19 4

I want to recommend an important book:VACCINATION IS NOT IMMUNIZATION by Dr. Tim O'Shea
It is a copious, brilliant recount of what's going on in Big Pharma concerning this subject- brief and easy to read. Some of you will be shocked by this true story. For your sake and for any children in your path, this is a must-read! you can call 408-753-9830 or

think-beyond 7 Sep 13

Post a comment Reply Add Photo

Enjoy being online again!

Welcome to the community of good people who base their values on evidence and appreciate civil discourse - the social network you will enjoy.

Create your free account


Feel free to reply to any comment by clicking the "Reply" button.


Per all those flu shots being promoted everywhere; I haven't had a cold or the flu, since I dumped red meat, white flour, and white sugar in 1977. My kids used to play out in the snow in shirt sleeves all day and never got a sniffle.

But if one of their ignorant relatives secretly "treated" them to junk food, within ten minutes the kids would get stuffy heads, runny noses, and become hyper and mean. It would pass after a few hours, but meanwhile, the relatives would point to the sick kids and start raging how my cruel natural food diet was making them SICK.

I know the feeling. I sympathize. Wisdom is hard won. We can't follow the crowd. You are not alone.


Something to think about...


Best you can hope for is informed consent!


Pump me with as many vaccines as 'ya got. We did not "ride out childhood diseases in the past" as one suggested. "We" went blind, lost our hearing, ability to use appendages, motor skills. There was heart damage & brain damage, lung damage. There was scarring & high fever. Then there was also death. I for one experienced several epidemics in the 1950's. My mother the after math of the 1918 pandemic of which 1/3rd of the world was infected & suffering. Killed more soldiers than battle. She herself scarlett fever which impacted her sight. Rabies was common in the rural areas & dogs were turned loose all of the time. Nope. Poke me like a pin cushion with that elixir. Shingles & super anti pneumonia is next for me. Cancer? That is from the radiation from atomic bomb testing in the 1950's to 1964, all floating north & east. DNA damage is passed along to the grand kids of which I have none. Nor any spawn.

Of course, vaccinations have an important place. What I gleaned from this book, is that today they have run rampant with it...too many..too young,..too polluted to keep it cheap. It is true that people have lost their lives because of these diseases, but now babies and other people are dying due to the mishandling of vaccinations. Remember the Salk vaccine? Such a great breakthrough but also very dangerous. So Sabine came up with a safe one that is not injected. This just ins't a black and white issue to my mind. Nevertheless less, you stay well...and let's keep thinking.


reading the plainly hostile & vulgar comments to this post, i am quite shocked to realise that there seems to be no such thing as the intellectual ability to stay with a topic without getting personally abusive & threatening, not even in the ones privileged in education - very poor form.
i am not anti-vax nor pro-stuff-em-fulla-vax, having had a handful of reasonable vaccinations including against poliomyelitis as a child. in my eyes vaccinations against rubella, chickenpox, whooping cough & the flu are somewhere between useless & harmful. we used to ride those out as kids. us-americans might ask themselves why & how a so-called developed first world country can show comparatively high statistics in child mortality (6.2 in 1,000).
@think-beyond, i apologise for the black & white blinkeredness of my fellow humans on this forum.

Thank you.





You fucking anti-vaxxers are dangerous lunatics and should be ostracized and held liable for every child who dies from a preventable disease. Your stupidity is criminal.

JimG Level 8 Sep 13, 2018

Watch your language you closed minded numbskull!

@think-beyond Seriously, my language? You are promoting bullshit that has caused the deaths of children and you worried about my saying, "Fuck?" You are an ignorant fuckwit. If I offended you, I seriously couldn't care less. Being insulted by idiots has never bothered me, by the way.

Again: Anti-vax assholes should be held responsible for every preventable death of a child caused by the lies they spread!

@think-beyond stop promoting shit that kills people, including innocent children who did not have a say in whether or not they got vaccinated, and maybe people who get pissed off by that kind of crap will watch our fucking language. until then... nope.



yeah i doubt any of us will be shocked by a chiropractor with his qualifications for being a loon im more shocked someone would support something that has been responsible for so many childrens needless deaths based on a lying cunt of a GP who has long been discredited barred from practicing medicine and deserves a long slow lingering death but then it appears.....


I think you brought your woo to the wrong place.

Every place is right where there are people and especially children. All I am suggesting is that in this place where there are thinking individuals - that you examine both facts on both sides. The book is not against all vaccines. Did you know that the products bear the declaration that they have not been tested as a carcinogen? There is a rise in childhood cancer. The way these untested vaccines are constructed they interfere with the development of the myelin sheath in young children who are not born with it and must develop this protection of the nerves as they grow older. Otherwise, there is severe neurological damage - causing autism and other not-so-fun things. I thought this would be a great place to introduce this book and an informed debate where there are supposedly thinking people.

@think-beyond the only doctor who ever did a study about the relationship between vaccines and autism ADMITTED HE FALSIFIED THE STUDY in order to gain funding.

@JenBeberstein Not so! I have met Dr Andrew Wakefield and he spoke about the lies and misrepresentations perpetrated by the Big Pharma establishment.

@think-beyond []



I tend to believe legitimate medical sources such as the New England Journal of Medicine or the Children's Hospital of Philadelphia instead of an anonymous internet whack job.

@JenBeberstein That's your privilege. But babies are dying. There are European countries that vax, but do not do it until their children are two years old. The book explains why.

@think-beyond ...

@think-beyond babies and children are dying because they have NOT been vaccinated and other babies and children are dying because they've been exposed to the babies and children who have not been vaccinated. you are posting on a site that eschews belief in mythology but you subscribe to another kind of mythology. []



Vaccination is important and it should never be forgotten how high the infant and child mortality rate was prior to the mass inoculations of the mid twentieth century. Dr.Andrew Wakefield and his lies and personally motivated campaign against the MMR vaccine did a lot of damage when he linked it to Autusm. This lead to an epidemic of measles and I remember the long queues of teenage and younger children having to wait in line for vaccinations they should have had as toddlers. He has been struck off the Medical Register in the UK but is still peddling his fraudulent views around America. Our children and grandchildren need to be protected and if the percentage being innocuoted falls below a certain level an outbreak will is called “herd immunity “. This is one time I would urge those who hate the state telling them what to do, to follow the Health Authorities’ guidelines and get immunised.

Well said

Andrew Wakefield has been exonerated. That has been suppressed. Such an intelligent person as you should read this book before responding. Not to do so is not up to your standards as a thinking person. Get informed first - then make your statement.

@think-beyond I prefer to do my own research and have done. He had ulterior motives and believe you and others are still being duped by him. He us a very dangerous man.

@Marionville Andrew Wakefield has been exonerated after being persecuted. He has paid a huge price for his findings. The propaganda against all of this is huge. This is a multi billion dollar industry. There are things to be said on both sides and an intelligent debate would be wonderful but there is so much prejudice. Why not read the book and then make your comments?

@think-beyond I will, but at the moment I think he is a charlatan.

@Marionville Great! At least you will open your mind and give it a try. Whatever your conclusion is respected.

@think-beyond never exonerated a still barred from practicing medicine still child killer who wanted to make money of his quackery....... next


It's scary, for sure, what Big Pharm is selling people in toxic synthetic drugs.

Link: BBC- Evidence is growing that cannabis cures serious diseases like cancer. []

Link: Patients should be warned about the dangers of chemotherapy after research showed that cancer drugs are killing up to 50 per cent of patients []

I'm with you on everything you say. Wait 'till you read this book. It's a shocker. And if you have children in your family - reading this is a must. My husband died from a whooping cough vaccine. Children are s given now 69 vaccines and the number is growing inspire of deaths, autism, diabetes, asthma and CANCER and much more.


Vaccination is why I no longer see people with polio in this country. Mumps, whooping cough, and others have pretty much vanished also. Yes, that's right. I knew people who had polio as a child and it deformed their bodies. I never met or knew anyone with autism in those days. Not one single person. You are being fooled by those selling books on this misunderstood subject.

The first polio vaccines had to be replaced because of the harm they were doing. Now, after Sabine, it is no longer an injection. The book states that not all vaccines are bad. Children now get 69 untested vaccines. The label to the doctor has to state that these vaccines have not been tested for cancer. There's a shock full of information in this book Read it and then comment.

Childhood diseases create real immunity. The few days of these illnesses are far better than the vaccine which has caused death, asthma, autism, diabetes and even cancer. The labels on the vaccines to the doctor states that these have not been tested for cancer. There is now a vast increase in childhood cancer. READ THIS BOOK.

@think-beyond. Ummm "the few days of illness"...until you of your mother, or husband, comes down with whooping cough, or diphtheria , or about 50 other for example adult males can be made sterile from mumps, or German measles causes horrible birth defects if a pregnant woman gets vaccers Always pretend that nobody but "a few kids' sick days" are all that is involved, which is why the majority of people see you are Fools, antisocial uncaring fools!

@AnneWimsey I'm not sure I understand your point. But here is something to think about. Getting these childhood diseases are not nearly as serious as when they occur in adulthood. The effect of the vaccines wear out with time leaving some people open to getting this in adulthood when the illness is very serious.Whereas going through the actual childhood illness results in real immunity that most probably will last a lifetime. The book is not against all vaccines. What is wrong with looking at all the facts and then deciding for yourself Nobody said this was easy. But it is important.

@JustLynnie This is woo, sister. Every bit of it is woo. I never knew or heard of mentally retarded kids sent off to live somewhere else in group homes etc. in my day. People might not have known what to call things but for the most part they still lived at home and everybody knew everybody else and word spread quickly. Yes, having certain diseases builds immunity but not always. Sometimes you just die. It depends on the disease. You say you are reporting this because you care. Somebody has poisoned your mind with woo.

@think-beyond your statement that getting the disease gives better protection vs. Vaccination is FALSE! Oh, and my brother got mumps at 13 and not only did it almost kill him, but it sterilized him. FALSE IN EVERY ASSUMPTION!

@JustLynnie Not in my 72 years but maybe I was just living in the wrong areas. What are "special needs?" How would a chiropractor know about them when his book is nothing but woo? I was raised as a Missouri redneck and at one time went to a schoolhouse that had all grades together inside. Most of us knew all about the others and their families in great detail. This was in the days that old family photos showed relatives posing holding their guns. We were clanish and everyone knew all the gossip. We heard woo in those days too. I'm one that outgrew it.


Ohferpetessake...i was around before the polio vaccine was available, and I remember the canceled outings & the fear on our parent's faces every time there was a surge in cases. I remember being "treated" to public service movies in school after Thursday lunch, showing you how living in an iron lung could be just peachy. (You can still find that onYoutube, just search for "iron lung" ).
I remember my aunt talking about surviving whooping cough. I remember my uncle talking about the ills that killed mote men than battle in WW I.
Anything that can quell infectious diseases is a wonderful thing!

I can remember kids with braces on their legs in my class, who had polio. It was awful.

Thanks for that.

The book is not against the polio vaccine. The Salk vaccine had to be replaced by the Sabine which is not administered by needle. Get the facts, especially if there are children in your family. Children are forced to get 69 vaccines and that is growing. There is a rise in childhood cancer, autism, asthma, allergies, diabetes and even deaths. Get the facts READ THE BOOK and then make you statements.

@think-beyond firstly, i would prefer a book of Facts not hysteriacal anecdotes.
And yes, there is a "rise" in things because of

  1. Better monitoring/reporting/diagnosis and
  2. Because the population is larger.

Anti-vaccers are not only nuts but a positive danger to us you think only children get diphtheria, smallpox, cholera, tetanus, whooping cough, etc etc etc?

@Holiday I remember those with polio and braces too and it was cured by vaccination to prevent getting it in the first place. That is the ONLY reason we do not have polio today.


I'll get to that book right after an important, copious, and brilliant recount of young, flat earth creationism.


You are opting to be ignorant - as ignorant as the flat earth espousers. You will never know what you are missing. If you have children in your family and do not read this book you will be responsible for anything that follows. Some children die, get autism and other neurological atrocities, Cancer, asthma and other allergies. You might join the throng of getting Alzheimers of which there is now an epidemic. Do you want to be smug and ignorant. Be my guest.


"Do you want to be smug and ignorant."

Just smug. I'll leave the rest to you. I hope you never harm anyone or lead anyone else towards negligence with your harmful crackpot conspiracy theories.

@AlPastor Did you read the book about the myelin sheath in infants? I'm so tired of you morons with your closed messianic minds. You have replaced Jesus for Big Pharma. Why am I being so accused for reading a BOOK?

@think-beyond you have replaced jesus (someone who never needed replacement in my world since he was never a part of it, but hey, make all the assumptions you like; you're batting zero SO far) with antivax evangelism. if you were JUST the moron you are calling others, fine, be a moron, but you're an ignorance evangelist and your misinformation is going to kill someone if it hasn't already.



What a crock of crap.

I hope you do not have children in your family who are now forced to get 69 untested vaccines. The label on the product states that it has not been tested for cancer. There is a huge rise in childhood cancer now. Is that crap? My husband was killed by a whooping cough vaccine. Is that crap? A smart lady like you should not choose ignorance. By the way, continue to get you flu shot and pray you don't get Alzheimers. Maybe you should open your mind and get the FACTS.


11-Month-Old Baby Has Stroke After Getting Chickenpox from Unvaccinated Siblings

Thank you for this thought provoking statement. It does pose a question to be investigated. But we should have the facts on both sides of this vital situation. Don't you agree.

@think-beyond there are no facts of the opposite view of this vital situation. There's only one side with facts. The anti-vaccination bunch has nothing. Just people thinking they're smarter than 99.9% of the world wide legitimate medical community. Little babies dying from some asshole's huberous for fuck sake! Babies!

@MiltsterD You ;point would be better taken if you opened yourself to examining all sides. Not to do so - makes your comment meaningless. I would relish an informed debate. This is not easy for me. We both care about this. Let's look at it.

@think-beyond facts on the other side? like maybe the kid didn't die? there is no other side. there is knowledge and there is ignorance. your side isn't the side of knowledge, no matter what you claim.



Vaccinations save lives. Please vaccinate your children for their sakes. Too many children are dying out of pure stupidity.

This is not stupid. These vaccines carry a disclaimer that they have not been tested as a carcinogen and there is a sharp rise in childhood cancer. The way these vaccines are constructed they interfere with the development of the myelin sheath that protects the nerves. We are not born with this and it is developed as we grow older. Without the myelin sheath we develop serious neurological conditions such as autism. The list goes on. The dirty metal included in this never leave the body and cause all sorts of things that are not attributed to it - like Alzheimers. You may not want to get this side of the coin, and that is painful for me, but to be informed is to be armed. Then it's up to you to decide. The book is not against all vaccines. But many are unnecessary (69 to be forced on young children?) Some are given at too young an age. etc..... I just asked every thinking person on this site to simply read this book...

@think-beyond this is all complete and utter bullshit. No other way to put it. Complete bullshit.

Frankly you should be ashamed of yourself for spreading such misinformation and falsehoods. You do know this could easily lead to you being indirectly responsible for the death of someone right? Do you get that? This is more than you sitting at your laptop or whatever typing nonesense because you think you're smarter than the average bear Boo Boo.

These diseases are very very real. They're not the bullshit your sellin'. They're very very real with very very real consequences to the people that contract them and the loved ones they can leave behind if they die. Stop it.

Parents choosing to not vaccinate their children should be able to be charged with reckless child endangerment. Simple as that.

@MiltsterD Not bullshit! Say all this after you have read the book and examined both sides of the situation. What is so wrong at looking at the research on the other side. The book is not against all vaccinations - but 69 of them causes some room for question. The important ones are necessary and they have been relegated to other types of administration - via the skin or by mouth - not needles. These vaccinations declaim that they have not been tested as carcinogens and there is a sharp rise in childhood cancer. - for starters. Perhaps if you first read the info in this book you might temper your criticism of me.

@think-beyond I have read the book. It and others full of bullshit. Absolutely NO substantiated data. All crap to make money off the dimwitted who finally decided to read a book.

@MiltsterD Thank you for reading the book. Your conclusions have been thought over. That's good.


i should read pseudoscience from an anti-vaxxer? that old vaccinations cause autism stuff has been well disproven but he keeps cranking it out? no thanks.


It's dangerous stuff.

@MiltsterD yes, this misinformation IS dangerous stuff. it prevents parents from vaccinating their children, which puts OTHER children at risk. look up "herd immunity." in places where people don't vaccinate, there have been outbreaks of diseases that used to kill kids and for a long time now have not done so, because of vaccinations. well OOPS!


@genessa oh I know. Been battling anti-vaxxer nutbars for years.

@MiltsterD glad to hear it! for a second, i misread and thought you were the person posting the recommendation, hence what may have seemed to be a strangely hostile argument from me. glad you seem not to have taken it that way. phew! my eyes don't do well when i spend a sleepless night.


Write Comment
You can include a link to this post in your posts and comments by including the text q:177687
Agnostic does not evaluate or guarantee the accuracy of any content. Read full disclaimer.