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“We keep on being told that religion, whatever its imperfections, at least instills morality. On every side, there is conclusive evidence that the contrary is the case and that faith causes people to be more mean, more selfish, and perhaps above all, more stupid.”

Christopher Hitchens

moNOtheist 7 May 31
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10 comments

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1

Amen to that!

Ryksie Level 6 June 12, 2018
4

Religion has always appropriated societal morality and then claimed to be its inventor and protector. It has no morality of its own that's actually real.

1

Some examples do not create a blanket truth. The label of "theist" doesn't create a lack of morality any more than the label of "atheist" does.

Acting as if all theists are anything at all is foolish and does more harm than good as any theist who reads Christopher Hitchens' post will immediately see him (and if they use the same blanket concepts) and all atheists as an enemy.

I am only willing to say that the evidence, such as it is, suggests that Christians do no better in terms of morality or ethics than the general population, and may in fact do a bit worse in terms of outcomes (they are somewhat over-represented in prison populations for example). Since fundamentalists want to turn divorce into a moral failing, I'd point out their divorce rates are slightly higher, too.

Hitchens was hyperbolizing for effect and his agenda was to underscore the harms of religious faith. I do not think religion causes ALL religious people to be "more mean, selfish and/or stupid" but it self-evidently does not counter those tendencies in humans generally, and I can certainly cite examples of spectacular moral and character problems with Christians, like allow children to die of treatable illnesses because they don't believe in using doctors.

@mordant I agree with your thoughts, but not the quoted statement in the OP.

1

My opinion is that morality is just getting along in the pack. We are born with that instinct. Even wolves are moral. A person’s opinion about theology is a trivial thing having nothing to do with morality.

2

Religion just promotes group think because if everyone is doing it, it must be the right thing to do.

2

Seems to me that it comes down to thinking for yourself and making your own judgments. Religious people often just go along with whatever belief they are handed by parents and teachers, but often this is a disguise for behaviour of the lowest common denominator and religious adherence is not much more than lip service.

2

It has always been my opinion that one doesn't need religion to have a conscience.

2

Some believe without religion, people cannot have morals.
Yet perhaps they should follow the "practice what you preach" motto...

4

I hate how many people think you can't have morals without religion. So patronizing to be asked how I can be a good person or decipher wrong from right without religion.

Mea Level 7 May 31, 2018
3

Sounds correct to me!

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