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Here’s my conundrum about Easter and Passover.

First we are told that Bible is the inerrant word of god and that God is perfect. Next we are told that the law that god created is perfect and that God has always been perfect and never changes. Ok but here’s where the confusion starts.

If you are making the argument that God is perfect and never changes and the law is perfect then You have to take every word in Genesis as the absolute truth and it shouldn’t be altered.

This is where the conundrum of Jesus comes in. Doesn’t the mere story of Jesus dispute the Old Testament. If god was perfect then everything from the beginning should be perfect to and there shouldn’t be a need to change salvation and for a savior to come to saw us from the dreadful law. Isn’t the mere fact that Jesus came to abolish the law proof that the law is not perfect and therefore the god who created it is not perfect either because he had to have a do over with Jesus. Just some of my thoughts on this I wanted to share.

abyers1970 7 Apr 7
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1

It's all just bovine 💩, no problem. Spring has started in the northern hemisphere, on with the fertility festivals. 🎉🎇🌞

8

Couldn't you watch something on Netflix instead of trying to make sense of nonsense???????

7

I was never raised or taught that the bible was inerrant, or that god was perfect, so i am at a loss to try and help you reconcile those two obviously false statements. I was taught to question everything. That doesn't mean that I have to deny anything or accept anything. I don't have to buy into any of the religious crap.
On another note, to explain easter, Jesus died late on Friday afternoon, Saturday was the sabbath, On Sunday before dawn he supposedly rose. So he gave up a short weekend. Not a huge sacrifice.

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Biblical "scholars" vary from the evangelicals who don't even understand through the Catholics who jave a more pragmatic approach, now - often to the academics that are more secular. The new testament replaced and overrides the old, thus it is ok to eat pork and other shit and one is supposed to love his neighbor, but hypocrites just hate so they hate gays and read from Leviticus while enjoying barbeque. From a secular stand point the bibly was put together and codified in the 300's. It is mostly the evangelicals who purport the myth of infallibility of the new testament. They are no different from muslims who say the same about the koran, which ironically is still in its original language, albeit, it, too, has been found to have alterations over time and was mostly set by the Ottomans - there really were verses removed that were called the same as Rusdies' book The Satanic Verses.

One point to understand is I was an evangelical Christian for 30 years and I’m slowly going thru the reprogramming. It’s kind of a therapy for me to post stuff like this on here. Most people are supportive. I’ll be going they my day and something will just hit me and I like to post on here to express things. I have nowhere else to do it.

@abyers1970 I was also a believer for about thirty years and got my first college degree from a Lutheran college where I took 5 of the religion classes. Those classes caused me to change from a literal interpreter to a liberal believer. Yet, because of many things I never let fellow believers know that I did that at that time.

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If everybody who finds a contradiction in Christian thinking starts a thread on it, we are going to be here for a very long time.

You're right. And I think many of us would like to be familiar with every contradiction.

@dare2dream why?

@dare2dream Not really!

@kiramea Speaking just for myself now, I'm interested in how to discern fake news and how to determine what is truth. I'm interested in how I can think correctly and avoid false logic. I want to learn to spot errrors in logic and false assumptions. I'm interested in debate. Hearing religious and political claims gets me thinking and thinking critically.

@dare2dream Well, that's you and not "many of us". There is a big difference between the two.

Most (if not all) of the people here have no desire to debate religion as they already know it's bullshit and full of contradictions.

As I said earlier, the Bible is so full of contradictions that I'm surprised anyone still believes it. The first chapter of Genesis (for instance) tells of two creation stories and "the sons of God and daughters of man (why distinguish the two?). Also, it talks of the people in the land of Nod. If God created everything, and Adam/Eve and their children were the only people on earth, then who populated the land of Nod?

@kiramea If you don't want to discuse the falacies of religion then keep scrolling.

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So you're saying that you're in a conundrum over a whole bunch of fantasy ? Have at it ...

3

If you read Genesis, you will note that there are flaws to the supposed mighty one. I had the pleasure to analyze that book for a college paper. Based on my conclusion, daddyo was a sick a twisted kind of guy. I mean seriously! He creates two people who are like Ken and Barbie without clothes and who are technically his kids. He tells them that they he has provided everything for them, but he warns them of the tree of knowledge. That is like a dad of today telling his kids to stay stupid because he wants to keep his control over them. Not for anything, to bring the tree of knowledge to their attention and tell them not to touch it under the penalty of death, not only was a lie, but it was like putting a big ol' "Oh please touch me!" sign on it. He never told them WHY they couldn't touch it. He wasn't going to say I want y'all to be stupid, right? Anyway, like any other young'n being told don't touch, the curious female ventures off and gets the apple and she and her brother partake in bites. They then find themselves naked. So, they didn't die and the fruit opened their eyes to reality. Dad gets real mad that he can't keep them as pets any longer and so he kicks them out of the garden. They now have to fend for themselves and Barbie was cursed with the pain of childbearing. Two of her boys were were getting on with their gramps and one of them noticed that gramps was showing favor over his brother so in a fit of jealously, he killed his brother. Gramps was miffed, but he didn't kill Cane. Instead he marked him so no others would kill him. Others? Wait a second! What others? Did you see that? Were there multiple petri dish gardens? Do you see any perfection here? The old man couldn't handle his two grown kids nor his grand babies. Sounds to me like he was creating a big ol' dysfunctional mess. What do you think?

3

"God" was made up by bronze era goat farmers to explain the world they couldn't understand. They made it all up.

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Okay, a question here for @ abyers1970 and who so ever else wishes to offer up a reply/response.
@abyers1970 mentions this mythical Jesus, so here is my question, Jesus was, supposedly, born to be sacrificed to God, who in all rationality and logic was his 'father' and himself as well, correct?
Ergo, Jesus is God incarnate, therefore being that God is Eternal and indestructible, then Jesus too must be Eternal and Indestructible since he IS God incarnate, Correct?
So, being Eternal and Incarnate, the sacrifice of Jesus was/is a moot point since being Eternal and Indestructible Jesus could NOT die or be destroyed by sacrifice since he knew all along that he would be resurrected, i.e. brought back to life.
Ergo, this so-called self sacrifice was little more than a lie wrapped in worthless act of self-serving aggrandizement, was it not?

3

At midnight, everything Cinderella was given by her fairy godmother was changed back to its normal form. Her carriage went back to a pumpkin, her fancy dress changed back into her normal clothes, her horses became mice again, all of it was changed back to normal. Except one thing: her glass slipper. The one that fell off her foot at the ball was still a glass slipper after midnight. Why? Why did everything else change except that one thing? It's a contradiction!

3

The Bible being the inerrant, inspired word of God...then there must have been/are unicorns inasmuch as they are mentioned five times in the Bible. Just where those unicorns have gone, I wonder.
It is notable to me that when I tell Christians about the unicorns in the Bible, inevitably they will say that the "unicorns" mentioned in the Bible were likely rhinoceroses. To which I say: Can not be...the Bible is inerrant.

As the matronly church lady said in regard to modern versions of the Bible: "If the King James Version of the Bible was good enough for Jesus, it is good enough for me."

The answer to the question “Are there unicorns in the Bible?” is yes, but no one knows for sure what the Biblical unicorn really looked like. Most scholars agree the unicorns mentioned in the Bible were either a type of wild ox – as the Hebrew name suggests – or a one-horned rhinoceros as the Greek suggests. Nearly everyone agrees that the Biblical unicorn is unlikely to match our image of the mythical unicorn.[unicornsrule.com]

The real unicorn that biblical text is refering to would most likely be the REAL and existing: Indian rhinoceros (Rhinoceros unicornis), also called the greater one-horned rhinoceros and great Indian rhinoceros, is a rhinoceros species native to the Indian subcontinent. It is listed as Vulnerable on the IUCN Red List, as populations are fragmented and restricted to less than 20,000 km2 (7,700 sq mi). Moreover, the extent and quality of the rhino's most important habitat, alluvial grassland and riverine forest, is considered to be in decline due to human and livestock encroachment. As of 2008, a total of 2,575 mature individuals were estimated to live in the wild.[1]

The Indian rhinoceros once ranged throughout the entire stretch of the Indo-Gangetic Plain, but excessive hunting and agricultural development reduced its range drastically to 11 sites in northern India and southern Nepal. In the early 1990s, between 1,870 and 1,895 rhinos were estimated to have been alive.[2]
[en.wikipedia.org]

Mormons have to do the unicorns/rhinoceroses switch-a-roo thing a lot with the Book of Mormon and their stories of their heroes riding horses into battles. Of course, no modern domesticated horses existed in the Americans during the time period the stories took place. One of the horse alternatives were deer or elk. Another which has plenty of former Mormons chuckling were tapirs. Tapirs are described as pig shaped herbavores that stand just over 3 feet at the shoulder (see the photo).

Besides the comical aspect of suggesting that a war horse was in fact a 3 foot creature that has never been domesticated is the issue that apparently God in his inspired translations of the Book of Mormon can't tell the difference between a horse and a tapir; or worse that God can't be trusted to say what He means - that God's word can't be trusted. The same would be true for the unicorns/rhinoceroses switch in the Bible. God can't differentiate between these two creatures to make His inerrant script perfect and understandable? Or He can't be trusted to tell us the truth that a unicorn is a unicorn and not a rhinoceros. The other alternative is that fallible men wrote the Bible or Book of Mormon. Either way, the inerrancy of the books are shown to be false invalidating the premise that they can be trusted as what they are represented to be.

@RussRAB Great pic!

@Word If the Unicorns mentioned in the Bible were actually the Asian Rhinoceros, then the King James Bible is NOT inerrant ...it would then by definition contain a translation error.

3

maybe a day of rememberance for the victims of religion

3

Jesus never existed so it's irrelevant.

3

The confusion started when you mention the inerrant word of god, it's an agnostic and atheist site. Wtf is this horse shit doing here? There was never a Jesus in the historic record of the Romans and they were pretty good record keepers and the Torah is clear that Jehovah was a small time storm god of the mountains, at best. Move along, move along, nothing new to see here.

3

You only get to that conundrum by long jumping over several others ... like why did "God's children" have to mark their doors on pass over? Didn't he know who they are?

2

Wait. You're NOT supposed to think. Just kneel, pray, and put money in the plate.

Yes: "Don't pray in my laboratory and I won't think in your church.".

2

Then there's that whole New Testament thing....had to fix perfection I guess?

twill Level 7 Apr 8, 2020
2

The whole story of god was an invention of man....why bother torturing the brain on any of the conundrums and contradictions in either the OT or the NT? The bible stories are relatively modern in the timeframe of the age of man’s existence, why do you think it took god so long to reveal himself and inspire the bible to be written? There is a better conundrum to pose.

2

How can we believe the Bible is inerrant when it tells the same stories but with different details? One version of Noah's story says animals were admitted 2 by 2, another that clean animals had 7 admitted. The 4 Gospels are also a good example. Each one contains some similar elements, but each one also contains details the others don't or that contradict one another. So the initial premise of biblical inerrancy is false and makes the rest of the discussion moot.

2

they retconned that in john. now jesus was part of the plan the whole time, but it's probably still eve's fault.

#mysteriousways

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The Bible is full of contradictions. Any free thinking person would know that.

2

None of it is true. It's all myth.
There is no conundrum.
The bible is fiction.

2

perfection? Hmmm. In the first book of the bible, pops the first error up out of the woodwork. Earth is said to be the centre of the universe, and all planets revolve around it. That's what the folk of that time already believed, so it appeared in the 'holy' scriptures, written by God, they say. So lame. Science has exposed that lie.

1

How is it that this perfect creator created so much imperfection that he had to destroy the world once?

Yes. Thats pretty much my whole point

@abyers1970 Just agreeing in my own roundabout way.

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[meta-religion.com]
Please read, you will love it!

Properly studied, comparative religion turns every theist into an atheist.

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