with me (which is never going to happen, but for the sake of argument) I don't think there's any way I could turn that down. But I don't know that a relationship would work (that's ignoring the fact that I doubt I'm going to find anyone I'm compatible with, let alone a beautiful intelligent woman who doesn't want kids who also happens to be a decade and a half my junior.)
But basically I'm just in the mode where I hope I strike up a real conversation with a woman without having to be the annoying guy who hits on everyone, genuinely find her interesting, and make her fall for me with my biting wit and unbelievable charm that I, for some reason, never display publicly.

0

I thought it didn’t matter. But then I saw some 35-40 something chasing 20 from a different perspective, so maybe I was wrong.

0

I have been in relationships with women 3 decades younger than me. Its hard there are the stares the people thinking they were my daughters. The hardest part is no shared experiences music films books are all how I measure my life. An example of this is protest or folk music it was part of my life and will continue to be until the flying spaghetti monster comes for me. For them its old people music.

0

Whenever I see a large age gap in a relationship, my first thought is "when X was born, the other person was X." If I was 10 years old and you were a baby...we were both kids, and maybe it's ok. But if I could have been old enough to have you as a child myself...that's creepy. Sexual attraction is one thing. I'm 47 years old and I find many young women very attractive and I can reminisce from afar about how I USED to be in my twenties and what it would have been like to have a relationship with an attractive twenty something, when I was a twenty something. But to actually act upon that impulse? No way. The other thing I don't get about older men hitting on younger girls. -- the older I get the younger everyone looks to me. Unless they are a glamoured up Victoria secret model (and even sometimes then) they look like high school girls. I am seeing 20 to 30 year olds that look like college kids. That's just creepy. I am sure there are exceptions, but I believe we all just need to stay in our own lane. My wife and I are 3 years apart, she's older. We have a lot in common, but still 3 years for memories in high school- events, music, etc. were different. I don't know how people with huge age spans even have a conversation. What could they have in common beyond sex? I just don't get it.

0

The rule is half your age plus seven, so anything out of that range is super creepy.

2

I wouldn't say creepy. Creeps can be any age (or gender). But it's just weird, or something. 21 is just coming into adulthood. A person that age could benefit from having older friends, but their dating us better off near their own age.
But please consider that no one wears their age pinned to their shirt. A guy can't know what he's doing until he finds out. Some women look older than they are, and some much much younger. There is no smooth way to ask.

1

I think it would depend on the girl and the circumstances. There are a very few girls who are attracted to older men. Some girls, as well as some guys, look for older men (sugar daddies) to support them.

When I came otu as a gay man at age 23, I looked young for my age and was often mistakenly thought to be still in high school. There were several times where gusy who were older than 40,hit on me. I guess they were hoping I was naive as i looked. I found that to be creepy.

Generally, I adopted the" ten year rule." I would not date anyone who was mor ethan 10 years older than I was. This was mostly because as the age difference gets bigger, there is less chance of there beign anything you will have in common,or enough in common to make a relationship worth pursuing.

3

@AMGT - We are dealing with something that cannot be relegated to numbers. We need to look at motive. As an example with which I have personal experience, my wife is 15 years my junior. We have been together for what could be considered forever based on current trends, and we have four really cool children, even if one is a religious nutcase.

Motive, folks. Motive.

0

I went out with a 22 year old when I was in my mid thirties, and found out we had absolutely nothing in common. My only attraction to her was her beauty and her sparkling personality. Since then I only dated women who were within 4 or 5 years of my age. I think for most people that woul be a good rule of thumb.

0

my guess 55 as then there is not a chance in hell of anything on the cards so why bother someone who has her youth to enjoy

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