Perfect, if there is wisdom in this world, then I think that you are its enbodiment.

It would seem that those in generations following ours might find the type of wisdom you refer to challenging to obtain. Pre-internet one had to seek it in a more active manner. I find it a bit ironic that youth today have access to it in their pocket yet I wonder if what they get is more superficial, a Reader's Digest form.

An example is a decade ago and a classmate 30 years younger and I did papers. She used brief articles, I used books and articles and was able to draw from a broader spectrum. Both papers earned good grades but my understanding of the material must have been greater.

Another aspect that you refer to is exposure to a range of thoughts and cultures. Again I saw this when taking classes surrounded by much younger people. How can one comprehend the term ethnocentricity without the experience of travel? Viewing art is a far richer experience than photos in a book.

@Fernapple Yes, I think we are all products of our exposure to experiences and other thoughts besides our own. The more we learn, it seems the less we are sure we know, haha. Sometimes there is danger in that surety. If we only read one book and are exposed to one group of people, we can't really grow much or understand the bigger picture.

The difference is, that a religion is big enough and rich enough, to buy a share in the government.

@Fernapple good point

I am always moving, and philosophically an Epicurian, with the love of nature at the heart.

Correct. The only difference between a religion and a cult, is that a religion is rich enough to buy some part of the state.

You don't babble, its only really old farts like me who do that.

@Fernapple I babble a plenty…..I usually do it to my cats though!? ‍

Sorry to hear about the drink, that is not good. I was raised in a heavy drinking culture, but fortunately it never grabbed a deep hold on me.

Hell is clearly here on earth! That’s why religious folks insist on believing there’s something grandeur in store for them?!‍

@Fernapple Drink got ahold of me and I'm an alcoholic. Today is different because I see no point in being drunk. If i wanna get drunk I can usually stop and eat after 3 drinks or less and be done for that day or night. I always have beer and whiskey around. Right now I have 2 beers and a shot of whiskey and will not drink today. I also did not drink last night either. I saw no reason to drink.

There is a lot more, but even someone as patient as you would run for cover if I went on at full length.

@Fernapple No, I wouldn’t run for cover; I would be empathetic. And I would get to understand you.

They are great educators yes and have been thinkers, but they also are at the core of the Catholic propaganda machine, and run cult of original guilt and have been involved in some of the church's darker right wing activeties, and managed some of its worst schools.

You are welcome.

Yes i try to keep to secular subjects when talking to clergy. A lot of them are good people if misguided, and I see no point in causing hurt when there is no need.

That reminds me of when my father was on Hospice (an organization I can't say enough positive things about).

One of the things they set up was a spiritual advisor -- a Christian pastor to 'help' my father.
My father wasn't religious. He just didn't care much about spiritual matters. The advisor wasn't a bad guy 'though.

The advisor happened to be a morning person and it was convenient for him to come over before my father (and usually also my wife) was awake in the morning. He seemed honest and forthright and we had some long conversations.

I am a life-long Atheist but the nature of the situation especially enforced that neither of us had any ill will for each other. I'm sure that, again neither of us, changed our opinions about anything. But it wasn't a terrible experience hearing him trying to explain his reasons for his positions.

@Fernapple In re to clergy one strategy is to ask where they studied, not what they studied. Then you can use locales as a topic instead of theology. Just before my father passed I called the RC church to give my father the chance to speak to a priest. He was religious and balked but ended up having a good conversation and felt more at peace. I spoke to the priest privately afterwards without any mention of religion. He was from Africa and had only been here for a few years. I suspect very few others had asked about his personal journey as he was very engaged. They are people with different viewpoints, we are all the same race.