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What would you do?

Hello, thank you for taking a few minutes to read this and I appreciate any opinion/advice regarding this issue.
My daughter just turned 6 this summer and loves hanging out with her best friend from school, who happens to be the daughter to my best friend. My best friend has been with me for 15 years and even despite my changes over the last couple of years we're still very close and respect each other's views and beliefs. But to make a long story short Bible camp was 3 weeks ago and he asked nicely if my daughter could go along with his and even to my discomfort my mother and my ex believed it was the best so I didn't make a fuss about it and let her go. The following weekend I was sitting with my daughter and she asked me "Why I don't believe in Jesus?" And I just told her it was a grown up issue and I'll explain when your older. But I can't just leave it at that. I don't want her to fight such blatant mind washing tactics all her life, I don't want her feeling judge for every misthought or misdeed she does in her developing years. I don't like lying to her about this stuff but it's so complex. I really wish my ex would have supported my wishes to keep my daughter away amap until she was older and could make an informative decision then. But on the same breathe I know I made valuable friendship in my religious endeavors that I don't think I would have made if I was so skeptical in my youth. So I don't know what to do now. I live in South Dakota the state that wishes it was apart of the Bible belt and I feel trapped and I feel both of my child will be forced into such overwhelmingly stenchy manure that is organized religion and I don't want that but I rarely get what I want. I guess I'm asking for ways to handle this? How are you handling your kids, if you don't get a say, how do you handle your kids grilling you? What would you do if you were in my shoes? PS. I also really want to keep the peace obviously lol 😁

SeanPaul91 4 Aug 14
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37 comments (26 - 37)

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the Bible is like Sesame Street. no one really lives there except in the stories.

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Wow that is a difficult question

bobwjr Level 10 Aug 15, 2019
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Thats a hard one. I don't think i would have let her go but maybe you are right. You won't understand it til youve been in it. Just tell her the truth about your views.

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My girls are grown now -raised agnostic and culturally Jewish they are diverse in their beliefs. My older daughter, born 3 months prematurely got her Hebrew name in temple to appease her grandparents on her mom's side. The dad's side was Protestant-Congregational and their whole livelihood revolved around their church. After I left her father he met a Born-again Christian and for someone who never cared about religion, changed into a fundamentaist idiot. He and his wife had Becky baptized behind my back as an adult. Becky now believes in Wica, new age ideaologies and they deem her evil. Jessie my other daughter beleves in nada. Best to discuss this before you have kids-divorce throws a monkey wrench into the deal. I always was honest with my answers and tried not to react. Hope this helps.

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I took my daughter to a UU congregation when I deconverted. It gave her the church like environment without the dogma. I was on the road to becoming an atheist and even though I haven't seen her since she was age 12 I sincerely hope she is an atheist.

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I'm sorry for the uncomfortable time you are going through. I raised a girl and a boy by exposing and explaining them the difference between religious methods. It was like an extra learning curriculum. Before I took my children to different churches I explained them the meaning of "club" and personal choices. At early childhood ages children understand concepts by doing it and exposing them to the real things. At home I created small areas (clubs) with pictures and supplies. We created the book club, the ice cream club, the dance club, and etc. So after this learned lesson I took my children to different churches and then we sat to discuss about the religions clubs. I always encouraged my children to ask questions and I explained them that sometimes mom doesn't have the right answers and need help to find them. So it was my opportunity to take my children to the library. I explained at them about fiction and non fiction by watching movies. When my children were in the preschooler ages I thought them to compare between real food and plastic toy food.
You said that your daughter just turn 6 years old so she's hungry for learning and the time to discover how things work. Feed her with education, activities and a healthy environment at her level and age needs.

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What did you think was going to happen in "Bible Camp"? The root of the problem was your lack of judgement in the precise moment the issue could have been prevented, because you "didn't want to make a fuss" with adults whom you claim "respect your beliefs."? I don't see a lot of respect for your beliefs when they even asked and later persuaded you to send your 6 year old toddler to "Bible Camp" where common sense would have told you the indoctrination that take place in those "camps." They sure as heck weren't going to indoctrinate her in the beauty of camping! And now you want to remedy the damage you already caused. Brainwashing is difficult to overcome, thus it won't be easy or painless, tell her the truth, I don't believe in jesus because he's not real, he's just a character from a book of fiction, ang give her some examples about characters of books that she knows are not real. People feel good with that book just like you feel good with this book, but that doesn't mean the three little pigs speak or play violin and make houses. And learn from YOUR mistakes.

I think the OP is looking for support. All of us can think of instances where we would have made different decisions in hindsight. He is presently in a horrible situation for which there is no easy solution.

@palex i gave him an answer to his question.

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Okay. First this is long, so I apologise.

I was married, as an non theist, to a Mormon family. It was not just to her, it was effectively her whole family. I had boys. Boys go to their Mamas girls go to their dads, it's natural, you can't change that.

In the end, it was over $100,000 in litigation. My boys have blocked me on FB. I did nothing worthy of the treatment.

Don't make a fuss. Plant seeds. Keep her mind open. Be the fun mom. She asks an adult question, give her a short fun answer which gets her thinking.

You are in a bad position. Treat it like sex with a prostitute. Be careful.

You will feel alone. You are surrounded. Don't give up being the fun mom. That's first.

Plant seeds. If Dad is shoving religion down her throat, good. Show her your loving arms and playful heart.

When she becomes a woman, remember your desires when you were her age. Let her know it's okay to play, but never give up on love, standards or self respect.

Most of all, and most importantly, have fun. Act like you don't care when they raise their offense.

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Disclaimer: I don’t have kids and scarcely remember what it’s like trying to explain something to one so young but, having been born very religious and having had the life of my youth sucked out by it; which I do remember vividly:

  1. I would take into account what kind of church this best friend goes to and what kind runs the camp. Find out everything you can about exactly how old time their religion is. Is it fire and brimstone, Pentecostal or Methodist? Is it a Baptist megachurch that milks money and does crazy fearmongering shit like Hell Houses for Halloween? Or is it a more love-focused, liberal type of Christianity? It’s not common but it exists.

If it were any of the former options I’d fight tooth and nail to keep these people away from my kid. If it were the latter and there really are no possible new friends to be had for myself and my daughter I’d consider letting her go to functions like this sparingly (as long as I had a great idea of what was going on there, and saw enough redeeming value) and help buttress her rational mind against anything that might be detrimental.

2 If you decide you’re stuck and she’s going to be exposed to fundamentalist religion either way, and must begin having talks with her about it: make sure she knows what shame is. Teach her not to accept shame for being who she is no matter who tells her otherwise or threatens punishment. Make sure she knows adults don’t always know better than kids. To value evidence and look for times when someone is saying one thing but doing another. Teach her about hypocrisy, greed, entitlement and the reasons some adults lie to themselves and their kids. That she doesn’t have to follow the crowd if everyone is reciting something. That any Christian judging her or anyone is wrong, by their own standards.

I’d give her my own version of bible study and pick two bible verses: one that has a good message and another that has an awful one and ask her if she can find the difference. Teach her that these are allegories, fairytales with a moral and if something sounds cruel or unbelievable it absolutely is. But that a lot of people trick themselves into thinking fairytales actually happen to help themselves feel better and it’s not polite to argue about it in their house; just know that you can disagree but let it go. What someone wants to believe is their business and what you believe is none of theirs.

I’d also work on teaching her deflection techniques and how to say something nice or at least ambiguous enough when she doesn’t quite believe what she’s being told. For example if someone tries to tell you you’ve got to get saved and starts asking you to pray with them you don’t need to repeat after them. It’s ok to say “I need some private time to think” or “you pray for god to speak to me, and I’ll listen for him.”

Easier said than done to give a child insight into all these things, and I’m sure she’s not ready for some concepts but try to simplify the ones you can for her. It’s probably best for them to be 10-12 and able to understand the scope of this a little bit before being too heavily exposed to religion, but if I knew my kid had to be tested so early those are the things I’d desperately want to help them understand.

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My daughter was 4 when her mother and I divorced. She spent and continues to spend considerably more time with her mother than me. She went to private christian schools her entire life. I was always completely honest with her and nonjudgemental, like during her emo phase, which drove her bible thumpin' mother crazy! My daughter is also agnostic! I must've done somethin' right! Just lead by example. They're watching!

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I don't have an answer or advice, but I feel the same way about my adult sister being influenced by her religious boyfriend - conflicted and concerned.

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Hi, SeanPaul91.
I’m in my shoes and they’re saying to tell my daughter I love her, to live my freethinking life, to not attract the sheriff’s attentions, and to welcome my daughter’s questions.

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