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Telling women not to do things because "it's not safe" is a big pet peeve of mine. I am aware that there are real dangers out in the world for men AND women but this attitude smacks of benevolent paternalism.

I spent most of my high school career slipping out of my window and wandering my hometown(a midsize town in florida)armed with nothing more than a sketchbook and a handful of pencils. The scariest thing that ever happened to me on these jaunts was being chased by a flying cockroach.

I have walked, driven and biked through even the"scariest" parts of town alone and common sense and a little awareness was all it ever took to keep me safe.

I HATE that women are told not to go out on their own, not to go certain places or be about at certain times. Comparing my experiences with all the warnings I've heard over the years has convinced me that it's just one more form of control men exert over women.

I know SO many women who say things like "I'd love to do "blank" but I'm scared to do it by myself". Why do they think this way? Because they've heard this alarmist trope their entire lives. To go out alone, or after dark or to the wrong places is to invite rape or violence. It fosters this horrible idea about the nature of most people and it clips womens wings and their ability to feel like autonomous adults.

Please, for Pete's sake stop telling women they can't do things because it's dangerous because they are women. If you wouldn't caution your son against the same behaviour don't lay that weight on your daughters. Can we please let women be people and stop acting like they're children or invalids simply because they're female?

OpposingOpposum 9 Apr 24
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51 comments

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1

I normally ready each and every comment and the replies in a thread. The combativeness in this thread raised my heart rate, so I'm leaving it. I just want to say, I don't think it's necessary to be so god damned harsh with each other!!!

1

I've always done what I wanted, but I also stay aware of my surroundings and stay away from people and vehicles that I perceive may be a threat. Some nights I feel tired and might not walk to town in the dark as I couldn't be bothered dealing with confrontation, but 9/10 times that wouldn't be an issue, I'd deal with it if it happened.
I've nearly been adbucted by a gang before and did need my friends' help that night, but most actual attempts to attack or attacks have been by people known to me and so I couldn't really have pre-empted them.
I was lucky in that I did judo at a young age and then did a bit of mixed martial arts in my teens, including eskrima and then when there was a serial attacker in my city a few years ago I got to do a great 2 day session with a fantastic trainer of international standing.
I see your point of view, but everyone had their own comfort zone and some places are less safe than others, not everyone is as gung ho as us 😉

And yet many women regret that and are troubled that they feel they can't do these things. Being aware of your surroundings and having some self defense know how is huge. Sadly most women don't seek these options out until after they're victimised. If we treated girls as we do boys, teqching them self defense as part of the parenting process,it opens their worlds up.

@Blindbird Teaching them self respect is a biggy too and helps towards avoiding bad situations. I can't say my parents had anything to do with it, but other people made me stronger.

1

I believe a woman can do do anything she sets her mind to. My wife is an upper bi-lateral amptee from birth and she can nearly do anything she wants. It helps that she's a "mulie" as in stubborn.
Our youngest daughter works for a large corporation. She also is head of a cattle orgainazation and raises cattle. She is very independent and rescourceful. Like her dad, a anti-religionist. She is also a strong supporter of gun rights.
So you see that I am surrounded with strong women.

2

I truly believe that the fear that we perpetuate in any form....Shit, just turn on the news.....has caused the human race worldwide to live a backwards life where we are afraid of life itself. Afraid to try something new, afraid to meet someone new, afraid to be someone new.
It is unfortunate that No Doubts song I’m Just A Girl is so accurate but the ultimate enemy that we need to recognize is fear in general.

1

My son is 6”3 and weighs 250 lbs. My daughter is 5’1 and weighs under 100 lbs. It makes perfect common sense that I would caution my daughter from walking around alone late at night. I’m not saying that something couldn’t happen to my son but I don’t think anyone is going to abduct him, at least not as easily as they could my daughter.

It's common sense and a respect for the laws of physics.

2

Hey, ya know what? You all win. I'm just going to stay in my house and never come out again. You're all entirely correct. The world is Far too terrifying for any woman to live in. Being online is scary too so yea. Bye.

Excellent answer....specially dedicated to those who vest their very own fears on -specially- their kids.

1

Rather than couldn't I'd say shouldn't, and yes I'm a woman. A woman who has been raped going out with only a knife for protection. I don't believe that makes me any less aware than you. Maybe you're small town kept you "safe"

That's entirely possible. It's also possible people just arent as bad as we've been led to believe.

@Blindbird my dear you didn't grow up howI did then...molestation, that I can remember, started at age 3. It went on for more than a decade with rapes in between. Been raped as an adult 3 separate times. The last a few months ago. In my book most people will do whatever they can if getting caught isn't on the table.

@ashortbeauty Please get Mace instead of a knife. A knife unless you've been well trained - can be turned against you.

@ashortbeauty. I was molested as a child, as were a large number of my cousins. I have been raped as an adult. I know how awful people can be but I also know that MOST people are not that awful. I know that my behaviour didn't bring about any of the abuse that I endured. The actions were the choice of my attackers and while they may have loved to lay blame at my feet. Its just not true. The things women do do not CAUSE us to be raped.

@Blindbird I agree we didn't cause it. I just disagree that most people are inherently nice

2

I think advising someone of the dangers of doing certain things is obviously fine, so I don't understand your objection.

KenG Level 6 Apr 24, 2018

@DuchessNyx thank you. I'm very begining to suspect the blindness and unwillingness to hear are willful.

@DuchessNyx Maybe you’re being overly sensitive. We (as men) are advised to do and not to do certain things. Don’t hang around dodgy areas showing off cash. Don’t mess with gangs. Don’t pick fights with idiots. And literally hundreds of other things. I don’t presume this to be sexist. Why do you?

@KenG because on TOP of those things we're also told not to do very common and neccesary things like😀ress a certain way, walk down the street, talk to strangers, be a prude, be a slut, be a bitch, be fat, be skinny, be black the list goes on and on and on of things women MUST not do if they don't want to be victims.

And none of it works anyway. Nuns and old women and small children,plain girls and fat girls, girls wearing skirts or pants make up or no make up all end up being raped just the same. All of these things we're told not to do and options we're forbidden from taking for safeties sake DON'T ACTUALLY OFFER any guarantee of security. The only things that prevent rape are a lack of rapists and intended victims that can successfully fight back.

@DuchessNyx I read her point of view and disagreed. I think I’m still allowed to even in these times. ???

@DuchessNyx Consider this. Would you NOT advise your daughter to walk home, late at night, alone, after being to a party, possibly a bit drunk, and to take a short-cut down a deserted, virtually unlit, path beside a canal or through a wood? Common sense says you would tend to advise daughters about this type of risk more than sons.

@DuchessNyx My parents cautioned my two sisters - myself and my brother equally about dangers. This in the 1970's!

@Blindbird Most crimes are about anger.
Particularly rape!

All that stuff about what to do and not to do for women's behavior is just ridiculous (and has been proven so wrong as you said because it has nothing to do with age range or dress or anything of that kind) and acting like we can predict that is just not the way to raise healthy kids.

I'll tell you my objection: I took as an offense when a person told me "Don't teach in NYC; is dangerous." / or when another said to me "Don't go to that shopping area after dark.".....These advise imply that I am a moron and that I am not aware of my surroundings. Please, people who attempt to vest their fears on others are toxic.

2

Please don’t be offended by anyone’s concern for you. In the last two years or so I have seen a significant sway in people and their absolute disregard for for anyone that isn’t them. We are currently living in a culture where rape, murder and assault are not looked at as the horrific crimes they are but more of, well they should have had a gun and that wouldn’t have happened. It’s insane, but it’s not disrespect.

Honest concern isn't offensive. Concern trolling and curtailing of my (and other womens)lifes options IS.

@Blindbird who, exactly, is "curtailing" your activities? And concern is a lovely thing for others to show to you! Maybe you should read/watch "Looking for Mr. Goodbar", and see yourself? You seem intent on proving something, I am not sure what.....

8

Wait....if men weren’t around to tell you what to do....you mean to say....you’d be...(gasp)...FINE???

?

I know, it's shocking.

The people in my life who advised me how to be safe have ALL been women!

@AnneWimsey you know. We aren't friends and I REALLY don't care for your fear mongering.

1

Compare the number of women's bodies found raped and murdered to the number of men's bodies found murdered. A woman alone is often seen by human predators as a target of opportunity whereas men usually are not. The fact that have so far escaped the possible result of your risky behavior seems to have emboldened you. You seem to have missed that part of reality.

2

I’m male and still told not to do things because it’s unsafe—including traveling alone.

I don’t take it as a blow to my masculinity or my ego.

Statistics prove some things are more dangerous than others, and also prove that in sexual assault women are much more likely to be victims.

These are simply facts.

[rainn.org]

1

So in other words we shouldn't even suggest that a woman (or man for that matter) be careful or responsible? That's good to know. I'll be sure to blame the murderer or rapist, because I never want to even suggest that it could have been prevented in the first place. That would be blaming the victim and we can't have that, now can we.

1

As a gun-carrying female...I see the dangers of life in front of me everyday living on the road.

Men have a natural tendency to protect their physically weaker counterpart, so you have to understand that.

The average woman cannot beat up a man...sorry.

This ain't Sharia law...it's just men wanting to protect us, is all...and I love it!

Go, Men!!???

Actually the average woman CAN beat up the average man. All it takes is some general self defense. But you want to be a helpless little woman go right ahead. (P.s. a woman armed with a gun is 46 times more likely to be shot by their partner)

Uh there is no "natural tendancy to protect weaker counterparts". The popularity of domestic violence alone tells us That's untrue.

My husband and my brothers will fyck anybody up over me...
Bad people are everywhere, men and women.
But here's facts..
Can a random biological woman come and beat up any random man?...no.

Because men have an external strength that women cannot naturally possess.

Can a biological man give birth? No

Because women have an internal strength than men do not naturally possess.

Instead of bickering about our differences, why not celebrate that we need eachother to survive?

1

My ex was fond of a frozen fish called tilapia. She would attack these things with a sharp knife even when she had had a drink or 3. The way she cut into them looked like an accident just waiting to happen, knife going towards hand. It took a while but I learnt to just leave her to it. If and when we had to go to A&E I would say " I told you so " but it never happened. I do not think of this as sexist as I have cautioned guys as well when they were doing dumb things.

And had she been a man , I suspect you would have said the same. Those are not the kinds of warnings I'm addressing here. I'm all for common sense and reasonable safety measures, for everyone.

4

I'm going to make one more comment one here then I'm done( the appearance of threats in the comments tells me it's time to go). My whole life I've heard the litany of things women shouldn't do because it might give men ideas.

Being the rebellious teen I was, I did most of them to see what would happen. Much to my surprise, the people I'd been told to fear did me no harm. I found that I could do nearly anything my male cousins did and wonder of wonders, I was neither raped nor murdered.

Cut to the new century and a group of young friends doing the things I did openly and without expectation of harm. They have not been raped or murdered in higher numbers than the women who lived cloistered lives either. It really brought home the fact that it is not what women do, wear, say or look like that bring assaults upon them. It is the intent of the assaulter that makes these things happen. They will happen as long as assaulters exist and you won't avoid attacks even by refusing to take risks.

If the risk/benefit ratio stays the same whether you live the life you want or lurk in your home paralyzed with fear. Why not live? Furthermore why not live and speak out about the people who create your fear.

In my life the people who have harmed me in these ways have ALL been family members or partners. Staying home wouldn't have saved me, though leaving may have.

The best defense against a world that can indeed be dangerous is a healthy survival instinct and the tools to defend yourself with. If you deny someone these things because you fear they're too fragile to weild them, you WILL doom those people to being victims. You can't be with someone always.

Raise strong women. Tell men who victimise women that their behaviour is unnaceptable, report them, support your friends. ✌

Yes THIS!

4

I never hike alone. Men with guns on horses sexually harassed and terrified me, both times I hiked alone. "Hey, pretty lady! Where are you spending the night? We'll join you!"

It's important to use good judgment for your own safety. I do not do technical rock and ice climbing because it's too dangerous. Injuries and deaths from scaling mountains are horrific. The equipment is too heavy.

I'm not willing to hang my life from a piton I just tapped into a crack.

Same goes for a man on both counts.

3

I see the gender difference you are speaking of here. Speaking for both genders my remarks today is that many things are not safe. If I am to believe the worldwide news (not Trump's fake news) you might get killed if you simply go shopping or walk on a sidewalk.

6

Here is an interesting statistic from Australia, females over 15 are more likely to be physically assaulted in their own home than anywhere else with over 50% of such assaults occurring at home, next comes where they work or study, after that we've got someone else's home, then we have other public places and bringing up the rear is on the street. So why are we telling women not to go out at night alone, clearly staying at home is far more dangerous.
A woman is more likely to be assaulted by their partner than a stranger. Less than 30% of assaults on women are by strangers. So why are women huddled in their oh so safe homes because they are afraid of going out by themselves?

Kimba Level 7 Apr 24, 2018

The demographic of people most likely to be victims of assault is young men between 18 and 25

@273kelvin that sounds like 'male on male,' assault...with high chance of alcohol involved.

@Freedompath And?

@Freedompath Whats your point? Its still a very real danger. People arent locking up their sons for fear they may be harmed.

@273kelvin my mind just went to the most likely reason for males between those ages to be assaulted! My past history with boys and friends of boys!

@Freedompath Just because alcohol is involved, the victim may know or have said something to their attacker. Does not mean that the victims were culpable.

@273kelvin that is one scenario and another is males between those ages are at a higher risk for violence. But, this does not cover all situations! And, violence is never acceptable! I was just remembering from years past and observations now. I believe my mind wondered back over other aspects of our society and may have confused things here. Please except my apology.

@Freedompath No worries

8

This thread is scarier than anything I face in real life. I do everything by myself and I can't say it ever occurs to me to change what I do based on my sex. If I want to go to a concert, I go. By myself. If I want to go for a hike, I go. By myself. I am a competent adult that does not need a minder.
I have brought up my children to respect people, regardless of their sex. And to take adequate precautions, regardless of their sex. And now my children are competent people that do not need minders. In fact, my daughter drove across the county and is living (by herself) in a place she had never visited, running a political campaign. Sure, bad things can happen - that is always true for EVERYONE. But living your life afraid of doing things? Nah, absolutely not. You only live once!

Well said.

@Blindbir why do you act/attack women who take reasonable precautions, assume they must be craven, huddling indoors (your words). How do you figure they are not out in the world, running, runing programs, traveing, etc etc alone? Just being smart about where they park.....How is that not At Least as offensive as what you claim othe rs are saying?

1

Sadly, real danger exists for lone women! Yes it angers me too, but i have no desire to end up as an episode on CSI either. Dealing with reality is an important part of growing older with happy memories predominating.

Yes and dealing with reality is for everyone. Women should not live in clouds of fear afraid to do the things they'd like because it "might draw the wrong sort of attention".

This is something I really love about millenials. So many of them have been raised fearless. They're not scared to do the same things their brothers and friends do and lo and behold they're enjoying their lives, doing what makes them happy and staying safe all at the same time.

@Blindbird I travel alone in a small RV, park & sleep wherever I am tired (that the cops won't roust me). You act like women who take common sense precautions are craven, "huddling indoors", etc. That is At Least as offensive ss what you claim men do!

7

It's just the same ol' victim blaming. "If she hadn't dressed like that/gone there/done that, she wouldn't have gotten hurt." Some reasonable advice is one thing, but when you start shifting responsibility for wrongs onto the victim instead of the responsible party, it crosses into abuse. I hate victim blaming...

1

I watch Discovery ID regularly. As such I'm always worried about the ladies in my life.

A perfect example of letting sensationalist media unduly color your perception of the world.

@Blindbird lol. Ok. Tell that to the thousands of homicide detectives who are gainfully employed. Your free to be as careless as you wish. Hope life continues to be on your side as you take unnecessary risks with it.

But you're probably right... The 11 years I spent in combat zones and the 6 years I spent as a homicide detectives on a police force have probably "unduly colored" my perception of the world.

7

I'm one of those people who ask why it's so dangerous for women. And when I'm told about muggings and rapes and what not done by,....men, I say, Well, doesn't it make more sense to tell boys and men to behave themselves and raise them to be decent human beings? And then people stop talking to me.

Right? It's just unreasonable to expect people with criminal tendencies to stop doing criminal shit. Instead we should all hide in our homes and never go anywhere unarmed or in groups smaller than ten. Also don't dress slutty that's just asking for it.

4

Totally true ... people need to stop making excuses for cavemen and creating a false bubble, essentially enabling patriachal contructs that hold females back.

Never a been issue in my cirlces but I know in the wider world it's massive.

In a sense it's enabling isn't it ... "Stand by me ladies, let me protect you from me" :/ 😮 🙂

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