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Do Americans feel guilty about their history?
We all hear that the polititians say that the US is a great country - possibly the best in the world. Surely the US has brought many things to the world that could be considered as progress. At the same time, the US can be blamed for slavery, being the a very developed country in the world who pollutes the most. The US can be blamed for manipulating other countries and for instance invading other countries like Panama and killing 4000 people there. Getting involved in a war like Vietnam appears to be an attempt to influence other counties with military power that failed. Convincing the population to be part of the mission but then leave them to be homeless on the street begging for help (I've seen many myself) is horrible in my view. What do you think?

Stig 5 Sep 28
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We forget about the issues of homeless people of all types such as women, men, teenage girls & boys and others living out in the cold or extreme heat. And yet our community and churches are overwhelmed. I could assist these people to get the right resources with volunteering my RN and Paralegal services to organize building new shelters to get these homeless people the resources to find shelter for themselves and their families. Also, with my psychology, student, nursing, and military background, I could help the homeless veterans to students who have no place to live as well as directing them to get the proper counseling (regardless if it is faith-based or not to help these homeless people to get emergency housing they need).

[facebook.com] by Lee Scott AirForceNurse1 to Help Our Homeless Population Here! Donate here: [facebook.com]

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America is made up of people. People range in personality from the very good to the most heinous. There is probably not a geographic location on the Earth that the people living there havent engaged in something that would be considered grevious to most of us. Many of those were perpetrated by the people in power. The US is not exception. Most know what the media tells us, but that is generally only half the story. The US has many sins in its history, just ask Native Americans. If you want some insight into what the non-whitewashed history of the US really is, read Howard Zinn. To believe we are innocent is to either be terribly naive or have your head buried in the sand. Ssying this does not dimenish the incredible experiment that America is.

If one reads a scholarly book on history, not a popular account, of any period in our own history, one is absolutely astounded at the duplicity that our leaders engaged in. Doesn't matter the period or the event.

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well the only thing that guilt should be a part of is how the native people were and still are treated well not the only thing but jeez

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Thanks to everyone who answered this sensitive post with honest and fair input. When I talk to Germans who were born after the second world war they wish the whole Nazi ear had not happened and that there we not part of it so the don't feel guilty. Ashamed like so of you have written - yes.

Someone responded to slavery. It is sad that we have to recognize that is something that happend all over the world so as some of you have mentioned looks to be part of human nature. I read an interesting statistic that about 300,000 native Africans were transported to North America to be slaves. About 5 million were transported to South America. I've not experienced much literature, reporting or and other kind of media about this but was quite shocked when I saw the movie Apocalypto - not sure how accurately it presents the truth.

Thanks for being good discussion partners.

Stig Level 5 Sep 29, 2018
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  1. the u.s. can be blamed for slavery? we can be blamed for participating but we sure didn't invent it.

  2. i am not trying to justify our bad behavior by pointing out that others have behaved as badly or worse and that we have set no precedents for such behavior. it is still worth pointing out when it is suggested that we are the only ones, or the first ones. credit and discredit where it's due, and not where it's not, right?

  3. i do not feel guilty. i feel outraged. i want to change things. should i feel guilty by virtue of what piece of geography my mom was gracing when i popped out five weeks early? and if i did feel guilty, whom would that help?

g

  1. Slavery was all over the world. Some historical accounts I read shows that most if not all the Europeans were involved in it somehow - even it was not in the home country. Perhaps you saw my comment about 300,000 native Africans went to North America while 5 million went to South America.
  2. We can unfortunately point to many places in the world where I think the behavior has been much worse than in the US. In Cambodia 2 million killed by the Red Khmer.
    during the 3 year war in central Europe 8 million partly due to the war but also to a large degree due to famine and disease. We've all heard the stories from Russia and Stalin etc. I went there in 1990. Our host were some kind people who were in the film making business. When we visited one of the film makers he wanted to show us his latest work. It was a description of what the society had done to families in the country over the last 100 years. His main dramatic part was when he showed a picture of a couple on their wedding day and ran a round blade saw through the middle of the picture separating the two happy people with blood coming out of the picture. He repeated it with multiple pictures. During our 10 day trip I experienced much of the same sentiment in how people were treated. On the airplane out of the country I cried for two hours non stop.
  3. Appreciate your sentiment.
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Guilty? No. Ashamed? Yes, very much so. We are a young species and have lashed out at one another everywhere and in all presently conceivable ways. We've come a ways from that point but still have a long way to go.

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Well, those of us who are self-aware tend to be seriously concerned about the past and present (oh and the future) of our country.
We are still climbing out of the legacy of slavery and racism. POC to this day are disproportionately more likely to be murdered by the people who are charged with protecting us, to be caught up in an unjust “justice” system and to be stuck in a cycle of poverty. We are in the midst of a reckoning related to sexual abuse.
There are a wealthy people who have more money than they could spend in 10 lifetimes, while 1 in 4 children lives with food insecurity and we have a vast homeless population.
These are just a few serious concerns we could address if we truly wanted to “make America great.”

I appreciate your sentiment. Some places like in Scandinavia the thought is to design their society so that the worst case in peoples lives is a decently good one and everyone are part of both working to make it happen and to get help if need be. Not everything is perfect - it has also lead to a mentality of holding back people from being successful to reduce disparity which is not a good thing.

It would be interesting if a multiparty political system would bring more balance into the political debate and produce better results than the two party system with the eternal blaming of the other one.

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Guilty? Eh. No more than any other empire. Sure the US treated many people shitty. The U.S. inherited religious fanatics; the idea of white supremacy - slavery and decimation of Native Americans and the idea of Manifest destiny. That said, we are no worse than numerous kings and world leaders who over the centuries have raped and pillaged the Earth and its population and resources.

I am more afraid of our failing state and how we cling to be number one while so many suffer here and around the world. We are officially 27th in education and lower in health care. For a supposed great nation we just aren't. And a growing gap in wealth disproportion will only make things worse.

Things here are worsening because we no longer want to admit our past failures and mistakes which is a dangerous road to go down.

So, just what am I Saying? I believe that humanity in general has a lot to feel guilty for. War; atrocities; disproportionate rights and freedoms; mistreatment of others; lack of basic necessities; etc. And, yes, religion has played a paramount role throughout time.

I agree with your first point. On your second point - I see US leaders declaring the US the best country in the world - while it is not in so many areas. I wonder where the need for self-glorification comes from. It's enough just to be the best - and if you are - everyone will know anyway.

The wealth and income disparity as well and the growing debt is a dangerous ticking bomb for distress and civil unrest. I dread the next recession which surely will come.

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Yes!

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Thanks for your honesty.

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i cannot speak for all citizens, but do believe a good majority still believe (without justification) that the United States is the greatest in the world. Certainly opportunities abound, freedoms are taken for granted, but the issues of health care, education, environmental blindness, military expenditure, and many others have eroded my view of my country. And now with the political tragedy playing out in Washington, I am concerned that we are loosing any opportunity to go forward.

I thing you have are right in your first comment that most think so. My only worry is that not many have actually studies other countries to make a comparison and fewer have travelled to see for themselves.

On your second point - I worry too. The last 5 presidents I've seen have all declared the desire to work for the country as a whole and reduce the division between the factions - but the actual effort looks to be missing and it looks to get worse with - what you put so well - the current political tragedy.

I've recently started following the Atheist Experience and Talk Heathen shows - and when I see the conversations going on I have to admit that I understand the reason for the division much better - sadly.

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I'm sure there is a full spectrum of responses for this question. based on my observations, most are painfully oblivious. Many are too busy trying to live then devote any meaning to history. Others, like myself are aware of, what I consider to be worse historical nasties including Native American genocide including 4000 dead on the trail of tears event alone/forced indoctrination into Christianity - - the list goes on.

As for feeling guilty, No! I wasn't there. This assertion that we should feel guilty for the "sins" of our ancestors is equal to the Christians "Original sin". Lame.

Do I feel outraged about the badness of the past and current. Yes. Utterly disgusted.

All very fair. People like you give me hope.

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The Universal Declaration of Human Rights ratified as law would be a start. Full transparency in government removal of money from politics and guaranteed health care, housing and basic needs for all citizens. Requiring the draft for any military action outside the US. Requiring as a price for full citizenship two years of public service directly after graduating high school too be served outside their home state which may be military service or some civilian trade. Which would be paid for by the government in relation to housing food etc. We can be better but it would require hard choices the comfortable and rich among us see no need for and the masses are too distracted by cheap entertainment and partisanship to work towards.

Quarm Level 6 Sep 28, 2018

Great observations and interesting ideas.

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The United States has done well but in my opinion they could have done better. In the Declaration of Independence it says.." ALL MEN ARE EQUAL." But African Americans were not equal ...they were slaves. It took a bloody war to fix this problem. The Civil Rights Act was not written until 1964 as AA were treated as second class citizens. Women did not get the right to vote until 1920. President Wilson, an Internationalist, got us involved in the European war, World War I to help the international bankers and this led us into WW II .. the Korean War, Viet Nam. Afghanistan, Iraq, and Syria.

Great points. A provocative thought is that "All men" meant mon only and only the White ones" - which as you say took some 200 years to correct. Also in Europe it took until the early 19' hundreds before women got to vote. In Switzerland it took until 1971!

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All countries have stuff in their past that's a little bit murky, trust I'm British, been there, done that, got all their stuff in our museums (we did give them cricket in return) Seriously you're not responsible no more than I am, it's history, see it for what it was....with an honest eye.

Fair enough. My ancestors did do things that don't look honorable today like supporting the slave capture and shipping. We all do have the option of doing good for what our ancestors did wrong.

@Stig I don't see it as doing good for what our ancestors did but I do see it as learning lessons from history and not repeating the mistakes. Unfortunately history goes in cycles, at least it does for now, and we keep going round in circles.

@ipdg77 Much appreciated. I we have the choice as ancestors of doing nothing or something -
what is your choice?

@Stig We have some atrocious parts to our (UK) history, some of it not that far back either, I think we have to distance ourselves from those who will perpetuate that which caused harm and look to repeat it and support those who have a conscience and want to find a better way, a more equitable way. Not always an easy choice, sometimes there's not a viable choice and we're a tiny cog in big machine but we can keep to our principles and try and persuade others to look at things differently, to not look the other way and to make sure you vote for what's right and not what's popular (unless by some miracle it's the same)

@ipdg77 Thanks. I appreciate your genuine answer. These questions are hard to handle.

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Then there's the slaughter of an indigenous people..

I agree. How do we as a white set of people se history right?

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