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Share your thoughts about NFL players kneeling during pre-game playing of national anthem.

Tomas 7 Dec 17
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19

I'm a veteran of the United States Military, and an ex-cop to boot. I was and always will be proud to have served my country, our country. So what I'm about to say, I say as someone who served, as someone who placed his life at risk for our nation, and as a patriot.
Here's how it is. The flag, anthem and military have nothing to do with football, so if you object to having these things shoehorned into the sport, then any objections you may have about the take a knee protest relating to taking place while you are trying to watch the game may hold as valid. However if you don't object to the flag waving, national anthem and military displays being shoved down the throats of the players and the fans, then any objections you may express are specifically against the protesters and what they're protesting. Since they're protesting the kind of institutionalized racism that has led to people of colour, innocent of any wrong doing being killed, your objections can only be interpreted as a discomfort with the notion of treating ALL Americans equally, regardless of ethnic background, or anything else for that matter.
The truth is, equality only feels like oppression to the privileged.
So if you want to honour the service of we who risked all for your freedom, don't disparage those who fight for equality for all Americans.
They're not protesting the flag,
They're not protesting the military,
They're not protesting the anthem,
They're bringing injustice into the light,
They're protesting institutionalized racism,
They're exercising their 1st amendment rights,
Their action is respecting what the flag represents,
Their protest is giving a voice to those who have none,
They're being peaceful, respectful and above all, patriotic!
Because Real Americans don't stand for Injustice and Evil!

Well said

Bull crap... you don't just say that and not hear me. Your a pretty smart guy.. ive seen your post. Way over my head on stuff you want people to see. I fought in Vietnam. Your a vetern..ok. me too. I'm that group that says leave this country if the anthem offends you. No one gets a free ride. You earn your privilege to protest this flag and anthem.

BucketlistBob you are behaving in the same manner as the religiously indoctrinated.

I am also a Marine Corps veteran and a former police officer and I agree with what you said. They have the right to protest, they are not disrespecting the flag or the military. Yes there are some bad cops out there and shooting an unarmed human being should be investigated. The fact that the majority of unarmed people being killed by the police are African American should raise a big red flag and the players are trying to raise it. I know first hand that when cops interact with the public, they treat black people and Hispanic people different then they treat white people.

12

I've said this here before... had Tom Brady kneeled at the anthem and announced he was praying for his mom when she had cancer, the whole stadium probably would have joined him. And what about those who locked arms, people didn't seem to mind that? How is this different from kneeling? They both use the anthem to send some sort of message. The notion of disrespecting the military is a red herring. The real reason people are upset at kneeling for the anthem is because this is what Colin Kaepernick did when he announced he was protesting police brutality of blacks; people just don't want to hear it.

godef Level 7 Dec 17, 2017
12

Realizing the purpose of “taking a knee” was to point out the racism in USA, I sympathize with the players and their cause. I’m a veteran and I’m not the least offended. Many media outlets presented their slant, taking the players action out of context, and making it political.
The American flag and color guard on NFL fields started less than ten years ago at the request of DOD and “donations”, sorta like paid patriotism... intended as a recruitment advertisement.

Tomas Level 7 Dec 17, 2017

It's political... see the above.

Bob, I haven’t read any comments disrespecting flag, country, military, you me or anyone here... I can’t believe you haven’t read the purpose of the NFL players using the national anthem to draw attention to the racism, police brutality aimed primarily at African Americans across our country, it’s only been a couple hundred years and counting. No disrespect intended. @BucketlistBob

11

First, let me say that I am a veteran and during the anthem since I was a child, I have closed my eyes and contemplated the words. I have thought about how bad the fighting must be and how hopeless it must seem when “the bombs bursting in air” are the proof that your flag is still there. The enemy is still bombing us, which means we haven’t lost. It reminds me that my flag, The American Flag is the rebel flag. It is the flag of people who are fighting for rights and equality and justice and representation.

Our forefathers may have had slaves and thought women couldn’t vote, but our flag, our banner, our calling has been marching towards progress and equality for all. The most patriotic usage of the American flag I have seen in my lifetime is what Colin Kaepernick has started. Bar none. He is my beacon and reminder of what America was supposed to be and what we were headed towards before 45 started recruiting people to march backwards to whenever “again” was referring to. “Again” is completely un-American.

America, the original idea, the experiment, is the march to true equality and it started before The Constitution. It started with the words, “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.” Perhaps we’re learning that it should be “people” and not “men”, and that “Creator” should at least be lowercased, and there was a paragraph before that one… but regardless, that is the path we set out upon. Fighting for equality is where it all began and we’re not close to done fighting.

Yeah right... I pulled my stuff from a Vietnam Vetern. There's no 50 50 here. I was a kid crying for my dad when he was over there in nam. Then I did my tour over there too. You young guys missed out on all the war news every freaking night.all the videos playing every night.what war did you fight in? I got buddies names on a wall of honor. Take your protest away from me. You sound like Jane fonda. I didn't pay to see some punks protest my flag. I'll respect their kneeling if they put there neck on the line for our freedom.

You want to attack my military service based on when I was born, since I was born after Vietnam? I served in OIF and I will make no claim that my deployment was difficult or even dangerous, but both times I volunteered and signed those contracts, I volunteered to go wherever they told me to go and do whatever they told me to do, so don’t think that I volunteered for “the easy war” that happened this century, I volunteered for ANY war that happened this century. I was not drafted. I was not expected to serve a country that hates brown people. I had a good paying job that I left to serve. And you piss on my call to service? Do you “like people who weren’t captured” too? Did you volunteer or were you just not rich enough to dodge the draft or were you just indoctrinated into unthinking patriotism with religious fervor based on when you were born? These are questions that aren’t supposed to matter when you’ve served. You’ve served. I’ve served. Who cares what the details are? I only mentioned my service to contextualize my feelings about the country and the flag and you piss on it. Who’s disrespecting veterans?

Our founding fathers referred to the constitution and our nation as an experiment in democracy meaning it was too be tweaked to fit the changing times, most of them would probably agree it has failed miserably in this century.

10

If it were white people taking a knee to protest abortion, do you think there would be all the "disrespect" shouting? I'd say Fox News would be talking about how brave they were for protesting.

Wrong... don't mess with my flag and anthem.

@Eazyduzzit I think such a protest would have to include the protesters turning their backs to the flag, as a sign of holding the federal government in contempt for making abortion legal across the country. Either way, I think you're right about Fox News.

You're absolutely correct @Eazyduzzit and to @BucketlistBob our anthem is all about our freedom to do this very thing. Be a proud American and kneel down beside your brown fellow Americans if you support fair treatment of all Americans. We have shed so much blood to protect these privileges, don't be in the camp of people who would tarnish this grand achievement.

Can't go there any more boys... carry on with your message... the world be funny if we all agree.

10

Those who insist on seeing "taking a knee" as an expression of disrespect for the flag are ignoring centuries of our culture, wherein kneeling on one or two knees has always been an expression of respect, even reverence, and usually also one of petition. For example:

  1. A subject kneeling to pay homage to a monarch

  2. A believer kneeling to pray to a god

  3. A lover kneeling to propose marriage

  4. A petitioner kneeling to plead for mercy from an authority

  5. Players taking a knee out of respect for a fellow player injured on the field

  6. ... and most interestingly for this situation ... A member of the armed forces taking a knee to deliver the American flag that covered a fallen comrade's casket to his/her bereaved widow(er), child, or other next of kin

So when Kaepernick sat for the first couple games at the very beginning of his protest, yes, that could be legitimately seen as disrespectful to the flag - but still his right, of course, especially given the justice of his cause. But Green Beret and football player Nate Boyer wrote an open letter to Kaepernick to explore how there might be common ground - they met, talked, and reached the conclusion that taking a knee would show respect to the flag and the principles for which the US stands while also signifying that all is not well in our country's fulfilment of those principles, effectively kneeling to petition for justice from the republic "for which it stands."

Hmmm... another one... see the above.

9

I am glad kneeling has had this much effect. Has caused this discussion. Beats a molotov cocktail as a voice, or a bullet. I am glad we can still use non-violent action and words to get points across. This is good news for us all.

9

The Pentagon started paying the NFL to stage the pregame shows as a recruitment tool in 2009. Before then the players stayed in the locker rooms during the pregame. The players are being used as props and stooges for military recruitment.

7

I am a big NFL fan who will be watching games all day especially the Pats vs the Steelers at 4:30 today. Nothing is wrong with kneeling. tRUMP is a dick for sticking his nose in it. Nothing to do with patriotism or veterans.

7

Those people who shame NFL players for taking a knee at the playing of our national anthem are slapping the face of every fallen veteran. They died so that, "We the People" have a protected right to protest, as long as, "We the People" keep it peaceful. I may not always agree with the cause as I often don't, but those individuals are within their right to take that position, and I vow to lay down my life to preserve their right to protest peacefully. I am a proud American, and this privilege is at the core of my pride.

i

Primarily the people who are doing the shaming are trump, his deplorables, fox news and similar ignoramuses. Hopefully it will have the desired effect.

6

I think it’s a free country. If they want to kneel, let them kneel.

6

Kneeling is a gesture of deference, ergo respect. End of discussion.

Ok brother... I'll listen to you.

Turning one's back to the flag would be disrespectful.

5

Some well thought out and well articulated comments on this thread. I'm offended by people being unnecessarily killed by police, and police being exonerated for obvious murder. I've seen the videos. The people they kill have parents, children, siblings and friends who forever will feel the pain of an unnecessary shooting. This seems obviously more harmful than taking a knee. I've watched a lot of football on television, with a lot of people, and not once have I seen someone stand.

4

As a veteran myself, I am not bothered by the kneeling in the least. People should have a way of protesting their dissent, and kneeling prior to the game is not only a rational and peaceful way of doing so, but is consistent with other practices. For decades in schools, whenever a player got injured on the field, the other players would stop, kneel down until the injured player left the field. The rationale for this (as I understood it) was expressing hope for the injured players recovery. One could argue that kneeling just prior to a pro-game might be a hope that a broken system might somehow recover. Also there are other examples where kneeling is an expression of reverence, not insult: Kneeling before a king or queen, kneeling before the Pope, a man kneeling to propose to the woman he hopes will say yes and marry him. I think it wrong (somehow) to offer admonishment to people who commit violence as protest, and then admonish them for participating in a non-violent form of protest.

That's exactly the way I see the kneeling too.

2

Honestly..? They’d all be out of work if the nation paid the attention I do to football, or sports in general... After PBS’s airing of ‘League of Denial,’ (USA) football should be banned at all levels. So protest away, fellas ..though it may become increasingly difficult to remember why ~

Varn Level 8 Dec 17, 2017
2

I fully support them, it is their right to do so. This so called outrage is concocted by the moron in chief to divide the country even more than he has already done. The evangels and bible thumpers eat that shit up, They are so blinded by their Jesus crap they don't even see that the moron is only pretending to be one of them. I like what my sister says " guns and bibles" LOL

1

Funny, the protection of a piece of colored cloth comes around every few years and goes nowhere except to piss off people.

This is like all other issues with religion. You are against something and, at the same time, you want to control how others think. Stand for the flag, national anthem or pledge if you really believe in it but do NOT try and control others! It seems to me that the idea of their individual self-serving ideas of freedom are more important than the general definition of freedom.

Also, I see these robotic ideas as simply more examples of a shallow patriotism. It is easy and one does not have to take a difficult, critically thought out stand (like sitting in the back of a church). The only thing I dislike is the idea of kneeling; seems too religious-like. I prefer to simply sit or, like in some previous Olympics, raise one's fist.

1

I totally get it. I support their cause. I do, however, wish they had come up with a way to raise awareness that conservatives and racists couldn't have twisted.

Anything they do will be twisted, white amerikkka see's it's majority slipping away and will not relinquish their power easily, why else would we have a fascist in the White House?

angrywhitemenistan

@etruji29, @slinkie59, You're both right.

1

Great question @Thockemeier you've heard a different story by me. I don't agree with a lot things and that makes me unpopular and that's ok. So...
I've been told by my Senior to stop.

0

black people entertaining white people who syc their police on relatives of same entertainers. The stats on incarceration are BAD. 80 % of prison population black while they only make up 10% of the population. If you could make a point in such a situation .... wouldn't you ?? your national anthem is violent in itself. listen to the words.

0

It's fine by me. There's not a thing wrong with it.

0

They are right! Our gov't is a corrupt mess, America is dying at politicians's hands, we have the worst gov't $$$ can buy. Blacks, LGBT, Hispanics, etc are all treated as 2nd class. There should be much more outrage at the sad state of USA today. Apathy will be our slow destruction. Peace.

0

Don't care. I Don't watch football. But it hurt the NFL here in my home town.

0

We've been through this before. What's the deal of bringing it up again. I really don't give a crap about these players expressing thier rights. It's another expression of control over me when I've paid $500.00 to $3000.00 A seat to watch the game. I'm a Vietnam veteran. Enough said."I stand for our flag and anthem, and I kneel for our fallen," VFW national commander Keith Harman said in a statement. "That's what patriots do. We rally around the flag of our country, not use it and our Constitution as both shield and sword."

In his statement, Harman, a Vietnam veteran, said that his oath to protect the Constitution means he has a right to disagree with how others choose to protest.

"There is a time and place for civil debate, and wearing team jerseys," he said, "and using sporting events to disrespect our country doesn't wash with millions of military veterans who have and continue to wear real uniforms on real battlefields around globe

I came for the game.... can't go there anymore... I've said enough.

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