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Is any information unknowable?

zing 6 May 14

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Yes, most of the Universe is unknowable

gater Level 7 May 14, 2018

We can't call something unknowable because the only way to know if it was unknowable or not is to know about it. But if it can be known then it is was never "unknowable" to begin with.


I don't think so.

I think the biggest limits to knowing information is the shortness of life in which to learn stuff.


There is no problem that can't be solved if given the necessary time and resources to solve it.


How someone else feels. They can tell you that they are happy, sad, depressed, in pain but you cannot know how they feel in the same way as they do.

cava Level 7 May 14, 2018

mystery of the universe

Rosh Level 7 May 14, 2018

Things might be unknown, but they are not unknowable.

how do you know there’s no
unknowable things?

@mattyrayfray Because if something exists, it can be discovered. It is really simple.

@bobhoff59 That’s not
a fair truism. How can you demonstrate that you can demonstrate everything that exists? Doesn’t everyone on
already know
can’t prove that no
gods exist beyond
any doubt ?

@mattyrayfray nothing exists outside the natural world. There is nothing but that which we can perceive. I know that beyond any doubt, I do not need proof of that which does not and can not exist. It is on the person who claims something does exist to provide hard evidence (proof) that it does. I am not making other claim than what I see and can perceive with my five senses is sufficient to understand the Universe.

@bobhoff59 You can’t perceive dark matter with your five senses. Yet it seems to exist. Your hard empiricism and naturalism is easily being shut out by modern science itself.

@bobhoff59 we have to posit theoretical entities all the time—— and we believe fully that they exist. What entities are there that for some reason we haven’t speculated on or simply do not interact with us? It would be almost quite literally another plane of
existence. Any ontological claim that there’s only what we can see is foolish. youre making a knowledge claim that we can only know what it natural and appears to us—— fun fact,
our abilities to know may be superceded by metaphysical realities.

@mattyrayfray wrong if I can prove it with science I have perceived it with my senses because my eyes have seen and my ears have heard that evidence. This is not hard stuff.

@bobhoff59 No offense but I don't think you have any idea. We can't directly experience ---through our empirical senses-- something like,,,, say, microwaves, yes??? Imagine this--- something like microwaves exists, it doesn't interact with us in any reasonable way,,, or it only exists on a quantum level on the fringes of the universe---- we couldn't know about it. What if something exists so small it simply becomes impossible for us to actually discover? You're not understanding your own (and humanity's own) limitations.

@mattyrayfray We actually can experience the affects of the microwaves through our senses. We know it because science predicted them, tests were developed to prove them, and application, radar, communications and ovens were developed to harness their capabilities. That is what I mean when say I can say through empirical evidence that microwaves exist. It is also how I can say magnetism exist, ultraviolet light exists, electrons and protons exist etc, etc, etc. If it can not be measured then it does not matter and therefore for all practical purposes does not exist.

@bobhoff59 >>> for all
practical purposes. You just lost the argument. The practical expierential usefulness of something doesn’t determine its ontic truth. Get cucked. Normally I’d just agree with you here bc that’s all that really matters but since you came t my comment i wanted to wipe ur bad philosophy. If you can’t see that u pissed the metaphysical
bed here then I’ll have to get y’all ass a tutor.

>>> Also notice i am meming, plz do not take trash talk seriously

@mattyrayfray Don't worry I have thick skin and I also am very confident that my point is not only on solid ground but also absolutely correct. I never said things had to be useful, I was simply pointing out that microwaves were. Also, if something can never ever been measured, just like god can never ever be measured then it no more exists then god exists.


to be discovered? Scientific yes. Time driven.


Sure. There are many things that many people do not know about.


Shrodinger might give you an argument.

His cat won't.


String Theory tends to make my brain hemorrhage but I don't know if it is unknowable to some people, I would suggest that there are some ideas that it is impossible for most people to get their heads around.
I wish there were a few things that I could unsee but once viewed it cannot be unseen. 😉


Don't ask me


I dunno.


Arguably, no. The very concept of information could entail that it be accessible to us. For instance, all
experiential empirical data. Sense datum. Is that information? How about posited entities? Theoretical constructs? Theorems? Semantics are careful and important here. Is there an actual information component to the noumena (the real world which we may not have access to)? I think yes, depending how what the definition of it is. But yeah if we can’t detect something experimentally or experientially it doesn’t mean it’s not there. Frustratingly


What we don't know, we can always make up. Wait, wasn't that how religion started? Danggit


None that we know of.
However, your question reminds me, we need more questions not more answers. Once we question we are on our way.


Dunno. I've always felt safe on the internet.

Me too. And 8-lane freeways too.

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