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So, I don't want to make this too long, but I gotta let this all out. I am 26, and am deconverting from Christianity right now, and need support. This is my story, and this is where I'm at.

I have tried to deconvert before but it has such a grip on me and is so embedded that this is going to be a struggle and I need support. I was a Christian kid, went atheist at 13, came back to Christianity at 18, left at 23 for a week, and just came right back to it for fear of hell. The fear of hell combined with my struggles with staying sober (I'm in recovery from substance addiction) and also my mental health problems (I get really depressed about death and the meaninglessness of life without a God to give it a purpose) have made me dependent on it. I had alcoholics anonymous drilled into my head and it convinced me that without a God I could not stay sober, and that did not help. I have had some very sunny, mountaintop moments with Christianity, and I've also had hellish moments and been suicidal because of it. I want to leave because the only reason I'd been staying was the fear of hell. I have all but lost my sanity. In 2015, I wound up in a psychiatric hospital after writing a blog that 3,000 people read (I checked the views after I got out) saying all this insane stuff about God, because my religious beliefs basically gave me schizophrenia. I started hearing voices in 2012, during a period of insomnia caused by nearly constant panic attacks about my eternal fate. I had prayed "God, please show me what is going to happen to me" and the same night I had a dream where I went to hell, and since the Bible talks about dreams, I couldn't chalk it up to just a nightmare, and slept about an hour a night for the next eight months, all the while losing my mind with fear. I always had mental illness issues but Christianity gave me severe mental health problems, and I'm miserable and want to get away from and start my journey to recovery now.

The problem is, I don't know if I can get the "God" thing out of my head. It's pretty firmly fixed. I would have a really hard time convincing myself that he doesn't exist. I also worry about going back to substance abuse and depression and my old bad habits of being a jerky, all around crappy person. I don't even have like a moral system apart from "God", and I have no idea who I really am. I went to Bible college for a year and was very devoted. I don't even have an identity apart from the "God" I am trying to stop believing in. And I know only one thing about myself really, and that is that I am a super mean crappy person, and religion was the only thing keeping me in check. I don't know how to be happy and decent without fear.

But, I would like to try. I would like to try to be moral without religion, and happy without it, and sober. And I don't want to rely on it anymore because it's like a medication for my problems with insanely bad side effects, schizophrenia and general mental illness in my case. It's helped me in some ways, but hurt me and my loved ones really badly in others.

So, I'm reaching out for support. Most arguments against the existence of God don't really convince me, but I want them to, so I can heal and be free. I feel like my relationship with God is an abusive one that I can't leave out of fear for my life and wellbeing.

I view it as an addiction-like thing, where I'll have withdrawal effects like depression, and also have the strong urge to relapse because I'll remember the good times and forget how awful the negatives were.

One crock of crud that I have been fed and have a gut feeling isn't true, but still am trying to un-believe is this:

That without the Christian God nobody's heart can truly be happy or satisfied. "Nonbelievers" are made out by Christians to be angry, unhappy, prone to divorce, immoral, and miserable.

Sorry if that offends anybody. Not trying to. It's actually pretty funny. Christians, especially lifelong ones, practically view "nonbelievers" as aliens, and they get curious about them. Like how do they live without God? How do they have morals? How do they find happiness? One of my loved ones is like this.

Coming out as non-religious is gonna be hard. I am married to a Pentecostal Christian man, and his whole family is that way, and I live at their house. Just learned of that term recently. Gay folks use the term, and I just recently heard it applied to deconverting.

I thought atheism was the obvious alternative, but I feel like I want a substitute. Like something else to believe in that I can cling to to keep my life okay. Alcoholics anonymous suggests that you should make up your own conception of God and just pray to and lean on that to keep you doing okay. That's a nice idea but it seems kinda flimsy to me. I've read a bit of the Koran, and I kinda like some Islamic beliefs about kindness, but at the same time it's just another religion with a hell to me that people can misinterpret and run off with and do hurtful things. Buddhism seems too flimsy to me, but I love it at the same time because it's so peaceful. One form of ancient Egyptian religion seems peaceful too, because there is an afterlife in it that everybody gets to go to, that is just a carefree continuation of this life.

I want something, but don't know what. I've had it drilled into my head that people who believe in anything but Jesus are going to have a horrific, neverending nightmare of a fate. So I'm scared. I believe there is a "loving infinite spirit of the universe" kind of a thing at the very least. Don't know exactly what that is. I just believe that there is some sort of a "God" if you want to call it that.

I'd like to believe that it doesn't matter what religion you are, even if you are wrong, he/she/they/whatever answers prayers and loves humanity anyway.

Thanks for reading this.

Deconverting5 2 Aug 3
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8 comments

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Deconverting5, you have poured a lot of issues out in one big gush. It sounds like you are tied in knots of anxiety about belief. It was not clear to me why you desperately want to "un-believe." I am left to guess.
But here is what helped me get past fear. I was raised deeply immersed in Pentacostal teaching. It is all fear based. But it was crucial for me to recognize that the church, the Bible, and the existence (or nonexistance) of God are three separate issues.

You can know by just examining the facts that the church is full of hypocrisy, a fragmented, fundamentally human organization in thousands of separate versions, whose clout depends on convincing people that it alone speaks for God. It is bullshit. Rejecting the church does NOT mean you are necessarily rejecting God. That is for you to define.

Second, recognize that the Bible is a hodge-podge assemblage of archaic writings from a largely illiterate culture. You can literally pull out verses to argue almost any claim. It is refuted many places by science and archeological evidence. It even directly contradicts itself in a number of places. So read some scholarly, critical literature (I suggest "Jesus, Interrupted" ) on the history of how the Bible came to be. Hint: It has evolved over time and likely is not finished being tinkered with. "Infallible" Word of God?, ---not even close.

Third realize your fears of punishment are based on what your church taught you, with some emphasis on cherry-picked Biblical references. With the church authority and Biblical accuracy debunked, the question of whether God exists or not would seem to lack a convincing threat of damnation for being wrong.

If God exists, you have to ask "what kind of God?" If God is love, then Hell makes no sense; it is directly contradicted by the concept of love. If God is all knowing, then undoubtedly God would know in infinate detail exactly why you doubt or don't believe. God would know precisely how and why your flaws and lack if understanding exist and would know it is NOT rebelliousness, rather, it is sincere doubt. A God of love would never punish sincerity, never punish you for being as you were created. And an all-knowing God would have absolutely no reason EVER to be wrathful. Such a God would have known from the beginning precisely what path your life would take, what choices and mistakes you would make, and why. ...as he made you.

Finally, if God is all-powerful and cares about your life, then such a God Would set you up for success, NOT lay traps to confuse and trip you up, only to punish you for eternity.

The entire Christain paradigm is therefore an impossible oxymoron. If the force that runs the cosmos has any unified consciousness, it is certainly up to such an all powerful entity to let you know it exists if it wants that from you. The fact is you only have PEOPLE telling you what to believe.

You laid out issues of concern about addiction and psychosis. Which are a whole added challenge. If you cannot trust your own perceptions to be accurate, then you certainly need all the more to be patient with yourself, accept that mistakes will always be some part of life, and that a forgiving sense of humor about the human condition helps us cope with a lot.

Rejecting religion does NOT mean you are never allowed to use moral/value principles that you might find in religious teachings. Some of those ideas are very good. But religion does NOT own those principles. It just claimed falsely to have invented them. Reject that religious authority bullshit. Remember, God is anything someone decides. It is metaphor. You can use or reject the term "God" as you like. You are not fighting God. You are fighting your very human religion's control tactics, it's lies and hypocrisy. God, if such a being exists, can surely take care of him/her-self. You are off the hook. ?

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Atheism is no substitute for religion. It is just the lack of a belief in any form of a deity. It is a factual matter. One can be an atheist criminal or atheist politician or atheist anarchist or atheist anything.

I look at the world a bit differently than you — and did when I went through something like you are going through — years and years ago, for me. I naturally separate questions of fact and value, and accept that I must deal with facts no matter the inconvenience of those facts for my values. I adapt my values.

Which made it easier to get rid of ideas that I thought erroneous. No matter how useful some fictions are, some falsehoods can be, I let them go. Or have tried to.

Perhaps you could look at this as your first step into heroism, into courage. Steel yourself to accept reality is as it is.

As for your behavior, it is easier to change than others' behavior. And that's a question of values, of choices, of investment in attention and resources. And here is where philosophies of the ancients are interesting: Stoicism and Epicureanism in particular. Do not worry about what you cannot control. And be practical in your worries, not to disable your ability to make better choices, but to increase your ability to make better choices.

There is a growing literature on behavior modification that echoes the Hellenistic philosophers in their practicality when it comes to avoiding self-destructive patterned behavior (addictions). We are not left with what Gregory Bateson called "the theology of Alcoholics Anonymous." There are better, more effective ways to improve your life.

But I do not have problems with drinking or other drugs. So I'm not the best advice-giver in this regard. I just know that others have worked on this extensively.

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  1. there is a recovery group on here.....join it 🙂
  2. Secular Buddhism is a good substitute....I still attend all my local Buddhist meeting because I love the people and the community ...and chanting, meditation, and yoga are good for the mind
  3. Read, read, read, read....everything you can on Atheism and debunking religions
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I think you need a multi level approach...

First and foremost...please continue get help for your addiction and mental health concerns. I’m not an expert but it seems that if you continue confront that you will find peace decide what is best for you.

Second, I would question as WHY you feel you need religion be a moral person. If the Bible did not expressly say “thou shalt not kill”....would you go out and murder people??? Most likely not. And let’s not forget that atheists make up an extremely small percentage of the prison population. So morals can be separated from religious texts. You just need find them within yourself.

Also, the reason I am an atheist. Trust your eyes and trust yourself. I originally left organized religion due hypocrisy and their greed. That led me explore the concept of “god” and I came the conclusion thru my own observation that god does not exist.

I hope you find yourself on this journey ( and it is a journey) and that you overcome your fears. Feel message me if you need talk

Good luck

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I’d start with investigating the history of the idea of hell, this helped me a lot. Basically the early religions had an underworld where all souls went, and the idea of a place for punishment came along later. The ideas of the Christian hell were very much shaped by fiction such as Dante Alighieri’s Divine Comedy and the paintings of the likes of Hieronymous Bosch. Get a handle on the fact that hell is a human invention, and that it evolved over many years.

Then I’d look into comparative mythology. Christianity is a mythology like any other, and it originated in quite a limited geographical area. All over the world there are other mythologies and creation stories. So what makes one mythology more true than another? Are they not all man-made and therefore false?

Then I’d watch some YouTube video’s, the ‘four horsemen’ of atheism are fun, especially Dawkins and Hitchens. This might be a good place to begin:

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If it helps, I was raised without god and am not any of those things you were raised to think about me. I'm good without god. I say that I am agnostic with strong atheist leanings. Who am I to say definitively there is no god? However, I see no evidence of one. But if there is one, I truly believe that I would not go to hell because I am a good person. What kind of shitbag sends people to hell for the crime of being born into a religion that's not the "right" one? That doesn't sound like a loving god to me.

Remi Level 7 Aug 4, 2018
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Sounds scary. You could try taking CBD oil, since studies show it eases anxiety, and is found in most health food stores.

Link: Cannabidiol is a compound derived from cannabis plants that helps people with anxiety reduce their symptoms with few or no side effects. [medicalnewstoday.com]

1

The thing that has helped me the most is studying the ways of science. Not just the products of science, but the ways scientists think. It’s hard to give something up when there’s nothing to replace it, but understanding the basic philosophy behind science, and particularly evolution, will gradually displace the need for religious literalism. And don’t be in too big of a hurry. It takes time.
Best wishes.

skado Level 9 Aug 4, 2018

Right on, it's a lifetime endeavor

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