I was watching 'Mindhunters' and as I worked in forensic psychiatry for many years started thinking about the old serial killers. Now arguably this is a very white male phenomena (with a few exceptions) and commonly boys who were very damaged as youngsters. It made me think, it has actually been many years since the last serial killer. Obs early 00s we had Dr. Shipman here in UK who may have been the world's worst (He didn't really meet the usual criteria though) Since then I haven't heard of another. Now you guys have had the mass shootings quite often in recent years and certainly DNA evidence is going to mean it is unlikely that the perpetrator wouldn't get caught. Why do you think they stopped? If it is DNA evidence or possibly the early recognition of some key characteristics (like interest in death, killing and torturing animals etc)? Can we somehow extrapolate that information to try and understand these mass shooters?
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Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.Maybe it's because all the dangerous psychopaths with a desire to destroy the society that nurtured them go into politics these days.
MrBeelzeebubbles
Level 7
Aug 19, 2019
1
I think they always did
It is easy to identify likely perpetrators of many crimes - but what do you do with them? the law says you must allow them the freedom to commit the crime before you can lock them up
ShadowAmicus
Level 8
Aug 19, 2019
0
Well actually not here in UK. People can be detained under the Mental Health Act if they are deemed a danger to themselves or others. A potential for danger within a broader established diagnosis is adequate. I looked after a man who had broken into a nurse's house and hid. His intention was to kill her. Luckily she decided on that evening to go out after work. The guy was discovered by neighbours. When he was arrested he had dozens of notepads with names and addresses and graphically violent imgaes of what he intended to do with them all. He was assessed and deemed to have schizophrenia. When I met him he was detained under section 37 (41) of the act. Other than the breaking and entering he had commited no other crime. He continued to harbour fantasies of murder although the psychosis had dininished. Once with us he improved a lot. Very nice looking, intelligent guy. The forensic psych said this man was a serial killer who we got to first. We do have the benefits of fairly comprehensive MH care in UK. So yeah, he is still in hospital.
Please excuse typos. I haven't slept
@Amisja But without the breaking and entering - would he have come into the spotlight? and if the notepads etc were known about could / would he have been sectioned?
@ShadowAmicus He was what my uncle would have called, 'wrongun'. The point is he was caught and the 'punishment' was excessive in terms of the actual crime. As in he is not at large. However he is in a forensic hospital which is reasonably comfortable. I am conflicted on this. On the one hand he did not torture and maim lots of young women, however he has lost his liberty for a fairly minor crime. There was another guy who was a self confessed paedophile who harboured thoughts of killing children. He had walked off with a young girl at a fair. He was caught and the child was unharmed. He was arrested and it was during his arrest he confessed his intentions. He had never harmed a child or sexually assaulted one but definitely harboured the intent. He is a psychopath of the disorganised type. Basically if he didn't have these fantasies, you might call him an inadequate oddball. He actually ended up with a life tarriff (one of about 4 in the UK who have committed only minor offences). Its a tricky one. I like to think with the many many safety nets and guards against possible misuse, our mental health law is fairly comprehensive but I suppose mistakes can happen. Do you lock up innocent people with psychopathic disorders just because of their stated intent?
@Amisja I suppose it is a judgement - Intent is one thing, the capacity to carry it out is another. I have seen men who could handle a rifle and hit a foot square target every shot ... but once in the situation of shooting at a live human, even when classed as 'enemy' could not shoot ..they often would fire, but miss ..... takes a certain type of person to be able to take a life .... I wonder how many with a mental illness express intent, but would be unable to carry through the crime
Been waiting season two to arrive and will start watching it tonight.
Are you suggesting the decline of the serial killer is related to the rise of the mass shooter? I do wonder about the decrease in serial killings. I wonder if the dynamics required to create that sort of monster are occuring less or there is something else about society that makes it less likely for them to come to fruition, such as more intervention (not necessarily knowingly dealing with a potential killer). I think the mass shooter is more fueled by a desire for violence in a big, showy way. While I think think both types of killers want to traumatize society in general, the serial killers seemed to often have more personal axes to grind as well. Maybe the mass shooters do to, but it hasn't been as apparent to me.
itsmedammit
Level 8
Aug 18, 2019
0
Just wondering, not really suggesting anything. Certainly we have had our fair share of serial killers. Only one mass shooting many years ago. There has also been quite a few more extended incarceration of young people and children (i.e. Josef Fritzel). Thise and shootings have obvious perpetrators. I am aware of suicides by police bullet, which explains a number of the young people involved. Just interesting.
@Amisja Yup, interesting. A few decades ago I did office work for a forensic psychologist. He saw his share of murders but most of them were not necessarily psychopaths. Two psychopaths did stand out and they were both pedophiles and not murderers at the time, though I believe one was subsequently involved in a murder, but it may have been to hide evidence.
We are watching it too and have been wondering the same thing. It also shows BTK's wife catching him in women's clothes and freaking out. Makes you wonder if things would be different now because that sort of thing is more normalized (dressing in women's clothes, not killing people). And the shoe fetish guy too from last season. Would they have become killers if the people around them supported them for who they were instead of freaking out and punishing? The shoe guy was 5 and his mom took the shoes and burned them in front of him, made him feel dirty for liking them. It's really interesting and disturbing.
Remi
Level 7
Aug 18, 2019
0
I worked with a small handful of these type of killers or potential killers. They were always men. All the women had either killed their children as a response to command hallucinations or stolen someone else's child or been extensive self harmers.
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