One thing I hear with tedious regularity as an Atheist from Christians in particular are comments/complaints, etc, that "There is War on Religion"/ There is a War on Christmas
, etc, etc, being waged.
As someone who has studied the history of Religions, the 3 main Abrahamic based ones in particular, AND the History of Human Civilisation AFTER long and ardous HOURS of reading and researching I find only EVIDENCE that Christianity HAS waged War on almost every other system of belief/ culture or thought since almost its inception.
For example, The 'Holy' Crusades were instigated BY the Christian Church against the Muslims, The Inquisitions were WAGED against both Christians, Atheists, Jews, Muslims and, of course, Atheists, etc, BUT never once in History have Atheists actually either DECLARED nor Waged a War against them.
Yes, a Theist may say that by any Atheist merely disputing religious Theosophy ( they prefer it to be called Theology but technically it IS only a Philosophical Ideology and NOT even a Theory or remotely close to being one) is "at War with God and Religion" BUT I ask them How many Theists have Atheists, etc, Tortured, Burned ALIVE at the Stake, etc, or FORCED under Pain of Death to convert? The answer is simply ONE word- NONE.
Whereas, conversely, IF one asks HOW many Atheists, Pagans/Heathens, etc, has RELIGION Tortured, Murdered, Enslaved and FORCED Conversion upon, etc, etc, the answer would, quite easily be in the Millions over the last 16 + Centuries and ALL in the name of God and Christian/Allah and Muhammed ( if they were Muslims that is) ergo the Tally of Deaths would read something akin to Christians/Muslims = X Millions, versus Atheists/Pagans/Heathens = 0 or at least a few hundred BUT ONLY in defense of themselves/ families, etc.
So I ask, WHO exactly has been/ IS at War with Whom?
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11 comments
Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.This is FFRF's humorous quiz on the War on Christmas - The 'war' on Christianity has been going on since I was just a little kid, and I'm proud to say, I am now one of those waging that war against it!!
RobCampbell
Level 7
Jan 7, 2018
0
They're right. Just as Osama Bin Laden was right. Every advance by progressive, enlightenment based democracy, particularly advances which empower women (esp education), reduces the power of theocrats. It is a war, just a very slow one based in ideas not physical force, usually.
RobAnybody
Level 7
Dec 31, 2017
1
@NASTYNEIL About liberal democracy being a direct threat to his place in the world.
Yes, I concur, there has always been a War, a War which the Religious started some 1,600 + years ago and the only force used in it has come, not from the Atheists/Pagans/Heathens, etc, in the first place BUT from those who loudly proclaim themselves to be Peace Loving Children of God.
Most of the whiny Christians I know say they think that the country has gotten too politically correct, but just say "happy holidays" to one of them and they come unglued. When I say "whiny Christians" I'm not saying all Christians are whiny, but I'm just talking about the whiny ones. I actually have some good friends who are Christian.
Eazyduzzit
Level 7
Dec 13, 2017
2
Just for the record, the crusades were defensive actions against a Moslem army attacking Constantinople. However, the Sack of Constantinople, Catholics slaughtering Eastern Orthodox Christians, and later the Massacre of the Latins, Orthodox slaughtering Catholics in Constantinople, were fucked up in major ways. My novel SCAPEGOATS (Golden Fleece Press March 2018 ) goes through the entire laundry list of Abrahamic on Abrahamic slaughter and massacres.
But just for the record, Christians certainly would answer that atheist communists were responsible for 10s of millions of deaths. Of course, we know that communism IS a religion with a totalitarian leader taking the place of a god.
andygee
Level 7
Dec 13, 2017
0
Just for the record, only a small portion of the crusades were "defensive actions against a Moslem army attacking Constantinople".
The Crusades were a series of religious wars sanctioned by the Latin Church in the medieval period. The most commonly known Crusades are the campaigns in the Eastern Mediterranean aimed at recovering the Holy Land from Muslim rule ...
... but the term "Crusades" is also applied to other church-sanctioned campaigns. These were fought for a variety of reasons including the suppression of paganism and heresy, the resolution of conflict among rival Roman Catholic groups, or for political and territorial advantage. At the time of the early Crusades the word did not exist, only becoming the leading descriptive term around 1760.
It's that ole' choosing to be offended.
Or choosing to feel attacked by ANYone who believes differently from them.
And of course at this time of year, whining loudly about people saying "Happy Holidays", instead of "Merry Christmas". During some discussion about this, I've silenced a few by reminding them that there are other celebrations in December, that deserve well wishes too.
And what exactly is stopping those that observe it , from saying "Merry Christmas" !!??
Nothing at all. Nada. Zilch.
evergreen
Level 8
Dec 13, 2017
2
For the born again evangelical christians, persecution is built right into their scriptures and they are taught this from an early age. This is not quite so prevalent in mainstream christianity, but it is still there. There is a little of that in Judaism, but not much. To the best of my knowledge, Islam has little to none.
I consistently hear this from the born again evengelicals:
We're in a cultural war.
They're attacking Christmas. There's a war on Christmas.
We must be prepared to defend ourselves from the immoral enemy.
Family values are under attack.
The list is, of course, much longer, but this stuff is a natural for them. They wallow in it like pigs in warm summer mud. Their identity is as much tied up in their persecution as it is in the jeebus kid and the resurrection of same. It appears to be one of their bonding mechanisms.
evidentialist
Level 8
Dec 13, 2017
4
I would say yes, there is a war on family values - being waged by “conservatives” who fight to eliminate health care for children and programs to feed the hungry, while defending pedophiles and rapists as “good people.”
You're not telling ANYTHING new there, evidentialist, since I have one those "Born Again, Evangelists" for a next door neighbour for almost 5 years now and I heard just about every single Sermon, every cry of persecution and every erroneous claim of an Atheists War Against Christianity that must surely be. It's kind of like listening to an old vinyl record with a scratch in it, the needle just jumps back a step and repeats over and over again.
Once his tirade has settled I usually just mention casually about the Millions of Innocent lives that Christianity alone has taken with THEIR War against those who don't believe as they do, etc, etc, and to top it all off I just drop in, for good measure of course, the Millions that are written in the bible that were Slaughtered either by god or at the behest of god.
That usually shuts him down for a few weeks/a month at least.
A lot of believers also have a persecution complex. They fail to acknowledge the hypocrisy of that. You know, given that believers of all different stripes have persecuted just about every other group of people on the planet. There's no "war" on believers or Christmas. They're just butthurt because more people are telling them to back the hell off and get out of their faces with all their bible-thumping. It's not discrimination when you're telling a group that has spent millennia discriminating against others to knock if off. They're just taking it that way because of their persecution complex.
KKGator
Level 9
Dec 13, 2017
2
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