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I said this before and I feel like I should say it again. I think it's important as part of atheist/agnostic community that we understand why we choose this part. There are atheist out here who are brainwashed into atheistism the same way there are religious ppl brainwashed into believing in their God. For example some ppl don't believe in God because he didn't answer their prayers. The same way some ppl believe in God because he answered their prayers. Which God were you praying too? Where you praying to Ares for healing? Well you were praying to the wrong God that's why your prayers wasn't answered... So God is real as long as you keep getting your way??

bluefairy 6 Nov 6
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17 comments

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A once believer that declares himself a so-called atheist because her or she did not have their prayers answered are not atheist at all. (some of these types may be members here but their belief system will become evident in conversation)
I am very skeptical on how a believer can be brainwashed into atheism.

Atheism fundamentally means the lack of belief in a god not the rejection of it's existence. Atheist should never say there is no god but rather I do no believe any god exist because of lack of proof hence critical thinking is crucial in atheism.

Since your are new at atheism, you may lack the fundamental reasoning of atheism... If you are unsure that there is no god then you're agnostic.

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And there are atheist out there (perhaps the majority) that come to their position through critical thinking and evidence (or lack thereof). Many have read the bible(s) and saw what a horrible book it was. Some have slowly come to the conclusion the whole thing doesn't work and it is about fear and control. Some were even smarter than most (like my late partner) and thought it nonsense from day one.

I totally understand and get this but I'm making a point about some of them not understanding their decision and that we really should make sure we are on the right track with our own chain of thoughts that lead to our decision.

@bluefairy I understand. One cannot generalize any group and there are lax non-believers who, sometime, go back to believing. A former partner's parents were 'mad' at god and dropped out of religion. As time past and they grew older they started to weaken.There are all kinds of 'Brights' (atheists) as there are all kinds of 'Supers' (religionists).

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i didn't choose a part. i realized that there were no gods, that's all. nobody told me so. nobody convinced me so. it's not as if i read something that convinced me, or heard someone give a speech. i just realized. nobody brainwashed me either way; i wasn't raised religiously so i wasn't rebelling against anything. i never prayed so i couldn't be disappointed in prayers' not being answered, and anyway, if i was disappointed in some god, i guess that would be believing that god existed. sorry, but i do not identify at all with what you're saying.

g

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I’m sorry, but I just don’t accept the premise that there are people being brainwashed into atheism. If people become disillusioned about their belief in god because their prayers are not answered, that is not brainwashing, it is the realisation that they were deluded in their beliefs. We are not responsible for their disillusionment, but should be glad that the scales have fallen from their eyes and that reason has replaced their fantasies. I believe you are muddled in your thinking, and whether people believe in god because they think that god has answered their prayers or lose their faith because he has not, does not alter the fact that evidence does not support the existence of a god. Anything else is fanciful and based purely on assumptions which cannot be backed up by science.

My post is not about facts and evidence to prove or disprove God. It's about ppl who claim to be atheist but don't seem to understand how they got to that point. Some atheist use reason and logic and some are just told there is no God and accepted it with no reason in the same way someone is told their is a God and they accept it without reason. When you get into discussions with them their argument for their lack of belief is usually something to the effect of God not answering their prayers or letting some bad thing happen to them or someone they know. These are fickle minded atheist and it would take little to nothing to make them tip to the other side. Sorry but I can't be glad for ppl who don't understand their decision that's just a disaster waiting to happen.

@bluefairy I have never encountered a fickle minded atheist. In my experience once people start to question their beliefs they gradually begin to chip away bit by bit, starting out as just doubting, then saying they are agnostic for a while before going the full way and realising that they are in fact completely atheist. If you know other types who tilt one way or the other depending on prayers being perceived as being answered or not, then they are completely outside of my sphere of knowledge

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Haha wow!!! I'm so amused by the responses. Lots of critical thinkers here but yet some of you are not thinking. Some of yll got my point and some of yll the point just went over your head. Being told what to think is very different from being taught how to think. I said "THERE ARE ATHEIST OUT HERE" who are brainwashed. Meaning SOME. There are ppl who called themselves atheist who don't exercise critical thinking and logic to reach to their conclusion. They were taught as kids or at some point in their adulthood that there is no God because he didn't answer their prayers or they failed an exam or he let some tragic thing happened. After the tragic event or just general self edification some ppl were able to use reason and logic and make a conscious choice bringing themselves out of that brainwashed state. While some ppl never evolved from that primitive way of thinking.

On another note why yll so offended. Critical thinkers don't embrace constructive criticism or challenges to their perceptions???? Or did yll forget to exercise some of that thinking before getting offended??? How did you get to the point of rejecting a belief in God??

@VictoriaNotes well then you haven't meet a lot of ppl. Keep at those forums and blog and get to meet some more ppl. Bet you never met an religions person who claimed to be an atheist before too. And that is exactly why a person need to understand their decision.

@VictoriaNotes who said anything about meeting them face to face. Blogs and forums and being on an online community for 12yrs should suffice right?? Because I'm from a tiny little country that is multi religious and NOT predominantly Christian is exactly why I can tell you there are brainwashed atheists. Whatever you googling, check your source.

@bluefairy - very similar experience to you. I've been on - what, dozens? maybe over 100? - forums, discussion groups, and chatrooms and the OP's assertion just doesn't hold up. Hell, I was a sysop on the #Atheism and #ReligiousDebate chans on DALnet, and becoming an atheist overwhelmingly happens one of two ways:
-- raised nonreligious - "born & raised atheist" or "never acknowledged, given no importance" natural atheist
-- started questioning, got shitty answers, did research, came to inexorable, logical conclusion that the concept of a deity is incongruous with reality

@VictoriaNotes your right this convo with you was indeed the most unproductive one. Again I never said most atheist, I said some. Good night.

@VictoriaNotes oh wowwwww check you out and your reputable sources!! How about listening to the person who actually lives here, like I should be "listening to the people who've posted here sharing their experiences," Now go find some sources about religious ppl deconverting without logic and reasoning then add it to your book of wisdom. I have faith in you.

@VictoriaNotes this convo is not even about exchanging ideas, experiences and knowledge etc. It's just about you wanting to be right in your ignorant perspective while belittle and undermining another's intelligence but I have no problem matching you tit for tat. Is it ok to say good night and mean it now?

@VictoriaNotes you should do some more neuroscience research on atheist who deconverted without logic and reasoning. The same point I've making hours ago. I also feel compassion for you. All these years as an experienced atheist and yet you still don't know how accept concepts that challenged your own thinking and build your wisdom. How did you even managed to deconvert? I never made any reference to atheist in my country. Not predominantly Christian means other religions included not an atheist nation and meeting and interacting with atheist in general is very different from the personal relationship I have with those 2 atheist. Instead of reading to argue, you should read to understand and if you feel no reason for self reflection then you have achieved nirvana.

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By and large the "you're an atheist because you're angry at god" stereotype is a myth. In my experience, the atheists I know became atheists because every aspect of theism is irrational, illogical, and unprovable. That leads to doing research, critical analysis, and questioning critically while accepting nothing at face value. Simply put, religion doesn't pass the smell test in any way, shape, or fashion.

Getting from the beginning of the journey out of the religious did and into the rational clarity of freethought is a challenging, frightening process for most of us in today's society. You're going against everything you've ever been taught. You're risking being alienated from your friends, shunned by your family, and a pariah in your local community. You're risking harrassment, losing job opportunities, and prejudice from everywhere. So getting to atheism is often done simply because logic and the evidence demands it.

Once you see behind the veil of myth, you can't unsee it.

At least that's how I see it.

Yes I totally understand your point but unfortunately there are ppl out here who are angry at God and decided to become atheist. Some of them may have gone a step further and did their research and are now conscious of their decision but there also those who stopped at that point and are very ignorant about their choices and really and truly are poor ambassadors for the atheist community. It would take very little for them tip over to the other side.

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It's the same mentality that credits God with miracles and good things and then for every bad thing they blame the person or the devil. They're always right that way and God is always good.

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I became an atheist because I chose to. I wasn’t disappointed in anything that their gods didn’t provide. You have to believe in something before you reject it. You may have your presuppositions but that doesn’t seem to match any story I’ve seen on these forums and certainly not applicable to me.

I agree 100%. There's a logical disconnect in the idea of "being mad at" something you're claiming to not exist.

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WTF are you talking about?

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Your entire premise includes the belief in a ‘god.’ Atheist’s do not believe in gods…

Here’s American Atheists description: “Atheism is not an affirmative belief that there is no god nor does it answer any other question about what a person believes. It is simply a rejection of the assertion that there are gods. Atheism is too often defined incorrectly as a belief system. To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.

Varn Level 8 Nov 6, 2018

True, but there are definitely atheists who positively state there is no God.

@Piece2YourPuzzle Damn Semantics 🙂

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I've never believed. I had a friend that I met when I was 5, his parents wouldn't feed him as punishment for his bad behavior and he would call me asking me to come over and ask his mom for peanut butter and jelly which she always made me when I came over, he'd ask me to come over and ask for it so I could give it to him to eat... His parents were Greek Orthodox and very heavily into it. When I'd stay the night his mom was up every morning with her brass insense thing, blessing every room in the house saying everything in Greek.

At a very early age I began to notice that religious affiliation has zero relevance to if someone is a good person or not. I also noticed that those who claim to be the most kind are often kind in words but not kind in actions.

Ooooo this so much truth!!

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I was brainwashed into atheism same as the religious people. The thing is I've thought thought about it a lot and they are right. So I guess you would just call it teaching.

MsAl Level 8 Nov 6, 2018

Well I think you may be the only one who got my point on the first go lol... Cus some ppl were taught there is no God and accepted it and when challenged have a very weak defensives e.g God not answering their prayers. So I called them brainwashed but if they moved beyond that point and used logic, reasoning and research etc to solidify their position, then I'll say they're no longer brainwashed but now made a conscious decision. Thanks for imput, it's very much appreciated.

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Critical thinking atheist are brainwashed?

You're making the assumption all atheist are critical thinkers. I'm referring to the ones who are not.

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I think you’re right; it’s good to know why we believe what we believe. Rejection of god can be just as emotionally influenced a decision as acceptance. Objective thought is a hard-won skill for any person, no matter where they started.

skado Level 9 Nov 6, 2018

@skado I want to say Amen!! Hahahaha!! Thank you for understanding my point!

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What? What does this even mean?

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Dear Mr. bluefairy, ONLY the 'Faithfools' are ' brainwashed' into religion, Atheists are the people who try their hardest to rescue the victims of religious 'brainwashing' and bring back to reason, logic and reality.
How can anyone actually state, empirically, that their prayers were actually answered since the religious will adamantly tell that " God has a plan for everyone and that plan is eternal and unchanging," therefore the only way a prayer may possibly be answered is if that which is prayed for IS already included in the 'Great' plan, otherwise this Omnipotent, Omniscient God would not alter his/her/its plan simply to please a mere mortal, ergo that orison would have been a complete waste of time, etc, because, simply, it already ordained to occur anyway.
No, Atheists, in particular, are NOT 'brainwashed' in way, shape nor form into rejecting religion since it is a fact that NO child is born religious to begin with, no child is born knowing that any God/Gods, etc, exist or ever have existed, they only hear about them AFTER they learn to speak and understand the language of their parents and peers IF the parents/peers are religious, If not then the child learns to become one who is a free-thinker, follower of reason, logic and reality.

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I was never a believer. I was fortunate enough to have not been raised in a religious household.
So I was never "brainwashed" into anything.

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