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I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But as much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking.

russjay 4 July 27
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6

"They say you die twice. One time when you stop breathing and a second time, a bit later on, when somebody says your name for the last time."

~ Banksy

Banksy...........one of my favourite philosophers 🙂

Ancient proverb 😉 Or Banksy 😉

@freeofgod - often, restatements of various maxims are treated as original.

5

My grandfather once told me that he wasn't sure about an afterlife, but if you lived a good life while you were alive you would live on in other's memories ..

4

A classic Sagan quote.

The full quote is as follows -

“I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But as much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking. I want to grow really old with my wife, Annie, whom I dearly love. I want to see my younger children grow up and to play a role in their character and intellectual development. I want to meet still unconceived grandchildren. There are scientific problems whose outcomes I long to witness—such as the exploration of many of the worlds in our Solar System and the search for life elsewhere. I want to learn how major trends in human history, both hopeful and worrisome, work themselves out: the dangers and promise of our technology, say; the emancipation of women; the growing political, economic, and technological ascendancy of China; interstellar flight. If there were life after death, I might, no matter when I die, satisfy most of these deep curiosities and longings. But if death is nothing more than an endless dreamless sleep, this is a forlorn hope. Maybe this perspective has given me a little extra motivation to stay alive. The world is so exquisite, with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better, it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look Death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.”

― Carl Sagan, Billions & Billions: Thoughts on Life and Death at the Brink of the Millennium

My favorite version of the quote is in this configuration.

“I would love to believe that when I die I will live again, that some thinking, feeling, remembering part of me will continue. But as much as I want to believe that, and despite the ancient and worldwide cultural traditions that assert an afterlife, I know of nothing to suggest that it is more than wishful thinking.

[... ]

The world is so exquisite, with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there's little good evidence. Far better, it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look Death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides.”

― Carl Sagan, Billions & Billions: Thoughts on Life and Death at the Brink of the Millennium

The reason I like posting the truncated quote most often is that it's generic, and as such I feel has the most impact. I love Sagan's full version talking about his love for Annie, his kids, and wanting to be around for what is to come, but for getting the main point across to believers, the stripped down version cuts to the chase.

2

An eternal afterlife has no appeal for me..."forever" is a long, long time. 🙂 I was talking with a hospital volunteer (she was pushing my wheel chair when being discharged), she gave me the Christian spiel about "...where I was going to spend eternity...". I told her I was an atheist and the concept of living eternally in a "heaven" had no appeal to me whatsoever. She continued, saying that she was sure that I could find something in heaven that would appeal to me. To which I said, "I want a pony." She did not seem to be aware that "...you can have anything you want in heaven...even a pony." was an archetype dangled before children in my era to entice children to believe in God.

2

Your ideas and passions can live on in those you share them with in the here and now.

You can build a legacy of thoughts and dreams to be passed along to those who continue them, but that means sharing all that now, to make the word better, or just your own corner of the world, or even just your own small circle of family and friends.

1

Nothing fundamental in nature is created or destroyed: it's all eternal. Composite things can be assembled and disassembled, but even then there's no absolute ban on them being reassembled. A composite thing cannot be sentient if none of its components are sentient, so sentience would have to be a property of fundamental components, and those are eternal. The part of you that is the sentience cannot die.

1

Dying is hard! I'm sure many of us have seen it up close and personal several times.

I recently sat with someone in their final hours, and I had the same feeling. Dying seemed like very hard work to me. I was relieved when she took her final breath and all that suffering and struggle finally ended.

1

I agree. Then the religious hate you for this because they do not want to believe that all of their own relatives lived a lie. They have to take the truth as an insult.

1

Someone a bit smarter than me said that we should make the best of our lives in the short time we have. So, those who live only for their final reward is wasting the gift of life. Everyone dies - but not everyone lives.

1

We're not the only species that mourns death, but death there is. Against all probability you were born & now you face your inevitable death. Consider yourself lucky.

1

I'm good with finality.

1

Would you really want to live forever?

Someone posted a picture of a dessert made solely of orange circus peanuts on facebook recently, and I'm like nope, that's enough. 80 years or so and let's call it.

[southernliving.com]

In a world filled with exquisite culinary adventures, there is simply no place for a monstrosity such as that.

I hope I live long enough to welcome death .

1

I guess you've been chastised enough; so I'll just say; I think maybe that desire and the accompanying fear of death were the reasons mankind created religion in the first place.

JimG Level 8 July 28, 2020

@Radu I hope it works for you.

1

Despite the absence of attribution your ability to quarry quotability and eschew editorial is exemplary if not nonpareil.

1

It's normal to quote references when you use someone else's material. In this case, Carl Sagan

0

When my dad died I was driving with my 3 year old son and was crying. I was pregnant with my daughter so cried often. He asked me what was wrong and I told him that my dad died.. My in laws watched him while I worked, so he only knew god as papa dios. He s as I'd wouldnt he be with papa dios, and I said that he believed he would. He then said, mommy being XEAD isnt sad, so don't cry. He paused like in deep thought awhile while looking at me and then said, "Now DYING, THAT IS sad!"

0

Become a Hindu, or Buddhist: live, die, repeat. 😎
Of course becoming doesn't make it so.
Look at it this way, we are all stardust, and return to the cosmos to be reused in some manner.

0

It may not be wishful thinking. We may literally invent the afterlife!

Read up on Ray Kurzweil. He was among the first to talk about mapping our neural connections amd simulating it on computer. It may be physically feasable to live on as a sort of "neural net" in a computer and a program can be run to interface with our sensory neurons and created our perfect ideal world with in which we have god like control.

So...even though the expected version of afterlife likely doesn't exist, we may be able to create one in reality, albeit many centuriea from now.

Perhaps we can invest in getting a detailed 3D MRI scans of our brain to map the physical locations of our neurons right down to the synapses. A hundred years from now they may be able to use the MRI to create your brain virtually.

The possibilities are endless. I wish I could live another 50 years to see our brilliant scientist come up with a cure for death.

@Homosapien you don't have to wait 50 years. I think we have the MRI technology today to do it, but its a lot of imaging so you might have to stay in an MRI for many hours per day, for several days, over weeks. Obviously its cost prohibitive, but should be possible to create a neural copy of brains neural structure.

Then all we need is to preserve the data until we have computer power, memory capacity, a software that can translate an MRI image into a artificial neural network, and another software to run the ANN, i.e. a virtual you.

@Radu yes you are right, yet it is a very common natural experience! Okay, so we are talking about the afterlife...a concept involving leaving your physical body and experiencing a new form of existence. The "upload" is literally that....but so is growing up and maturing.

Consider this: You are thinking that the real you is what exists now, right?. But are you now the exact same person you were at 11 years old? Of course not. Does it seem now that you are different person somehow carrying the visceral memories of the 11 year old?

What I'm getting at is, in a sense, that 11 year old has died. The years between you and that kid has transformed you so much that you likely don't fully identify with that kid. It's almost as if you woke up with your body and the memories of some kid that you assume was you!

Your above comment is very correct! Think how your 11 year old self would say it. He would look at you residing in its body with access to its memories, and say "YOU are not ME! My conciousness died, and at some point YOU took my place!"

Likewise we need to shift our perception from being that kid to the perspective of our future self. Imagine your virtual self waking up, carrying all your memories. How is that any different from you waking up today with your past memories?

Remember the computer is supposed to fully simulate you perception and make you feel you have your body.
And if the simulation was ultra realistic and unethical trickery allowed, you could be made to think that your real death would feel much like a bad dream. And your conciousness would carry on, none the wiser.

But that would likely be difficult if not impossible. More likely your virtual self will be aware that you died...and carry on wirh your memories and thoughts, much like you do now with the memories and thoughts of your younger self.

0

Meh, i just want to go to sleep when it's time.

0

to realise that life is finite, should motivate you to 'seize the day'. We should always live each day as if it is our last. This chance at life, to be born at all, is like a miracle. Be grateful and don't squander it.

0

But you WILL live again after you die, you, like everyone else, won't know it but nature will re-cycle you, worms, bacteria, etc, etc, will devour your flesh slowly but surely, their excrement, etc, will then fertilize the ground allowing Fungi, plants, trees, etc, to grow and thrive which will then feed herbivores, etc, then along will come carnivores to kill and eat the herbivores and so the cycle will continue on.
Unless your remains are cremated, then you go straight to being nutrient rich fertilizer (ashes), IF you have your ashes spread that is, thus you cut out the 'middle man' (decaying, rotting away and feeding worms, etc, etc,).

0

I have no proof that I will come back to a new life. I once believed that I was born to live, live to die, and be reborn again.

@Radu
Like to, yes. But, there is no proof it is real or happens.

0

Objectively, it makes sense to be cremated and have your ashes put into the trash. I’m a tiny bit less objective.

0

I am the opposite. Although I don't relish in the idea of not existing, the thought of existing forever seems like torment to me. What would eternal "life" even mean? Without our physical human bodies, how could we feel/experience anything--either physically or emotionally? And, if we somehow could, how could it in any way be the same person/being we were? I find comfort in knowing that the energy and atoms that came together to form me will continue on allowing all kinds of other life to exist.

Joanne Level 7 July 28, 2020

@Radu I would not desire this kind of eternal life either. And, it still changes the meaning of what life is. We can give life meaning because we know it comes to an end. We hold our loved ones dear as we know we could lose them. If we live forever what will we cherish? And, we are who we are because of our organic bodies: the brains we have, how we perceive/experience things. Without that interaction we would not be who we currently are.

@Radu: What I am saying is that if we all live forever, how would we be able to fully appreciate life? If we knew that we would never, ever, ever lose someone we love, how would their life be of that much importance to us? Eternity is a heck of a long time. Maybe if we were unable to see each other for hundreds or thousands of years at at time, the time spent together would be appreciated. But, seriously what is one going to find to do for an eternity? A point will be reached when there is nothing more to do, nothing more to learn; and because everyone lives forever, life itself could not be fully appreciated and precious.

@Radu I wouldn't mind if if our lives were considerably longer than they are...just not eternal 🙂.

0

When was the last time anyone heard from anyone who was dead? It's the same reason no one ever tried to train a dead dog to fetch a ball -- dead is dead.

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