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What's Jesus to you?

People can't seem to agree about this Jesus fellow. Tell me, just what is he???

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silvereyes 8 Jan 19

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0

Just some radical dude that the upper level religious people put on a pedistoool to prolong age control over the masses and for the most part it has done its job.

11

I tend to think Richard Carrier is right about Jesus. It seems very likely that it started as the concept of a celestial, sacrificial, messianic figure and the tale evolved by the time of the gospels to be a flesh-and-blood person. It wouldn't bother me if Jesus were a historical figure (and in many ways I'd prefer it, because we'd have a shot at learning a lot more about who he was and what he did), but historians seem to accept the effect of the stories (the gospels, the letters, etc.) and the proliferation of the religion as proof that Jesus existed. That seems very much like saying that the spread of Scientology through L. Ron Hubbard as prophet is proof of the existence of the overlord Xenu, or that the existence of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints as promoted by Joseph Smith is proof for the existence of Mormon and Moroni. Just because a story has influence doesn't mean the story itself is literally true. So, I suspect — but cannot confirm — that Jesus is merely a fictional figure that became the basis for a religion as the stories morphed and grew.

I agree. I think the bible has is possibly based on a very small bit of truth.

One of many @ the time who probably preach against the hard times and was combined into one myth.

Irony, of all the great writers of the time jesus was never mentioned by any of them which makes on wonder why.

8

I went with one big lie.

If he was doing all of this miraculous stuff, his name should have been in every damn book written at that time.
Only the bible guys got an exclusive on that story? Ok.

Me too.

Check out the timelines and people researched by Ralph Ellis.

@Issa Will do.

@Issa I looked into Ralph a bit and many of his theories are questionable with some reviewers claiming he's a conspiracy theorist. His books seem to me to fall somewhere between the show Ancient Aliens and Dan Brown's book The DaVinci Code.

One thing Paul, there is nothing wrong with Ancient Aliens which is firmly based upon historical records/accounts of the Sumerian civilization that many 'scholars' have validated. There is also nothing wrong with the DaVinci Code, that is strongly cemented within the Gnostic writings - which are valid and speak a lot about Jesus and his works and were rejected by Constantine at the council of Nicaea when he formulated the 'fake' and partial bible that you have obviously only read? As this website is not exclusively about 'scholarly' journal sources, I felt free to post and should be able to without it being disrespected. Also, you will not know the extensive detailed research that went into Ellis work until you actually read it. It is compelling, and I have been a Theologian, and studied this subject for a very long time. I am a psychologist too, and don't buy into just anything, but I am not on the side of disbelieving everything as an Atheist would either. The only problem that I have with Atheists is that they dismiss everything without giving any other research a chance without Atheist colored glasses of the attitude of needing to debunk everything off hand - which is a bit churlish in all honesty. Rise above it and read a new book - the Arthurian legends have validity as well as all of the historical references to people named Jesus in the 1st century. The legends of the person Jesus could have easily been HIDDEN in the Arthurian legends because at the time Rome was trying to destroy everything about any other valide 'leaders' of the day. By 4th century Constantine and the council of Nicea destroyed and hid very many of the writings which you say do not 'exist', because they killed countless people who were witness to any miracles. As a Yogi Master, Jesus had yogic powers, as I wrote in another post and there is much historical documentation to back that up too in India, and Tibet - IE healing, walking on water etc... You have to make a decision at some point in your life as to whether you will allow personal bias to eliminate any abilities you may have had to discover something new, or real - that is outside of your commitment to a total 'lack' of any belief. I responded to you respectfully, I did not consider the tone that you responded back to me as very respectful with your total dismissal of Ellis work because he may be a conspiracy theorist? You did not even read what I referenced before totally dismissing it. That was a very lazy and rude response. If you want others to listen to you then back up what you are saying that involved some real effort on your part, rather than dismissal just because....

@Issa If you think I disrespected you out of hand, that was not my intent. I apologize.

That said I'm not going to buy a series of books that I have no interest in reading. He should have won at least a Pulitzer by now if not a Nobel Prize for his findings.

What you call my atheist bias that I use to dismiss Ellis's work, I call a healthy, skeptical lack of faith.

7

Likely a myth blown out of proportion (canon embellishments) over time.

@MrLizard Lol

Your use of "canon" is interesting. I will have to look into that. I know about canon law and had to meet with a canon lawyer when getting my annulment but I have never thought of linking it with other things.

@JackPedigo

[en.wikipedia.org]

@VictoriaNotes Thank you for this link. I should have known but never really thought about it (too focused on the law part). I looked over the link and something caught my eye (and mind). I noted the part: "...public revelation has ended..." which reminded me of Benedict XVI's (RATzinger) book "The Dictatorship of Relativism" which, to me, was an affirmation of that statement. I then found a great quote against the book that went: "A dead thing can go with the stream but only a living thing can go against it." G.K Chesterton

7

There’s a lot we don’t know and may never know. Rather than guess, I’d prefer to focus on what I know. He was the central character in a book that had arguably the most widespread and most long lived effect on the human population of any book ever written. The question becomes... why? What is it about human psychology that resonates so profoundly with this story, regardless of whether he was real or fiction?

skado Level 8 Jan 19, 2018

It's a complex question to which there is no simple answer, but I think educated speculation tells much. In my little corner of the world I put it up to two primary factors: 1) It was a control strategy by Constantine in the 3rd century to legitimize Christianity, and followed up by the church to be used as a control mechanism. 2) It plays heavily on our psychological archetypes of fear of death and authority.

And it's not just this story... look at Islam.

Islam is the fastest-growing religion in the world. What is it about human psychology that resonates so profoundly with this religion?

I think we have to keep in mind that many people were forced to become Christians throughout history.

@Hominid The book "The Closing of the Western Mind", by Charles Freeman told of how Constantine was a Roman Caesar who saw the power shift of the empire heading East. He also saw how the different religions of the empire were destroying it. He sought, as did our founders, to make no religion the central one and all would be treated equally. He did adopt some Christian ideas but he also remained true to his pagan beliefs. The stuff put out about him and the "sign of the Cross" is Christian propaganda used to gain power for their tribe.

Yes, what is it about all religions? @VictoriaNotes

@skado The development of frontal lobes -- becoming aware of finality.

"Death anxiety is the mother of all religions, which, in one way or another, attempt to temper the anguish of our finitude." -- Irvin D. Yalom

I’m sure that’s part of it. @VictoriaNotes

7

I think it's possible he was the Gandhi or MLK of his time. History just made him more.

That's the first time I've seen Gandhi spelled properly on this site!

@Jnei do you think @Admin will give extra points for correct spelling? Lol

@BeeHappy Maybe they should remove points for bad spelling and grammar.

@JackPedigo hahaha...

6

Jesus is a blunt instrument used by the unscrupulous to beat people's psyches.

6

When I say OTHER, it is because to me Jesus most likely did not exist at all; so I was inclined to say one big lie or fictional zombie. However; there is a possibility that many embellished stories of many characters are responsible for the story of Jesus; not unlike Pecos Bill or Paul Bunyon 🙂 So the embellished answer also resonated with me...so I had to say other. Just because I have to admit I have not done the research necessary to have a definitive stance...just my feelings based on what I do know and have heard.

This is another issue that has been gone over several times. Historians have pretty much proven such a person did exist (see my comments here). Romans have many reliefs showing such a person leading some men. An important historian of the time (Josephus) added to the reality of the man.

6

Jesus backwards (susej) sounds like sausage.
I don't know what to make of the character, 1%wise, 72% contradiction, 27% nutter that argued with a tree, 100% unbelievable.

Dav87 Level 6 Jan 19, 2018

As a fellow Brit, I'm sure you'll be aware of Gregg's the bakers' controversial Christmas ad campaign featuring a nativity scene in which Baby J was replaced with a sausage roll. Say "Lord Jesus" backwards... 🙂

5

a waste of ink in that fictional bible

4

The perfect product for brainwashing people and damaging them mentally and emotionally. Even some of the things he said and did wasn’t always kind.

4

Oh yeah ....Jesus. He's the guy who ...uh...died for our sins, right ?

And did a zombie thing after that, and popped out of a cave, so kids could eat jelly beans ?

He was kinda cute - with a beard and long hair, and sandals.
Looked like a lot of my hippie friends !

4

Fictional character in a very old book of fiction.

4

He really hurt me... I'm sure he is the story of him. I imagine hes hurt a lot of people asking why.

3

Millions of people believe. If he actually lived, this has been going on for over 2000 years. If he actually lived, he's the most influential person who ever lived. If not, the person or people who created his story are the best bullshit artists ever.

3

We know from characters like Joel Olsteen that some people are fully ruthless enough to use the beliefs of their followers to gain power for themselves.

It looks like Jesus might have attempted to do the same, to gain power, wealth and influence. Unfortunately for him, the Romans were having none of it.

3

A myth...

[en.wikipedia.org]

balou Level 8 Jan 19, 2018
3

The late Dave Allen sort of sums up my thoughts on the matter..

2

Jeff Foxworthy lookin mutha fucka.

2

He may have existed. Perhaps in the glorified evangelist, snake oil will heal you kind of way. I also believe mental illness existed. So was Jesus and his homies all a part of writer’s imagination, or perhaps it was real and events were exaggerated to set guidelines and manipulate behavior to a specific point of view? Could be. But I could be wrong.

2

A dude that fixes my kitchen cabinetry with his plethora of carpenter tools and skillz to pay the (holy) bills! 😉

Sadoi Level 7 Jan 19, 2018

You mean the handyman Jesus Garcia? He does good work!

@GareBear517 hahahah! yes! exactly! and around 6pm in the evening, he comes around with the tamale cart and the queso fresco corn on the cob and hot butter! He is most excellent! Good cabinets, better Tamales! Yum!

1

Fictional, I am with carrier on this as well.

1

Think the last Christain died on the cross.

Interviewer: “You accept the historical existence of Jesus?” Einstein: “Unquestionably. No one can read the Gospels without feeling the actual presence of Jesus. His personality pulsates in every word. No myth is filled with such life. How different, for instance, is the impression which we receive from an account of legendary heroes of antiquity like Theseus. Theseus and other heroes of his type lack the authentic vitality of Jesus.” †

Key word is myth.

Jesus used a lot of magic mushrooms and marijuana for medicine. If they were not high on drugs, they were high on Jesus. Perhaps many Stories of Jesus were true, it is the widespread of wrong translations makes it all flawed.

1

Christianity has demonstrated time and again it's art of assimilation and melding. They don't just adsorb be the holiday, they blend the traits into Jesus(or if the can't they declare it a saint). Jesus is just the archetype of the good guy, but was probably mostly based on some relaxed guy who just didn't want to have any issues with anyone.

1

Our mental institutions are full of people with delusional fantasies of grandeur. Few, however, proclaim themselves to be the son of god, perform "miracles" or claim to have risen from the dead. That makes Jesus, if there ever was such a person, an extreme case of severe mental disorder. Though obviously the world is still full of gullible people 2,000 years ago mysticism, ignorance and superstition were the cultural norm. It was not too difficult for an expert flim-flam man to gain notoriety and gather a "flock." I almost chose "Other" because sometimes I wonder if the character "Jesus" was not a visiting alien who violated the prime directive of not interfering in the progression of any culture he might come across in his galactic travels and left a mess here after his brief visit and "ascending unto heaven." Whether a mental case or a rogue alien he planted seeds that have become the most noxious of weeds to torment and slow the progress of mankind.

1

Nothing

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