what is your definition of atheism? For a long time I just thought atheists were people against god and who thought of themselves as god. That was when I was Christian.
Now I consider atheism as just accepting the fact that you don’t know and need evidence before you believe something. Someone rational and a realist
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Try this 'definition,' it pulled me in decades ago; by Madalyn Murray O'Hair:
In 1959, Madalyn filed suit on behalf of her son who was forced to attend Bible readings in his school and was the victim of harassment at the hands of school employees after he declined to participate. In her opening statement before the Supreme Court, Madalyn said:
“Your petitioners are atheists and they define their beliefs as follows. An atheist loves his fellow man instead of god. An atheist believes that heaven is something for which we should work now – here on earth for all men together to enjoy. An atheist believes that he can get no help through prayer but that he must find in himself the inner conviction and strength to meet life, to grapple with it, to subdue it, and enjoy it. An atheist believes that only in a knowledge of himself and a knowledge of his fellow man can he find the understanding that will help to a life of fulfillment. He seeks to know himself and his fellow man rather than to know a god. An atheist believes that a hospital should be built instead of a church. An atheist believes that a deed must be done instead of a prayer said. An atheist strives for involvement in life and not escape into death. He wants disease conquered, poverty vanquished, war eliminated. He wants man to understand and love man. He wants an ethical way of life. He believes that we cannot rely on a god or channel action into prayer nor hope for an end of troubles in a hereafter. He believes that we are our brother’s keepers and are keepers of our own lives; that we are responsible persons and the job is here and the time is now.”
Varn
Level 8
Oct 8, 2019
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Atheism is simply the lack of belief in any gods. There is nothing more to it. It is not a claim of knowledge.
Agnosticism is a claim about knowledge. It is simply acknowledging that it cannot be known whether some being that we would call a god possibly exists outside of our universe/reality/comprehension. It does not necessarily mean that an agnostic thinks the odds are even against there being one, or more, or not. Although, some might think in those terms.
In my opinion:
All atheists are also agnostic (whether they admit it or not) because none of us have access to all the knowledge of the universe, or universes.
All agnostics, meaning those who do not actively believe there IS a god, or gods, are also atheists as they lack a definite belief in any gods.
Joanne
Level 7
Oct 8, 2019
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"All atheists are agnostic" ?. No they are not.
@Moravian : Only in that we cannot legitimately claim to KNOW there is no god or gods anywhere inside of outside of our universe/reality. It simply cannot be known. I absolutely do not believe any exist; but, I cannot claim to have access to all knowledge.
Please, explain to me how you can KNOW that no type of eternal, god being, absolutely does not exist. I know of no scientist, even of the most adamant atheists, who will claim to have that knowledge.
And, again, agnostic does not mean that one thinks there is some possibility of a god, or gods, only that it cannot be known.
@Moravian : I am not saying that I think that there is any chance of there being a god.
Science has shown that no god is necessary, and there is no evidence for one. But, this does not mean that one cannot, or does not, exist --somewhere, in some reality that we do not have access to.
I do not believe that one, or more does; but I simply do not claim to have that knowledge...and no one can legitimately claim to have it. Just as I do not believe the universe has any type of consciousness--but I cannot "know" this.
Now, when it comes to specific gods, I think we can provide evidence that they cannot exist. The god of the Bible, for instance, is simply too contradictory. I have no problem saying that that god does not exist.
@Joanne What is a god ? A supernatural being that controls certain aspects of the natural world. We know nothing before the big bang so if it was instigated by a superior force as some people believe, and this force does not interfere in the workings of the universe as we now know that the universe operates by certain physical laws, it is not a god.
We do not know exactly how life started on earth but we know how it evolved from single celled organism without any interference from any supernatural force so we know that there is no god involved.
So we know gods do not exist;
Anyway I dislike being called an Atheist as it is a label applied by believers who are in my mind illogical and irrational
@Moravian :
By a "god" I mean some being, or consciousness, that is responsible for creating the universe or universes. Even if it not involved in our universe, this supposed being could be off creating more of them. Now, I don't for a moment think this is the case; I simply cannot say that I "know" that no such being exists.
Science does not make any claims that no gods exist--it shows us that there is no evidence for any and that no god is necessary for the universe to behave as it does. It cannot tell us what was before the big bang, or what is possibly outside of our universe or reality as we know it.
Also, people tend to be more comfortable if you say you are an agnostic or a non-believer than if you use the word "atheist." I try to use that word because I want people to see that we are not the evil beings we are made out to be.
What I don't like is to see those who identify as agnostics dissing atheists and making claims that we all think we have all the answers. And, I don't like those who identify as atheists to go after agnostics making claims that they are too timid, or wishy-washy, to make up their minds.
@Joanne OK but watch out that the orbit of Bertrand Russel's teapot doesn't decay and it may fall on your head 
.
Apart from possibly the Hindu gods the only one that really matters is YAWEH the Jewish god.
I have read the first books of the old testament in some detail and it is obvious to me that the polytheist Jews adopted monotheism gradually after exile in Babylonia and used this god to justify their warlike and aquisitive behaviour.
Christianity is just a Jewish cult that got lucky and Islam is just a mishmash of Judaim and Christianity with lots of draconian rules added.
If you can find in there somewhere your god well that's up to you.
You will probably find that responders will say atheists don’t believe in gods of any description and agnostics would be ‘the jury’s out’ guys that you mention in your post.
Geoffrey51
Level 8
Oct 8, 2019
0
Enjoy being online again!
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