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What is the plan California? I am not familiar with all the details of the water issues and the exact detailing of propsals to mitigate the unfolding natural disaster of water scarcity, however I do know it's an issue and a serious one at that not easily remedied. Elder wanted to develop infrastructure. I heard one candidate suggest a pipeline to the Mississippi? This idea seemed like a crazy one. Although it does make you wonder if one state would be allowed to tap resources of others which could then possibly cause future calamity for more areas. But what is the plan, what is California's plan? From what I hear the population in CA is shrinking for the first time. Maybe the plan is - people leave, more water? This is a big problem. CA has almost 1/10 of US population. What is the plan? Other states who could be impacted by a future pipeline should be able to demand CA start getting some comprehensive plan in place NOW and not sit by then expect to rely on waterways essential to other areas of the nation.

Flowerwall 7 Sep 15

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The almond industry is squandering the water, just money

bobwjr Level 10 Sep 15, 2021


@Flowerwall They are sucking up water at a large rate depriving other farmers of water saw a special on it, the almond industry is a large corporate entity with powerful connections


let them eat cantaloupe.


California’s plan, particularly when it comes to both the northern and southern parts of the state, must involve its neighbors. The Klamath and the Colorado rivers are not California’s to use unilaterally, no matter what archaic riparian (water) rights exist. But in a federalist system such as ours, cooperation is sometimes difficult to achieve between the states.

Additionally, ever since we became a state we have steadily diverted the Sacramento and San Joaquin rivers, as well as the rivers that feed them, for agriculture, drinking water and mineral extraction. In the southern part of the state we turned desert into orange groves and avocado orchards and in the Sacramento Valley, the most fertile region on the planet, we turned chaparral into vineyards, almond & pistachio orchards and even rice paddies.

Agriculture accounts for about 80% of California’s water usage, but since most of the produce grown here is exported, it’s hard to say that California is being selfish about its water usage. That said, we must stop planting lawns, develop more sustainable methods of irrigation and build more desalinization plants in adapting to the changes in climate.

"Agriculture accounts for about 80% of California’s water usage, but since most of the produce grown here is exported...,"
More sustainable farming practices needed, it sounds like. Exported where? Maybe some of this needs to change. Maybe set more limits on what can be grown and look for imports. Aren't there studies on water retention /crop production? This can't continue. I hear this situation is worsening. Elder had a plan, I don't know how much it would have solved though, din't know all details. What is Newsome doing about this? Whatever it is it doesn't seem to be working at present.

States HAVE to be able to work together on this. There has to be a mutually acceptable path forward for population size, access to resources, environmental concerns. We can't just expect doing bare minimum is going to produce a desirable future for all residents.

@Flowerwall Exported where? Other states or other nations, what difference does it make? The heartland of America has been exporting wheat, corn and soy to other nations for decades. Louisiana exports rice, Florida its oranges, Iowa its beef and Idaho its potatoes. So why should California be any different? We feed the world, end of story.

The only way States will work together in good faith is under the rubric of a higher authority, be it voluntary or via federal mandate. And as for Elder’s “plan,” talk is cheap.

@p-nullifidian I meant where exactly are CA's exports going? If the water table is drying out in certain areas maybe it's time to restrict agricultural practices and consider importing those products that are neccessary, but not best for area or coverting to large scale sustainable farms geared toward water conservation. It can be done. It can be. People have to put the pressure on government to act. Even long-range plans serve as a viable solution, implemented in yearly steps.

Well there needs to be action, and it may need to be initiated by Republican leaning states, to demand CA have stricter plans in place to deal with it's natural disasters. If it is indeed true that CA has been neglected by forest management and this has caused the wildfires to be out of control, then other states should be able to demand CA do more. The wildfires DO effect air quality nationally. Likewise with the water disaster. Other states cannot be expected to sit back and enable CA to NOT deal with environmental issues. When candidates are talking about building a pipeline spanning more than half the nation for water, we have a problem, a large scale interstate problem.

Well we'll never know how effective Elder's plan may have been for water conservation. I asked another poster on this thread who had stated Newsome had done a lot of good for the state, I asked "What good?" and the post disappeared. Now what to make of that? No good? I know I did see a video of him throwing out some trash right before the election. Let's hope there is more on his list of accomplishments. What has he done that the people would be so eager to reelect him?

@Flowerwall I was incorrect earlier when I stated that most of California’s crops are exported. Just under half (44%) leave the state. In addition to the rest of the country, the EU, Mexico, Canada, China, Japan, Korea and many more nations receive billions of dollars in ag exports, annually. California is the only US resource for a number of crops including almonds, artichokes, olives, walnuts, pomegranates, figs and varieties of table grapes not found elsewhere in this country.

California is hardly unique when it comes to wildfires and forest management practices. California just has a higher number of property losses due to the high price for real estate and the amount of homes in the wildland-urban interface. But no politician (Democrat or Republican) is going to solve this issue in any one, or even two terms. It is unreasonable to rely on any individual as it places too much faith in a human being.

The tipping point on my scale for having a Democrat over a Republican in the executive branch is simple: judicial appointments. Judges appointed by Republicans are much more likely to blur the line of church state separation, place restrictions on abortion, uphold laws that reduce voting access and side with corporations and big money over the little guy.

@p-nullifidian Well, it is a complicated issue. A variety of crops. I don't think Newsome has a srong environmental record. You may be concerned primarily with judkcial appointments, but the majority of voters? What are their main concerns? I heard taxes. But Newsome was talking about raising them. He has a very Hollywood persona. Maybe that's all that counts. Politics are incomprehensible right now.

@Flowerwall “Politics are incomprehensible right now.”
Couldn’t agree more!

@p-nullifidian Or rather clearly incomprehensible, if I'm expressing that correctly. It feels very CLEARLY incomprehensible, but maybe this is an error that will do it in and be the factor that initiates change.


Stop all the damn development

bobwjr Level 10 Sep 15, 2021

Well you can't just erase ppl's needs for the essentials of life.

@Flowerwall And normal people can't afford housing many live in their cars

@bobwjr True, but CA should do better.


The real long term solution for all of California's problems is for a large portion of its population to move elsewhere. Simply put, the changing climate means that the natural resources will not support so many people.

Well then the state should not have power deciding on any issues of immigration. In fact if the long-term goal is negative population growth, the states that are expected to absorb the residents should have MORE say in these issues prior to the actual switch. CA shouldn't be deciding policy for other states. An indicator would be homelessness and stalled development. It should create some sort of avenue for a legal recourse in the other states.

I think a nice chunk of liberal Californians should move to Wyoming, North Dakota, & South Dakota and flip 6 Senate seats!

@Flowerwall Isee no relationship between our discussion and immigration.

@wordywalt "The real long term solution for all of California's problems is for a large portion of its population to move elsewhere. " This is the DEFINITION of immigration or human migration depending on where they go.


I am from California. California should take better care of watersheds, aquifers, forests, agriculture, diversion of water not mainly from the Colorado River but from other sources. The Colorado is dwindling due to climate change. California should slow down building development. There is not enough water to go around for more development. California needs more rapid transit infrastructure, not more highways, but they should be kept up. Water must not be wasted in California. A lot is needed for the economy... many crops are grown, so it is very much needed for that. But not water for crops like nuts or for animal agriculture, which use way too much water. Crops should be grown in a sustainable way which conserves water. People should limit how much meat they eat for the sake of the entire planet earth. Animal agriculture uses up too much land which could be used for crops to feed people, not for over population of animals used for meat. Way too much meat. Don't stop eating it... just stop being greedy about eating it. Is that too much to ask?.... There is a lot more to say about CA. Someone else please say it.

So was Newsome doing a good job of it? It sounds like half the state burns down once a year. It's distressing to see these problems growing. How much of the agriculture is allocated for organic farming? I understand there is definately arguement against building development, but surely these tents are not the answer? How can a state advocate a position of allowing more immigration, then NOT be capable of providing housing? It's a contradictory position. I have also heard this lack of housing effects minority women most.

Newsome did much good, and if he gets the chance as governor again in 2022, I think he will do more. Not enough affordable housing exists, whereas new multi-million dollar developments spring up all the time. That should be stopped. Affordable housing needs to take priority over luxury homes. Homelessness has come about because of both immigration and displacement by wildfires. Those people deserve a chance to have homes, whether they are rentals or affordable homes. ''Research has shown that organic farms use 45 percent less energy, release 40 percent less carbon emissions, and foster 30 percent more biodiversity compared to conventional farming." []
California should advocate for immigrants and build low-income housing for them, rather than allow development to run wild for high income residents.

@AnonySchmoose But in what order does this happen? DOES it happen? You just said big money developments are popping up, but not low income. So how is he helping the working people of the state? I don't see anything changing if he gets reelcted. This election was the perfect oppurtunity to get a R in and change things up. If Elder did a horrible job, did not make good on promises then vote him out at very soon upcoming election. That's moot now.

You said Newsome did a good job then listed major unsolved problems in the state. What were the good things he did?

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