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We've had quite a bit of political sniping going on with our great community in the past two or more months. More and more people attacking each other, insulting each other based on political philosophies and passions.

I would like to open a question to ALL of us: In your response to this post, state your political leanings/stance and the REASONING/logic supporting it. Simple as that.

And no attacking of someone else's stance is allowed. Questions, fine. Attacks or insults? I encourage any and all to block anyone who engages in such behavior if civility and intellectual discourse is beyond them.

Seeker3CO 8 Jan 5
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16 comments

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2

I have already said plenty on the boards to reveal my politics, but I'll start by saying I despise liberalism simply because, as Chris Hedges says, it no longer stands for anything besides identity politics and multiculturalism, instead of opposing capitalism or endless war for empire and oil. I support policies of democratic socialism such as Bernie Sanders only I also believe, unlike him, in opposing the military industrial complex. Liberalism doesn't go far enough to oppose and fight back against the class warfare of the rich and corporations against everyone but the top 10%. I would like to see the US have a form of socialism like Scandanvia, where corporations are actually regulated, the rich actually pay their share, and banks and corporations do not own the govt. Lastly, I would like campaign reform where campaigns are much shorter and regulated, like in the UK, to only last for a few months and that all campaigns for federal office, at least, are publicly financed for all candidates who can meet a modest threshold of support, say 15%, in polls. No corporate money allowed for campaigns, low limits on individual contributions and free air time on TV for all candidates who meet the above threshold. With election reform like this, we would actually have governments that reflected the will of the people instead of just the wealthiest and most powerful. In turn, they would serve the common good instead of just the interests of the elite.

I am very pessimistic about the future tho. Before the rich and corporations would ever allow this to happen, I think the US would see martial law, a military crackdown with militarized police and troops in the streets, and a dictatorship running things while we waited to see if the masses would resist with general strikes and protests to demand an end to it. Still better than the violent form of revolution the fascists in charge are hoping will happen so they can mow us down with the tools they already have prepared, like the Patriot Act and militarized police forces. The Occupy movement and how it was crushed are a preview of what I'm talking about.

0

Politics and religion have had the same effect on me. For the great majority of my life I was told that I had to choose one accept it and believe in everything about it and my loyalty would be valued way more than my opinion.

And also just like religion politics has shown me both its hypocrisy and the blind ignorance of their followers. So just like religion I’ve chosen to not accept any form of an “ organized “ political affiliation.

So no I’m not a democrat or a republican.
I believe in and support ideals and practices of both conservatives and liberals anything that might possibly benefit the people of “ OUR “ country because the idea that we could actually benefit people in the rest of the world while more and more of ours are in inescapable debt, mass incarceration through laws intended to subjugate those in our society who are also the victims of a political system that has only used them as a pulpit to stand upon
In order to convince others that their cause was righteous and just.

And just like there are those of whom that are mocked for their blind ignorant loyalty to the fictional system of religion I mock those who display their blind ignorant loyalty to a political party that gets paid to work against them by the same people who have chosen our wars, the cost of our needs and the media that constantly promotes fear, hatred and the idea that the life of 10,000 people in a foreign country is in no way equal to having killed supposed terrorist or that when someone who actually tells us all about how our country has betrayed them and our freedoms that the person is a threat and an enemy to all of us.

I believe that Malcom shabazz said it best when he said be careful of the newspapers they’ll have you hating the people who are being oppressed and loving those who are doing the oppressing.
Just saying we can be gay own guns educate all of our children equally while feeding and housing all Americans and making it that entry into our country illegally should result in immediate deportation and that there are those that are born American that should have their citizenship revoked and they should also be deported and the finally we either legalize all drugs or we scorch and salt the earth anywhere we discover opium producing poppy and coca fields around the world.
Ok that’s my two cents

@maturin1919 Any country which we would possibly have an agreement with. Some countries still have exile agreements with other so I don’t see why not.
Me personally I’d love to send The leaders of the aryan brotherhood to the republic of Congo. 😁

@maturin1919 And to think that all of this time I believed that you had a sense of imagination. ?

@maturin1919 Well if that’s the case then I’m shocked that the rest of the world hasn’t turned us into glass by now.

@maturin1919 No he’s just the president... oh you said stick lol my bad. ?

@maturin1919 Kill those who disagree with you?

@maturin1919 So, murder? Make it look like self defense?

@maturin1919 If you're serious, you won't live long, yourself. Someone will shoot you first. You would be considered to be the vermin you speak of eliminating. People tend to pick up on attitudes such as yours.

@maturin1919 Those same folks probably feel the same about you. Sauce for the goose, sauce for the gander.

@maturin1919 Those same folks are judging you by their own criteria. Personally, I think people end up getting their just desserts. What goes around, comes around and all that.

@maturin1919 Personally, I prefer not to try and play god. Prefer to not set myself up as god. I don't have that sort of ego.

@maturin1919 Yeah "lol". The garbage man who thinks he's in charge of life and death. Who advocates murder. What you're failing to see is, you are them, and they are you. Two sides of the same coin. You're the same critter as they are. You think you're "right". They think they're "right". Both are equally dangerous.

@maturin1919 You advocate murder and you're the good guy, the one who determines that it's the other guy who's "trash". Nope.

@maturin1919 Self-appointed judge of right and wrong, guilt or innocence. You're the good guy, even if you do say so yourself. Nope.

@maturin1919 There is such a thing as due process of law. Your stance is in violation of that. You are just as bad as those you advocate murdering. Some would call what you suggest, to be terroristic threats.

@maturin1919 You're setting yourself up as judge, jury and executioner. Your "concept" is outside the law. Oh well. You've trolled me enough for one day.

@maturin1919 Yes. Terroristic threat. You've threatened to murder those you deem to be worthy of murdering, entirely at your discretion. If I didn't think you were just big-talking, I'd turn you in myself.

@maturin1919 Not sure how much time a terrorist gets. That's for the courts to decide. Except anyone can tell you're doing the forum version of running your mouth. Very trollish behavior.

The discussion is not, if I were in charge. It's political views. You proceeded to out yourself as a wannabe murderer, anti-legal terrorist type. Wonder if the FBI monitors agnostic forums in an effort to identify persons of interest?

@maturin1919 "lol" when there's nothing to "lol". Off topic. Inflammatory statements. Talking nonsense. Trying give others the impression how tough and clever you are. That's being a troll.

@maturin1919 Holy shit! I leave you alone with my comment for a few hours and WTF!? ????

@maturin1919 Not at all sir not at all.?

@maturin1919 You were off-topic AND inflammatory. I asked one question. Were you claiming a right to murder. Turns out, you think you have that right and are doing nothing wrong, because you are you and that's all the clearance you need. You're obviously just saying it for the attention (troll behavior). Interesting how it's the other guy (non-murder-advocates) who are crazy.

@maturin1919 Maybe just put on the hats just to be safe.?

1

I'm neither Liberal nor Conservative.

I'm definitely not Democrat or Republican.

I'm a Moderate Voter...

I voted for a Green Party candidate this past presidential election... Dr. Stein was the only other person I agreed with on most issues.

If Bernie Sanders had not been sabotaged, he would have had my vote. I have the Bernie t-shirt to prove it!

1

Do you see that point left...no the further left...no no the furtherest left...well thats me!

4

I consider myself an environmental progressive. Lived in several places in the US as well as Germany (15 years). Was in military intelligence and stationed in Turkey. Brought up Catholic and for a long time was a moderate conservative. Returning to the US and getting involved with the environmental movement caused a 180% shift. A lifetime of experiences (and they haven't stopped) have caused me to see the world in a very different way than most and showed me the importance of tough love. Married to an Iranian, lifetime atheist woman sealed and reinforced my view of the world. She and I were a team and even though we were polar opposites personality wise we were 95% on the same page. Her motto "Discipline first, then love" (which is on her urn) and question to her 2nd graders, "What is more important, people or dirt" pretty much sums it up for me. I am passionate about how I feel about the importance our life support system but I have also learned the importance of flexibility and understanding.

3

I lean left for our need to change how we govern.
It's a little late for smaller government. As we can only try to limit the power of government by reducing the monitary incentive to run government.
Take control of the government by term limits, outlaw lobbiest, cut the military budget which gives way too much control of government contracts. Also the environment is under attack from fossil fuel industries. We all live down stream. We must take better care of our environment. We must reduce the oligarchy's power before we are just like Russia, controlled by mofia thugs #FAKEPOTUS45. The real devide is rich and poor, not black & white. So I vote Democrat even though they are beholding to big money as well. Our economy is setup for rich to get richer, not to elevate poor. We must have a shift of consciousness be for everyone and not just self or group promotion.

1

I have lived in three different countries under different political beliefs. The best one was the Social Democratic one for all people not just for the rich.

1

I'm a libertarian small-government guy.

I've seen the federal and state governments do so many stupid things that the less power they have the better. For example.

Carter's grain embargo of the Soviet Union cut my dad's income by 70% and bankrupted hundreds of thousands of farmers.

I worked for government contractors from 1987 through 1999, and the waste was staggering. I could go on for days, but just one story. I had just finished an introduction to digital circuits class, then I went to work for Hughes Aircraft Company as a college intern. They said "We want you to build a parallel processing computer" I gave it my best shot, spent about $500,000 of Uncle Sam's money, then went back to college 8 months later and the project died.

I built spy stuff for Uncle Sam for 3 years. I learned enough doing that to know that the people in power in DC don't give a damn about the constitutional rights of US Citizens.

I've been audited by the IRS twice. Same story, when you put small people in positions of power they will attempt to abuse that power. The first audit was no problem but still cost me $1100 to pay a CPA to represent me. During the second audit, they said I owed $28,000. After a year of fighting with the IRS, I went in and settled and wrote them a check for $1500. The supervisor there said "You seem like a nice person, but I hope your name never comes up in an audit again"

Apart from my own personal experiences, the 20th Century provides numerous social science experiments where large powerful collectivist governments are a disaster:

West Germany vs. East Germany.
South Korea vs. North Korea
Hong Kong, Taiwan, and Singapore vs. Communist China

The Democrats are the ones that want to take us down the road to a large powerful collectivist government, so when it matters, I vote Republicans because they are the lessor of 2 evils. When it doesn't matter, I cast symbolic votes for Libertarian party candidates.

BD66 Level 8 Jan 5, 2019
1

Although this goes against my recent New Year's resolution (I'm about to break it), which was to not waste so much time on politics, I'll take the bait...

I'm a radical for laissez faire Capitalism. I'm not a Libertarian (since that seems to be what most people think because of my positions). I think there should be a separation of economics and state, as there should be of church and state.

I'm for a limited -- constitutionally limited -- government. The government should only have one purpose, which is to protect individual rights, which includes property rights. This means there must be a military to protect us from foreign violations of our rights, a police force to protect us from domestic violations of our rights, and a judicial system to protect us from contract and other violations.

I'm for a woman's right to an abortion.

I'm for a person's right to marry whomever they want.

I'm for the legality of all drugs. If people want to do drugs, it is not my problem.

Let the fight begin...

1

I think the process of campaigning is woefully out of date and introducing large quantities of money that don't need to be in politics. I think there should just be a website that lists all offices up for grabs and the candidates for that office. I think for each candidate it should state clearly and succinctly what their stance is on all major issues, with a brief essay on themselves. Anything more than that is just an invitation to obfuscation.
I think healthcare in this country is a joke. Having a bad case of the flu can land you on the street. I'd be happy to implement healthcare as seen in scandanavian countries.
I think gerrymandering is one of the top 3 worst things to happen to US politics.
I think people should be allowed to do whatever they want to their bodies including
-Abortion
-physician assisted suicide
-smoke weed
-any body altering they want to do
I think our countries priorities are way out of whack. You know how you honor soldiers? You don't have so many of them. You don't send them off to far-flung corners to die for no reason. It is also a gigantic money hole.
I think energy independence means we've found better ways to power ourselves besides a waning fossil fuel supply that is killing us. Through funding innovation to the point that we find fiscally efficient means of producing energy.
I think that funding education should be a top priority, should be leveled across the board so everyone is receiving a good education and is not the soul purview of the rich.
I think clinging to some puritanical notion of policing adult (consensual) relationships is ridiculous.
I think the way we treat the ancestors of the indiginous north american popluation is a travesty.
I think finding a better, more efficient way, to deal with our trash would benefit nature and ourselves.
I think protecting the environment and where we live should be a given and not seen as the care of outliers.
I think businesses have not, and will never be, self-regulating. I'm not against people making money, I'm against legal theft. You provide a fantastic service, or product, in a reasonable/responsible manner and make major money? Go for it, that's fantastic, I'll cheer you on. Do it in a manner that makes Lex Luthor seem like citizen of the year and perhaps you should re-think your life.
Not a big fan of ridiculous shows of 'strength' or authoritarianism. In fact, it just turns my stomach.
On imigration, everyone rails against illegal immigrants, but given what it takes to be a legal immigrant, I can see why we have so many illegal. Have a clear cut, easy to understand and navigate proccess, and we can decide whether or not to make them legal in an efficient fair manner. If the laws had been then, what they are now, my family would have never been made citizens. My family has been upstanding, hard-working contributors to society and have always been proud to be citizens. My grandfather only had a 5th grade education, but when he came here he opened an auto shop and was a pillar of the community. My family left Italy because of mussolini. Had the system been as ridiculous then as it is now, they would have all died.

Same - agree whole-heartedly with you!

2

A moderate populist; looking out for what helps the majority of my fellow United States citizens. From Oregon, with former leaders such as Wayne Morris, Tom McCall, Mark Hatfield, Victor Atiyeh … having long admired those who ran within a party - then governed for the betterment of all. True Statesmen

Originally a registered Republican, that ended with the election of ronald reagan.. Up until then I may have been called a ‘Carter Republican!’ Re-registered as a Democrat ...as my former party began to purge it’s moderates. Actively supported both the party and our local candidates, who, in a rural county, were generally moderates as well.

Left the Democratic Party with President Obama’s ‘executive amnesty’ for illegal immigrants. A charter member of an immigration limitation group, Obama’s move was too much for me.. I let my Congressional Rep & The White House know why (as if they cared).

An Independant, like ‘Bernie,’ I now ‘caucus with the Democrats,’ as they overwhelmingly support my national goals and social desires. A life-long born-once Atheist, that has remained a motivational factor in my political adventures.

As open Atheists were not taken seriously during my most eligible years, and married to an anxiety laden wife, I was realistically delegated to the political sidelines ..or underground… having written hundreds of letters to editors ..ghost written more, and matched the tactics of our opposition..

I could go on, and have.. But appreciate the depth of knowledge around here more than any such banter I’ve experienced anywhere. Thank you for tolerating me ~

Varn Level 8 Jan 5, 2019
1

I'm conservative with my money. Feel like income should at least match up with out-go in government.

I'm neither Democrat nor Republican. I've evolved more into an independent anti-Republican since Republicans seem to be the opposite of what I stand for.

I believe facts are important. What is today's GOP don't seem to believe that. Garbage in, garbage out. We can't make informed opinions without facing the truth.

I'm liberal socially in that I believe, to each their own.

Legislators shouldn't make laws that don't apply to themselves.

Everyone taxed equally.

Universal education and health care.

Sensible enforced gun laws.

Marry who you want who will marry you.

Pro-choice.

Term limits for legislators.

Transparent political contributions.

Paper ballots.

Automatic voter registration.

No gerrymandering.

5

I'm a registered Independent. I was a republican until Reagan and the "moral majority" caused me to change, in 1983. I am a moderate, and a centrist.
I don't like extremes, whether they be to the left or the right. I don't believe either
side has all the answers, and most sensible responses are to be found somewhere in the middle. I think republicans and democrats are opposite side of the same coin. Both are corrupt, and both take turns holding power. I find them both to be morally repugnant. Although, the republicans are decidedly more so of late.

My atheism has always informed my politics. My anti-theism has even more in the
last decade or so. I will not support anyone whose religion influences how they conduct public service. I cannot abide religion influencing public policy.

I have hated 45 for over 40 years. I've always known he's nothing but a lying con man.
For anyone to support him indicates to me that they are either too gullible, or just like 45. Either way, I have NO respect for them.

I can debate anyone, and I will try not to personally attack them, or cuss at them, unless they do it to me first.
Or unless they're being a racist, or misogynist, asshat. In that case, all bets are off.

2

As far as I'm concerned, don't start none, won't be none.

3

sorry, i won't be posting my entire political leanings and stance here, with reasoning. that's not a one-liner. that's not even a one-paragrapher. simple? no. the best i can do without writing an essay is to label myself a liberal, progressive, social free-enterprisist, noncapitalist antiracist. i don't think i should have to explain any of that.

i will say i am not against attacking other people's stances. if i find someone's "logic" ridiculous i say so. on the other hand, i won't attack the person unless the person attacks me (not my ideas). to me, "i disagree because that's ridiculous" is fine (with explanation of why it's ridiculous). "i disagree and you're an idiot" isn't, and passive-aggressive attacks and gaslighting don't fare any better with me. if someone indulges in that, i do smack back; i will not hesitate to tell that person s/he is gaslighting, or being a moron, or whatever -- and probably will also block, since i do not find personal attacks acceptable.

g

@Seeker3CO yep. but sometimes the cancer acts like... well, linda blair in the exorcist lol.

g

@Seeker3CO you may invite me over but i'll have to leave my guy at home; he won't eat ham!

g

5

I just received an apology from a member of a conservative group. We are a community and I really appreciated it. He apologized for the two group members who attacked me. I think he feels they need to tone things down.

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