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Bottom lines.

What are some of the deepest, most basic questions that underlie the most disagreements? What basic assumptions need to be agreed on before details can be agreed on?

Who is responsible for making decisions, the individual or the government?
Does centralized planning work?
Can people be trusted to make the best decisions for themselves?
Should government protect people from themselves?
Is government responsible for providing goods and services to people or are people responsible for taking care of themselves?
Should people receive the benefits and consequences of their own choices and actions?
Where do rights come from? What are rights?
Is the US Constitution the law of the land, does it still apply, is it a living document? Should courts apply laws as they were written or should they change the meanings of laws?
Which is better at producing and creating; government or business?
Should governments pick winners and losers? Should governments influence or control prices?
Should governments have replaced charities?
Does welfare in it's various forms work?
Do more regulations and more laws work better then capitalism and a free-market?
Does competition work?
Should parents be able to choose where their kids go to school?
Who decides what is best for children; parents or bureaucrats?
Should businesses be run by their owners and managers or by unions?
Are individuals and big corporations rich because they earned it or did they take advantage of others?
Is wealth a zero-sum game or can wealth be created?

Markss76118 7 Feb 12
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11 comments

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On gov. regulations. I was just reading this morning where there is a very big increase of black lung for miners in Appalachia n Coal mines. So I am all for gov. regulations relating to the health and welfare of us citizens. Getting rid of or at least redifining the scope the 2nd amendment would be great. Like the Bible I don't care for laws that can be interpreted to suit anything the reader wants it to.

3

This is an exam, right? If we pass we get to move on to the next level?

0

bottom line is yes and no . the powerful will always exploit the weak and govt tries to soften the blow. unions got us our current standard of living [without them we'd still be in work houses] the law is subject to judges. american judges are elected by moneyed interests. that is a problem. your law has been hijacked. regulations give us clean water for a start. right now you have the right to speak out against the powers but not too loudly. and the right to operate a credit card and travel. . that's better than alot of the rest of the world

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These are all questions we should be asking and probingly discussing every day. The problems are that (1) many politicians seem too dense to even get their heads around the questions, much less potential answers, (2) too many people and politicians have fixed themselves and their flaswedanswers to a false ideology, and (3) not enough people seem to even give a damn about the questions.

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Last one first. Wealth is aggregated profit. The concept of profit to me is spurious. If we apply Newtons first law, we would have to accept that to gain, someone or something must lose, whether it is slaves, underpaid workers or devastated environment. (there are exceptions). The apply Newtons 2nd law re entropy and we would realise that any profit would disappear. Yay, I made a profit this month of 600,000 watermelons. This is where money distorts things. In regard to taking advantage of others, this can be done directly, but what about simply being smarter than average, seeing how things work, and then gliding through the system, turning it on it's backside and making it work for you. It is easier than people realise.

Yes, for every winner, someone must lose!!

No, it is not a zero-sum game. Goods and services can be created without taking anything from anyone else.

@Markss76118 Goods and services yes, and some profit even maybe, but large profits require obtaining things at less than their real value and or selling them at more than their real value. Imagine if mining companies were required to go back and repair all the mine sites from the last 200 years, repair the environment etc. they could not afford to do so, and it such was factored into their plans, mining would not be viable.

You are applying a science law to a social science, they work on different rules. Newtons law does not take in to account that some thing can be greater than its constituent parts. My favorite story that I tell to many artists and artisans goes like this. A very high class lady walks up to a milliners counter. " Georgio you must help me. Look what this idiot has done with my hair. I have a charity dinner tonight and its a mess! " The milliner looks at her hair and brings forth a yard of silk. Then he fashions a sublime turban, complimenting her features and dress. " That`s wonderful Georgio " says the lady "How much do I owe you? " " That will be $200 ". " What! $200 for a piece of cloth? " The guy takes the turban from her head, unravels it and then hands it back to her saying " The silk is yours for nothing MY expertise is $200 ! "

@273kelvin I really like that, I must remember it.

@Rugglesby A professional artist friend was commissioned a " before " drawing of a building by an architect. Now this guys drawing were superb. every crack and brick, every piece of foliage and broken gutter was beautifully drawn in charcoal. It took the guy a month to draw this thing and though I never saw that one I know from his work that it would be great (I bought one of his paintings). The architect was baulking at the price of £200 (this was early 90`s). So I told my friend to stand up for himself and bluntly ask the architect how much he charges for one of his bloody drawings?

4

Individual, no, yes, no, no, yes, being born, inalienable, yes, yes, yes, should be fewer in general, business, no, no, no, no, no, yes, yes, parents, owners, both, created. And that's all I have to say about that.

Wow, I'm impressed that you put so much thought into answering all of those questions. I was just trying to give some examples or suggestions and wondering what might be most basic underlying question. I hear people arguing about details but they will never come to an agreement because they have opposite opinions on the basics.

@Markss76118 Generally, it seems people are so busy arguing about their differences, they forget to acknowledge the things they agree on.

@Markss76118 I couldn't read all the questions, so I have no idea what you are answering, but THAT is funny! 🙂

3

I think extremes are bad, compromises are generally middle ground and work best. Straight capitalism, say the Victorian era/robber barons was a brutal world. Straight communism isn't any fairer and tends to kill off huge numbers. What our forefathers envisioned, a democracy that relied on very slow and cumbersome compromise to bring about change would seem to me the best answer. Compromise also answers all those questions since no answer is black and white, just a different shade of gray. So the basic assumption is we all have a small piece of the answer.

3

You just put 50 questions in your post-would take me a day to answer all of them. Going to try to answer one of them:
. The individual makes decisions for themselves based on social programs that are available to them. When I was diagnosed with leukemia this is how I made my decisions.
a. Boston hospital or Dartmouth Medical School-I live in NH, not a city person-chose to stay
in NH and be at top Medical School. Ambulance would have gone to either. I had good
medical insurance.
b. Chemo or no chemo. Vs chemo but docs said I'd be dead in 3 weeks so went with chemo,
radiation and bone marrow transplant.
c. Insurance issues-my policy converted to Cobra-got medical assistance from Hospital.
d. Cobra cancelled-Applied for and received Obamacare.
e. Medicare available, Social Security Disability.
f. Medicaid home based program
Hospitals provide social workers who help someone make these decisions. I am grateful of the assistance I have received for the past 5 years enabling me to recover. Paid into the system.

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Whoa..maybe it's time to grab a relaxation herb and take a long walk outdoors!

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Well that's a lot of questions. I'd say that no group of individuals has a right to govern another. A right is a natural entitlement. I see no legitimate claim to the right to rule. The less government, the more free the people. The constitution doesn't grant anything, existence does.

Yes. Notice the constitution doesn't say that the government allows certain things, it says "shall not be infringed".
one thing I try to emphasize to people is they need to protect all rights, even the ones they don't like. They need to protect them all with the same ferocity. Because once you define a right as something the government can give or take, you define them all similarly. And one day, that same government will get around to infringing a right they do care about.

5

Jesus h man one thing we can all agree on is a limit of two questions per post. How about breaking that up into manageable segments suitable for texting?

I'm sorry, I did get carried away. I didn't mean for anyone to answer all those questions. I was trying to give examples and suggestions. The real question I was trying to ask is what are the most basic questions. What are some of the assumptions and beliefs that have to be agreed on before details can be agreed on?

@Markss76118 I know Mark. I was giving you a gentle ribbing. But the last time I was asked all those questions I got a top secret clearance out of deal. Did you know FBI agents have no sense of humor?

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