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Would someone please explain to me how being against Israel's actions somehow makes one an anti-Semite?

Israel is a nation-state, and its actions are legitimate targets for praise or criticism, as are the actions of any nation-state.

Being Jewish on the other hand, is--depending on your particular interpretation--either a religion or a culture or both.

How is criticism of a nation-state construed as criticism of the culture/religion? I don't get it.

If someone criticizes the actions of the United States, does that automatically constitute criticism of me as an Irish-American or a Methodist, for example?

By Elganned
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14 comments

5

Criticizing Israel is not anti-Semitic (although many people who criticize Israel also happen to be Jew haters). Israel and its policies deserves the criticism it gets, period. What I don't believe it deserves are statements like "Israel is as bad as the Nazis." No it isn't. There are several million Arabs living in Israel many of whom with Israeli citizenship. There is zero comparison with the Nazis, and people making that comparison are doing so to minimize the mass murder of Jews both prior and during WW2. Or, someone saying Israel is just like South Africa during apartheid. No it isn't. There are zero anti-miscegenation laws as they had in South Africa. If you want to say Israel's policies are fucked... then say that. If you want criticize countries built on discriminatory policies, look at Australia or the United States. Look at Belgium or Portugal and what they did in Africa... it's way, way worse than anything horrible Israel has done.

What's also not okay is, if someone is discussing anti-Semitism (more accurately, Jew-hatred) and then someone else goes on a big spiel about how horrible Israel is... THAT is Jew hatred. I have no problem with someone discussing how horrible Israel's policies are but NOT within the context of discussing larger Jew hatred around the world. You want to discuss what an asshole Sheldon Adelson is... please do. But don't say "the Jews are doing this or that and own this or that" because THIS Jew doesn't. And if you can't understand the difference therein, then you probably ARE a Jew hater.

PalacinkyPDX Level 8 Feb 11, 2019
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4

I'm not specifically Anti-Israel... I am,however, anti-oppression... I am critical of Israel for the same reasons I'm critical of Northern Ireland.

Oppression is inhumane no matter who carries it out.

JimSherlock1008 Level 4 Feb 11, 2019
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6

It’s a great way to change the discussion from what ever the topic is back to you. Now you are on the defensive. You have to defend yourself.

Jk1960 Level 5 Feb 11, 2019
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Perfect explanation. It's avoid and deflect tactic.

4

This question has gotten me in trouble because too many don't understand the difference between Anti-Semite and Anti-Zionist. I also looked up the difference between Liberal and Progressive and one is that the progressives aren't afraid of calling out groups for their bad behavior (because they themselves will be branded) and Liberals are afraid because of the possible negative connotations. In other words, to me, Liberals are chicken.

JackPedigo Level 8 Feb 11, 2019
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4

It’s a knee jerk response just as saying that you’re against HRC immediately makes you a sexist.

Israel through Netanyahu has decided that they should consume all of the Palestinian territory as well as southern Lebanon and Syria.

I’ve been saying for the longest time now that they and Saudi Arabia have been working towards eliminating all of the Shiite leaders within the region.

And ironically while watching a documentary on the Mossad one of their former directors confirmed it.
If not checked they will enslave as much of the Middle East through economic theft and religious oppression via sharia and Wahhabism.

So if anyone throws that anti-Semitic BS just ask them to explain why is Israel perpetuating a systematic genocide of the Palestinians.
Just saying that of all the people in the world that should rebuke that kind of behavior it should be them.

48thRonin Level 8 Feb 11, 2019
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6

Israel and Bibi deserve all the criticism anyone throws at them. It does not make one anti-Semite to point out the hypocrisy of Bibi!!!!!

Redheadedgammy Level 8 Feb 11, 2019
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8

Good question. I heard a new Dem Muslim rep be accused of anti-Semitism. She is a Semite. She is anti-Zionist as I, a cultural Jew am. I am vs the current actions of Israel because they are anti-humane. I run the Jewish Culture Group. Some of us are anti-Zionist. The two should not be confused.

sassygirl3869 Level 9 Feb 11, 2019
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Oooh ya beat me to it. There’s a difference between being Zionist and just being a member of the congregation so to speak.

There are 2 issues as I see it:

1) those of us who aren’t big fans of Netanyahu because he’s a murderous wanker share our bed with people who deny the holocaust. That’s unfortunate because it facilitates the next point;

2) Murderous wankers like Netanyahu deliberately conflate criticism of him and his Governments’ murderous wankery with Jew hatred. And this deliberate conflation extends widely to all sorts of folks who want to benefit from the Orthodox jewish vote or find a stick to beat their political opponent. I’m looking at you Luciana Berger and Margaret Hodge.

It doesn’t help that every time any Jewish issue comes up there are a load of us who do that what-about-the-Palestinians thing. That’s somewhat unnuanced and leads to many otherwise great co-travellers on the Palestinian rights issue, from getting jaded and wondering if there might be a bit of truth in point 2 above.

So it’s not Jew hatred (I hate the term anti-Semitic: it’s so imprecise) to care about the Palestinians. It is perhaps helpful if those who do so, understand the context of the responses they may get and how that can be used by the cynical or how it may feel by the weary every day also-not-keen on Netenyahu the murderer Jew who carries a fair amount on their shoulders here

Edited

@OwlInASack Well said!

3

It is perfectly legitimate to criticize a nation state and it is a common tactic to accuse a critic of Israel of being anti-semitic. On the other hand there are also a lot of anti-semites that can't bare that "the jews" get to have a state on their own and see it for the cause to all the evil in the world. I think it's hard not to get lumped in with the racists scum. On a private level I don't think it is such a big issue but for a politician it can mean that you loose a lot of donors. Not everybody will research if you really were an anti-semite and will just belief an accusation (another argument to get big money out of government).

Dietl Level 7 Feb 11, 2019
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5

Apparently the same way you can't criticize any action Israel takes without being against its entire existence... at least according to the country's most vociferous defenders.

It's the same syndrome that leads to "America- Love It or Leave It" bumper stickers. Those with a mature understanding realize that it's quite possible to support a nation and at the same time, criticize the actions that nation takes. We who love America (and Israel) want the nation to not only do well, but to do good.

Paul4747 Level 7 Feb 11, 2019
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5

Same way as being pro people economic and personal rights makes you a flaming socialist communist. All of which, we know, is bollocks and a confusion of language perpetrated in order to push other people's agenda.

Beowulfsfriend Level 8 Feb 11, 2019
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Why you commie pinko. smile009.gif

4

Good point. The definition of antisemitism appears to have changed over the years and now includes criticism of the state of Israel. Of course Trump has made things even worse by moving the US embassy to Jerusalem

Moravian Level 6 Feb 11, 2019
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4

I have been asking that question for decades!

Sticks48 Level 8 Feb 11, 2019
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3

I have been asking this question on this site for months.

Gooniesnvrdie Level 7 Feb 11, 2019
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Most on this site are reasonable and understand. Off site, the folks are brain washed, if not the revolution would have started years ago.

3

I think the age of the country (nationalism?) has a lot to do with it. Wasn't Israel founded in 1945 or so? I found the same sense of religion/culture/nation as all merged into one while in Saudi Arabia. So, by attacking one part, it's perceived as attacking, or for that matter, supporting the merged entity. My opinion...

bigpawbullets Level 8 Feb 11, 2019
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I do not know much history, but wasn’t it 1967?

@MissKathleen
I was thinking it took place right after WWII. But I was guessing.

@MissKathleen
May 14th, 1948.

@bigpawbullets I guess 1967 was when the war was settled.

@MissKathleen Well, when that war was settled. There were wars in: 1948 (independence), 1956 (Suez crisis), 1967 (Six Day War, the one you're thinking of), and 1973 (Yom Kippur war). The Camp David Accords in the late 70's ended formal hostilities, but there have been low-burning conflicts since then, with sporadic high-burn points such as Israel's invasion of Lebanon in 1981.

@Elganned yes, you are right, of course. Warring tribes...been going on for centuries. Why we are involved with any of them escapes me.

@MissKathleen
Israel has been at war almost constantly.

War of Independence (1947-1949)
The Sinai Campaign (1956)
The Six-Day War (June 1967)
The War of Attrition (1968-70)
The Yom Kippur War (October 1973)
The Lebanon War (1982)
The Gulf War (1991)
The Second Lebanon War (2006)

This is not to mention the basically continuous low-level terrorist attacks on military and, more often, civilian targets both inside Israel proper and in the territories, as well as against Jews abroad.

While I condemn Israeli methods of suppressing Palestinian civilians and annexing more and more territory, and argue that this is a primary cause in keeping their anger stoked and the conflict ongoing, it's hard not to have some sympathy with the siege mentality of people who never know when the next suicide bomb might go off.

And it's not really the politics that's the problem. It's religion that poisons the whole region. Israel's hardliners insist that "God" deeded them the whole of historic Israel, and they have a duty to annex the entire map. Palestinians and other Muslims insist that they have the most recent revelation, and Allah commands them to convert the infidel dogs, or at least to rule over them. Forget about religion and the whole mess is susceptible to a political settlement. We can have a two-state solution tomorrow.

@Paul4747 further proof of the negative effect of religion on society.

@MissKathleen As if we need more.

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