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The argument of intelligent design is very popular among the religious because on the surface it appears to give a smart explanation for why they are willing to set science aside in favor of religious superstition--which they prefer to call faith. It is simple to present as well--when we look around at the complexity and beauty of the world, it could not have been the result of chance, so there must be an intelligent designer behind it all. Well if the world were governed by chance, sometimes the apple would fall from the tree and sometimes it would just float away--science is not chance. But the main flaw has to do with the inference that the complexity of "the design" implies a designer. So if there were such a designer, would they not have to be more complex than their designs? And would that not imply that they also would have to have a designer, thus creating a mirror reflecting a mirror situation with an infinite number of designers? Just because an argument feels good does not mean it is true.

DavidDuhon 7 Nov 9
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41 comments (26 - 41)

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1

yep real intelligent design! Birth defects people who don't care what happens to others! We have an evil thing in our house supported by the evil party.

So much THIS!

1

In this group, I would think this should be the first-and-best argument against ID :

[en.wikipedia.org]

1

Intelligent design, haha. Appendix and that nerve that wraps around the heart instead of going straight to where it connects on either end, yea, intelligent. I'm sure there are a lot of other minor flaws in"creation" that could have been done more efficiently.

1

I believe it was evil that said, "I would have started with lasers 8 o'clock day one". The universe is a very complex place we still have a lot to figure out.

1

Genetics does involve some chance. Genetic drift does follow the same rules as all DNA, but an element of chance is involved when this happens. A great deal of Science involves chance. One the chance occurence is realized, there are physical laws that deal with how that chance occurence is expressed or dealt with.

On some level, it ALL is a matter of chance, of randomness. But, yes, once a viable event occurs, there are laws of chemistry and physics that operate on it. Complexity begats complexity. Some recent evidence supports the idea that the first biologically viable event took place in hydro-thermal, deep sea vents. There was much ado about this the other day, with headlines claiming "Darwin Was Wrong," but Darwin never made a claim about the origin of biology, beyond suggesting that it might've begun, in effect, in a warm pool. That is not a claim, it is a wondering.

@BirdMan1

Exactly. The idea of life beginning in the warm, shallow lagoons surrounding the continents in the primordial soup has been supplanted by the hypothesis associated with hydro-thermal vents along divergent tectonic plates.

The basic tenets discovered by Darwin and Wallace have weathered the 180 years of challenge and controversy. Darwin is underappreciated and often left out when people talk about great minds. His gift was his powers of observing disparate events and realizing they were actually related. He easily ranks among the greats like Newton, Einstien, and the early atronomers.

1

D.N.A. being a form of intelligence that by chemical reactions create the body of a person. A person is created by the conflation of the D.N.A. INFORMATION from the parents. Let's look at: create
verb
bring (something) into existence.
"he created a thirty-acre lake"
synonyms:generate, produce, design, make, fabricate, fashion, manufacture, build, construct, erect, do, turn out;
bring into being, originate, invent,initiate, engender, devise, frame,develop, shape, form, mold, forge,concoct, hatch; 
informalknock together, knock up, knock off
"the sculpture has been created out of Portland stone" When a Male and female do the reproductive activity, this causes a new being to come into existence. People are creators when making babies.

Often, create is used in context of bringing something from nothing like the big bang myth would speculate. I am not discussing that version here.

Hydrogen, they say is fused in the gravity pressure of stars to build larger elements like helium and the rest of the known periodic table of elements.

When ever a new helium atom is made by fusion it would be a new creation. Not that helium is new but that specific atom is new. The Sun and stars then could be looked at as Creators.

Continue with chemical reactions that bring about compounds that support what we call life having complex cell structures. Each one may very well be a simular copy of another yet they are each created and unique.

Creation by combining or conflation by use of forces is all around. Almost omnipresent maybe.

Word Level 8 Nov 9, 2019

"The Big Bang," is not a myth, but an hypothesis. Science operates by the process of developing, and then testing hypotheses. And "No hypothesis ought to be maintained if a single phenomenon stands in direct opposition to it.” Lord Bollingbroke A faulted hypothesis is not an "alternate" explanation.

@BirdMan1 Carl Sagan a well known scientist clearly States that the big bang is our modern scientific creation myth.

Here is the video at 2 minutes and 50 seconds Carl Sagan clearly states "the big bang, our modern scientific creation myth ... "

1

We are told so many lies as children, that after the loss of Santa, the easter bunny, magic and all their ilk, people tend to draw the line at Adam and Noah for some inexplicable reason.
"Something has GOT to be real" seems to be the cry.
Once you have accepted that here was a pensioner who built a floating zoo and could talk to birds, two nudists in a garden with a talking snake and magic apples is hardly a stretch and makes a carpenter zombie who can walk on water seems positively sane.

Exactly! Seems reply to indirect76, just above.

1

Just look at the "design" of our knees (and dog knees too). Either a very bad, very dumb designer, or randomness.

Or putting our noses over our mouths.
WTF?

I agree! They should bend the other way! 😉

Or having us breathe and eat throught he same tube that guarantees a certain percentage of people will inevitibly choke to death. Snakes, for example, breathe and eat through separate tubes which is why snakes don't choke to death when swallowing an animal whole.

The list goes on and on. Compared to other creatures, our eyes are shit, our noses are shit, we're succeptible to an endless list of diseases, etc... If Man was God's greatest creation, why not give hum the best of everything?

And only TWO hands!!!! WTF!!!

1

Is the design intellegent?

Word Level 8 Nov 9, 2019
0

Most of the designs in the world are inspired by nature. Aircrafts were built on the model of the structure of the bird but we cannot say that they are not spiritual enough, right?🙂 Yes, nowadays designs are inspired by science, so what?🙂 The science develops and helps to move the world forward. There's nothing we can do with that. Tendencies are not so easy to change. According to vistacreate color guide, simple designs and basic colors are sought-after these days. We are looking for simplicity and science is there to help make our lives more simple.

0

The dispute between religion and science is eternal, and science or religion wins alternately. It seems to me that it depends on how difficult life is for people at the moment. The majority of believers are usually impoverished, and such people are beneficial to religious organizations. They can be promised paradise after death if their life is so difficult. Recently we created a series of booklets about religion and science, nothing special, just the work of enthusiasts in proposal maker. We distributed these booklets on the city's streets and conducted a social survey. So most people who believe in God live in cramped conditions, sometimes on the verge of survival.

0

Years ago, in the process of losing my faith, I did a lot of writing on thos subject of evolution vs. Creation/intelligent design. Putting my thoughts down in an organized way really helped to make sense of it all and ultimately realize how little sense the proposition made. It's a little bittersweet and nostalgic to go back and read these diatribes.

0

LOL, when dealing with one of those IDiots, just tell 'em "Kitzmiller v Dover put that one to bed in 2005, try again". If they balk, remind them that the judge was one of their own. Finally, just concede that we definitely need more graduates qualified in the custodial arts instead of hard science in the future anyway, so by all means, teach ID (the more dead-pan this last line the better; they won't get the sarcasm anyway).

At that point, too much oxygen has already been wasted on speaking to the lout and it is best to disengage and find more productive things to do.

0

I find that argument comical. They are essential trying to defend some science yet deny other parts of it. I find the biggest part of it is that us homo sapiens have been on this planet for at least 200,000 years. Yet, evolution believing xians deny that the 'god' they say they believe in didn't do anything for at least 197,000 years.

0

This is Christian video, I am not specifically posting for the dogma. I do like the information about the D.N.A. being a form of intelligence. D.N.A. being what is considered to construct a person's body to bring about their cognitive and intellectual capabilities. Fast forward to 6 minutes and 20 seconds to skip stuff.

Word Level 8 Nov 9, 2019
0

I think there may be such a thing as intelligent design, if meant in the deist sense things were set in motion and then left alone.
In that case, did the "designer" then know it'd unfold precisely as it did?
I think not.
"God" can NOT know the future, I propose. At least not every little detail, (especially about what each of billions of people are going to do at any given time!)
Just because some book says so doesn't mean it's true. (Think of all the other things it's wrong about.)
After all, how can we have free will (we do) if everything past, present and to come is already known? Clearly that is not possible.
So I think it plausible "intelligent design" MAY have happened in some "macro" sense. That is, if there was such a thing to begin with.

But, how does that infer intelligence?

@BirdMan1 I could only guess.
Some scientists think the universe itself is interconnected and in "communication" with itself. I've not read enough to say what that means.
What always strikes one is it always comes back to one question: 'But who created THAT?' And THAT is an unanswerable question, unless you suppose it ALWAYS existed, and always will.
Which begs, of course, the further question: 'How is that possible?' I can only say, how is it not?

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