"What these trials were not designed to do, however, was determine whether the vaccines prevent people from spreading Covid-19. (Many researchers wish the pharmaceutical companies had incorporated this question into their clinical trials; they certainly could have.) You may be wondering: How is it even possible for a vaccinated person, who feels totally fine, to spread Covid-19? It’s counterintuitive, I know. But some vaccines are able to prevent symptoms without preventing infection."

Thank you for your thoughtful commentary.

@BDair you get what you deserve......

Can you elaborate on what information in the posted meme is incorrect?

These doctors and nurses? [nypost.com]

How about this scientist? [jennifermargulis.net]

@BDair I did say most. There are obviously a select group who do not. Of course there are risks with vaccines, as there are with any kind of medical products. Nothing is foolproof. It's a matter of deciding if the benefits outweigh the risks, and I personally believe they do in this case.

@BDair "How about this scientist? [jennifermargulis.net]"

Yes Dr. Janci Chunn Lindsay owner and sole employee of Toxicology Support Services LLC, the company web site for which, on her own biography page boasts 9 spelling mistakes including the name of her own degree, unless of course there is such a thing as "a doctorate (PhD) in Bochemistry" (sic)

yeah I'm going to trust her opinion

@LenHazell53 And also an article from the NY Post. A media company owned by Rupert Murdoch’s News Corp, which owns many conservative/sensational media outlets around the world. They are far right biased and have a medium credibility rating at best.

They also had a reporter quit after being ordered to write a fake article.

[theprint.in]

I believe the point is, they have conflicts of interest that may prevent them from offering an unbiased opinion on 'facts' that may question aspects of vaccinations.

@BDair I know what this meme's "point" is, and my post was made to indicate what a pile of weasel's excrement that point is AND just how idiotic it is both to believe it and repost it, other than as satire.

The 'Revolving Door' phenomenom is not a theory. [thehill.com]

No I relocated it to the correct thread. Covid is not 'so fucking dangerous'. Most people do not even realize they have had it. Even in the most vulnerable age group, over 70, there is a 95% survival rate without treatment. With known effective treatments, the risk of mortality is even lower. The risk for children is statistically negligible.

@BDair Fancy a trip to India ?. Just hope you don't need oxygen for any reason.

@BDair Look at India, look at Brazil and Iran were the general attitude is just as stated by you, people are dying in the streets.
The figures you use are from countries that have lockdowns, wear masks, take precautions instituted by government, and even so in the USA you have had 574,000 deaths, and that is only 0.18% of the 315,000,000 DEATHS world wide but people like you don't see that as a cause for concern because "statistically" that is "only" 4.5% of the worlds population four point five is "SUCH" a small number, just like 0.5% fatality is just such a small number.
Well guess what small number can mean huge amounts of PEOPLE, real PEOPLE with lives, families and titles like MOM, DAD, SON, DAUGHTER, GRAND PARENT, UNCLE and FRIEND.
PEOPLE are not just statistics, when you learn that, maybe, just maybe you'll take this pandemic seriously and consider that just because it is not some sci-fi superbug that is going to end the world it is still a crisis.

India's cases and deaths were in decline until they vaccinated millions of people. [worldometers.info]

Meanwhile..... [principia-scientific.com]

Meanwhile in India..... [seemorerocks.is]

@LenHazell53 People are not dropping dead in the streets in India, or anywhere else on the planet. You have been duped again. [ncdailygazette.com]

@BDair OMG You idiot principia scientific dot com is a fringe conspiracy site that claims carbon dioxide is not a greenhouse gas, they are mainly famous because principia scientific dot ORG sue them for using their name.
Seemorerocks is an Australian satire site

You actually read
""PFIZER’S OWN DOCUMENTS STATE BOTH INHALATION AND SKIN CONTACT WILL TRANSMIT WHATEVER IS IN THE VAX FROM THE VACCINATED TO THE UNVACCINATED " (upper case NOT added) and you believed it was serious?!!!
YOU DUMBO

Thank you for your pleasant demeanor and ad hominems. Nothing I posted was satire. I believe you are misinformed.

@BDair seldom does one meet with such perspicacity & sage wisdom as yours........except in a sewer treatment facility.

@AnneWimsey Thank you for your assessment. I am certain you did not intend any insult to my friends who operate sewage treatment plants. Your frequent use of non sequiturs and ad hominems truly informs on your ability to participate in an intelligent discourse.

@BDair ad hominems

@BDair When, If, or Ever you post something intelligent, I will....

@LenHazell53 I think I know what it means. "
...marked by or being an attack on an opponent's character rather than by an answer to the contentions made"

@LenHazell53 FYI

@BDair
Exactly then you should perfectly understand this

@BDair
The piece cut and highlighted in your post " FYI" comes from the document

C4591001_Clinical_Protocol_Nov2020_Pfizer_BioNTech

PF-07302048 (BNT162 RNA-Based COVID-19 Vaccines)
Protocol C4591001

A PHASE 1/2/3, PLACEBO-CONTROLLED, RANDOMIZED, OBSERVER-BLIND,
DOSE-FINDING STUDY TO EVALUATE THE SAFETY, TOLERABILITY,
IMMUNOGENICITY, AND EFFICACY OF SARS-COV-2 RNA VACCINE
CANDIDATES AGAINST COVID-19 IN HEALTHY INDIVIDUALS

A 146 page document from which the part quote is a part of page 67
It is a part of of chapter 8 dealing with "STUDY ASSESSMENTS AND PROCEDURES"

Section 8.3 deals with protecting participants in clinical trail from exposure to outside pathogens and situations that would corrupt the results of the test. INCLUDING pregnancy, because women in pregnancy have a more efficient than normal immune system their results are invalidated and need to be reported, so they can be withdrawn from the trials .
Or if the partner of a pregnant or breast feeding woman is a participant since he will be exposed to covid19 "by inhalation or skin contact" to test the efficacy of the vaccine, must be removed from the test to avoid any liability for damage to the health of the woman or the infant and/or to discredit the clinical trials.

IT IS NOT about people contracting the Vaccine by inhalation or skin contact which anyone with any sense what so ever KNOWS is IMPOSSIBLE.

You have been fooled AGAIN by editing of a genuine document to tell you a LIE.
Wake up you moron and stop believing everything at face value, that is told to you by some informational equivalent of a dodgy used car salesman.

@BDair YES I DID, either you chose not to read my reply or to pretend to not understand it.

@LenHazell53 Len, Len, Len, you are too optimistic, this guy is as thick as a brick, with no common sense whatsoever....
,

No, you did not. I think you tried to shoot down some strawmen, but missed the mark. [sgtreport.com]

@BDair Your answer is to post a link to a site bemoaning the fact that it has lost it's you tube channels (Plural) for spreading dangerous misinformation, and then proceeds to say exactly the same things I discredited as a means of persuading me to change my mind?

My dear chap you are priceless, keep it up, you've given me almost enough gold to write a six episode sitcom, how does "D'uh Phantisist" sound as a title?

The boy had unstated underlying conditions, and the entire story is rather vague. How did they determine Covid was the cause?

@BDair Science.... Something stupid people don't believe in.... If you deny science you are a member of a cult which makes you not really atheist or agnostic. Reality is something that happens to you even when you don't believe in it. You do know that Fox news has been exposed as a fraud long ago right?... Oh and FYI they require all employees to be vaccinated and wear masks to enter the building....

What science am I in denial of?

@BDair
How did they determine Covid was the cause?

If you can seriously ask that question about a child who died "IN A HOSPITAL" you need a full time 24 hour a day carer to ensure you don't accidentally drown yourself while trying to use the toilet!

@BDair Far as I can see pretty much all of it.... Your opinions on medical science seem to taper off in eugenics much like Hitler's... Just because a child has medical conditions doesn't mean they should be written off as "too weak to be allowed to live" or "collateral damage" to promote a dictatorial political philosophy.... Pretty much that is all we see from conservatives these days they want to subvert a freely elected government to insure their own "personal freedum" and don't even seem to notice that they are contradicting themselves....

@LenHazell53 Likely the person assigned would end up drowning him in his own toilet very quickly because of his incessant hateful comments...

These are just the facts. It is very unusal for a child to die from Covid. They claim this is the first pediatric death in Hawaii, and it has been very rare everywhere else. Very few people die from Covid, there are generally comorbidities involved, as in this case. Lastly, testing for Covid 19 has been proven to be wildly inaccurate. There are many ailments that could produce similar symptoms, which is why it is not unreasonable to question that diagnosis.

@BDair
There are non so blind as those who WILL NOT see

@BDair Stop believing the Washington Toast they are just another Murdoch owned fake news outfit... Nationwide so far more than 3.7 million children have contracted COVID... That is almost 14% of all COVID cases. Many Redstates are known to post fake death counts because they refused the MEDICAID expansion and if the deaths are counted as COVID related they would be required to pay from their own budgets instead of receiving federal funds. Also they are heavily invested in denial for political reasons and don't like the idea of closing their economies. Florida is one of the worst offenders and so is Texas both of which STILL have higher death rates than California. Republicans seem to prefer to accept decimating their own populations in the name of corporate profits...
[services.aap.org]

@BDair

If a patient has a condition that is not in itself life threatening, but then contracts covid 19 which weakens the whole system, especially the respiratory system, the patient can DIE.
This is day one information, this is why Covid is so fucking dangerous.
Once dead you think that poor kid was not given an autopsy to determine the cause of death? Are you really that obtuse, that committed to your paranoia?
I am really beginning to think you are just an attention seeking troll, no one can really be this fucking stupid.

@LenHazell53 Also COVID has been found to cause heart, kidney and lung damage as well as blood clots which can require amputation of limbs and strokes in heathy people often with fatal results. Right now several states that are refusing to enforce a mask mandate and have opened their economies are seeing a surge in cases that are threatening to overload their medical facilities again and this time many of them are younger adults and children...

@Lizard_of_Ahaz exactly, long covid is as lethal as the initial disease and far more likely to disable a person of any age for a long period of time or even permanently.

@LenHazell53 Spider Robinson once wrote: "I don't know what happened to it but I used to have a button that read "Go, Lemmings Go" It was my prize possession for many years and I wish I still had it..."

The CDC has gotten most everything wrong. They make a statement, then they walk it back, then they reverse their position, before they flip flop their reversal. Total ineptitude.

@BDair I totally disagree.

The CDC has been cautious, scientific, and although the Republican regime under Trump disabled and attacked them (as it appears you're doing)....they've been spot on.

Here's a recent Obesity map that points out the changes in obesity in the US over time.

[slate.com]

I challenge you to point out anything they've said that's not correct or "inept"...show us one "walked back" statement.

Here's the update CDC map for 2019.

[cdc.gov]

Also fact filled data from CDC on air pollution.

[cdc.gov]

@BDair This is why religious people hate science, science keeps fact checking themselves and modifying their answers because they keep learning. It’s those that stand by a single opinion come hell or high water that’s destroying civilization. Most Conservatives still can’t admit trickle down was a stupid idea, yet the morons can still poison the minds of people like you from listening to good advise by using terrible and uninformed arguments.

CDC said, don't wear a mask. [marketwatch.com].

Someone's opinion. [expressnews.com]

Science is not fact. Science looks at the facts and changes as their knowledge of the facts change. I don’t think the CDC ever said not to wear a mask. They did just say it is not as important as previously stated.

Walk it back again.... [thehill.com]